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1 Posted 30/06/2021 at 14:57:55
The new stadium should be built on a Pier and not on a historic dock. A Variety Theatre is what we have become. The irony will be if Kenwright is really pissed off about Benitez's appointment.
2 Posted 30/06/2021 at 15:00:04
Exactly, Lyndon – as you say, had Brendan Rogers been appointed as manager, it wouldn't have resulted in all this furore and the only difference is one throwaway, post-match comment from before some younger fans were born. The man wouldn't have been my first choice, but he's a good manager and he's going to be managing Everton, so he gets my support.
3 Posted 30/06/2021 at 15:08:26
1 min: Im like nah not for me, recent record isnt what you would call great.
Next min: Im like but he must really think he can build & win something. As he certainly wont be doing it for the money. Plus I imagine his Ego would love the boost of bringing us back success.
At the end of the day, I just want a successful Everton. If Rafa can bring us those days again. Then Im behind him 100%., Plus if he did turn us around I can think of nothing better than him holding a Trophy saying “once Everton has touched you, nothing will be the same”.
4 Posted 30/06/2021 at 15:33:18
This feels like an Usmanov/Moshiri appointment. Not exactly panic, but with a desire to get someone in place before pre-season preparations begin. As Lyndon says, it's such a wrong choice in every way, it might just work.
8 Posted 30/06/2021 at 15:39:56
9 Posted 30/06/2021 at 15:42:13
The deal's done now, so everyone needs to be positive and get behind the team.
10 Posted 30/06/2021 at 15:49:57
11 Posted 30/06/2021 at 15:51:54
All of you complaining will have to get on with it. Get behind 'El Gordo'... give him a chance and see how it turns out.
He's a professional in a sport that has a partisan crowd that sees him as a 'Red' – he's not... he's a manager for whatever team he is employed by.
Just be thankful it's not Big Sam again. It will be interesting to see where Big Dunc fits into the plot: assistant or gone? Nil Satis and always optimism.
12 Posted 30/06/2021 at 15:54:04
13 Posted 30/06/2021 at 15:57:52
14 Posted 30/06/2021 at 16:01:10
15 Posted 30/06/2021 at 16:04:39
Agree with Mike, a very thoughtful and insightful piece Lyndon.
16 Posted 30/06/2021 at 16:06:20
17 Posted 30/06/2021 at 16:17:49
Personally speaking I am over the "Benitez" conversation and am just waiting for the success or failure of this appointment to hit home not only on the pitch but also in the boardroom.
The only positive about this appointment I see is that Moshiri is sending out a message that it is HIS trainset.
18 Posted 30/06/2021 at 16:18:16
But Rafa or any, we need to get in some talent this window.
19 Posted 30/06/2021 at 16:25:12
20 Posted 30/06/2021 at 16:28:49
"Oh Rafa's our Gaffa" – to the tune used for that not so world class Belgian, Kevin Mirrallas.
I know – I'll get me coat.
21 Posted 30/06/2021 at 16:30:21
The serenity to accept those things I cannot change.
And the wisdom to know the difference”.
Hes here now, we need to get behind the new manager, give him a chance and see what he can do.
22 Posted 30/06/2021 at 16:48:42
Just watched his first interview, full of soundbites, cliches. Almost cringeworthy.
I think we have made a huge mistake. I hope he proves me wrong.
23 Posted 30/06/2021 at 16:59:31
And even when he was at the top of his game he was of that breed, popular in the noughties, like Mourinho, Allardyce and our own Moyes, who were even at their best, cautious and ultra defensive in their style.
Football has moved on Guardiola, Klopp et alia have transformed the attacking emphasis and such a style looks boring and old-fasioned, even if it has been espoused by Southgate.
Like Ancelotti, he seems like yesterday's man, appointed at the wrong time and with the added baggage of his past remarks and associations.
We may move up to ninth next season or slip to twelfth, but don't expect Europa League or dream of Champions' League.
24 Posted 30/06/2021 at 17:01:03
Until there is an explanation expect some muted support. Rafa may be honorable here but the common impression we all have is that he has the mettle to ride out any resistance which is both his appeal and risk. At some point either Moshiri or Alisher need to put their name on this without whispering it.
Get on record with an " I felt it was time for a drastic move and this man has qualities that can be useful in our turnaround" and maaaaaaaaaaaaaaybe if it is a good performance we can leave it at that.
Anything short of that and I think we all see some disrespect whether it is coming from fear or ahem ahem testicular fortitude.
Addendum: that statement from Moshiri about why Rafa is the one is some template Marie Antoinette shite. Dude does not understand as many of you might not. I honestly hope Rafa can solve the squad problem, it is our only hope here.
25 Posted 30/06/2021 at 17:02:44
Black Wednesday. The end result of all of this is that Moshiri must go.
26 Posted 30/06/2021 at 17:11:05
27 Posted 30/06/2021 at 17:15:45
28 Posted 30/06/2021 at 17:15:56
Of course, it is nothing of the sort. And that is not their style.
Remember, they have a Fans Forum to bounce this sort of thing off. Don't recall any of the names proferred at voting time being ones that I recognized as contributors here, but someone must know someone who could ask the question: "Where you lot even consulted?"
But I know the answer already.
29 Posted 30/06/2021 at 17:17:03
Personally, I was on the record suggesting Benitez one or two managerial appointments ago (so many in recent years that I have lost track!). Now my only reservation about Benitez is that he may no longer have the energy and drive we need. I'm not being ageist; he is younger than me.
I think the bigger issue is the one Paul the Esk addressed in his recent article about recruitment. The culture of the club is complacent and the performance of the Board is appalling. The change needs to start at the top and I am not sure who is in charge?
Moshiri, as the major shareholder, needs to clear out the old guard, including Kenwright and the hapless CEO. Benitez, or whoever else might have been appointed, can only do so much.
30 Posted 30/06/2021 at 17:22:01
He knows the city, knows what football means to the supporters, and whether or not he was a manager of them over there, he's good at his job and commands respect.
I've read about Rafa; he takes no shit and is not there to be anyone's mate.
Good luck to him and us.
31 Posted 30/06/2021 at 17:22:58
32 Posted 30/06/2021 at 17:26:24
May as well just throw in the fucken towel, a new low has been stooped to. (How many times have I thought that in the last 30 years?) I wouldn't mind if it was Klopp or Rodgers, at least they offer some hope having achieved something in the last 10 years.
Even if he hadn't managed that lot, I wouldn't want him. I think we are so used to eating Kenwright's shite that this just slides off the back
Mediocrity is the best we can hope for in the next 3 years and beyond into the future. I can't believe there are posters on here laying the boot into Dunc and welcoming this money grabbing has-been?
Dean, Ball, Kendall et al will be doing backflips in their graves... anyone know a good club I can follow?
Nothing short of a disgrace. It would not happen anywhere else. Make no mistake, we are an embarrasment.
33 Posted 30/06/2021 at 17:26:27
Imagine it, little Moshiri sitting at the table in a large restaurant, surrounded by oligarchs, parliamentarians, celebrities from all fields – all laughing at you and asking various questions such as:
"Hey Moshiri, how much did you pay for x or y?"
"Hey Moshiri, how many managers have you had since you bought the club?"
"Hey Moshiri, tell us that one again about your ambitions to win the Champions League."
"Hey Moshiri, I thought you were good with numbers?"
"Hey Moshiri, wait until your boss, erm… sorry… "friend" finds out how much you've lost for him!"
From that perspective, it's little wonder that he's decided upon the safest pair of hands he could find, whether we as Evertonians like it or not.
34 Posted 30/06/2021 at 17:27:31
Personally, I have no issue with the Liverpool connection as some of my favourite players came from Anfield: Sheedy, Morrissey etc. I just think he is wrong for the club on so many levels.
I don't think he will ever be accepted by a large section of the fan base. We have to wish him success for the club's sake but, if he doesn't hit the ground running, he is doomed and Moshiri's credibility will greatly undermined.
35 Posted 30/06/2021 at 18:16:20
stomach the sight of the Spaniard on the touch line,
I will give up my season ticket. On the other hand
at my age that will effectively be the end of my
Moshiri must have really burned the midnight oil to come up with a worse appointment than Sam, but we are at such a low ebb that the majority seem to
have rolled over and accepted it.
I cant believe the Man Utd fans would ever allow the man anywhere near their club.
36 Posted 30/06/2021 at 18:21:26
37 Posted 30/06/2021 at 18:53:41
38 Posted 30/06/2021 at 18:59:58
39 Posted 30/06/2021 at 19:01:00
Moyes - Noooooo! Negative football We're going backwards!
Nuno - Noooooo! Too negative 3-5-2 and what's he ever won!
Howe - Noooooo! Shitty Bournemouth manager, we'll get relegated!
Rafa (best CV out of every available manager on the market) - Noooooo! Called us a small club and won the Champions League with the RedShite!
Fucking grow up and get over yourselves. We've been an absolute bag of shite since Martinez's first season ended.
40 Posted 30/06/2021 at 19:05:27
But hey! Who are we to get in the way of some good business huh?
41 Posted 30/06/2021 at 19:12:10
I'm more annoyed with Moshiri and his lack of consideration for the fans.
From the get go it was obvious if you had any sort of interest in EFC that it was a resounding no from all sides regarding Benitez. Yet he has blindly and stubbornly proceeded with this appointment.
Shame on you Farhad Moshiri for backing all us fans into this unnecessary loveless marriage of convenience.
42 Posted 30/06/2021 at 19:23:35
The red background is hard to swallow but my main concern is that he does seem like yesterday's man and I wonder how Rafa will work with Brands.
Anyway, Rafa has shown some strength in walking into a Goodison bear pit so good luck to him. Let's hope he is the best man for the job… and so I'll shout COYB and get behind the manager.
43 Posted 30/06/2021 at 19:25:52
I remember Valencia when he managed them. They were a very competitive and relentless team. They did remind me of Everton's style of play at their best. If he could achieve a team performance like that at Everton, he really would be doing well.
44 Posted 30/06/2021 at 19:30:26
If Rafa Benitez is the man to get us there, then it's absolutely fine by me.
45 Posted 30/06/2021 at 19:32:39
46 Posted 30/06/2021 at 19:33:10
I dont get those who support him on his record though. “best CV out of all the available managers on the market” - does that actually mean anything? They showed his Prem record on Sky. His best was 2 points per game at Chelski and worst was 1.2 per game at Newcastle (1.9 with you know who). Hardly barnstorming performance, imho. If you cant average more than 2 points per game at two of the ‘biggest clubs then I dont think you are really doing that well.
What points per game return do people expect that will translate to with our current squad?
Id really much rather wed gone for someone whod never managed at a club our size or in the Premier and given them a chance to prove themselves, although Frank Lampard was my option for a real throw of the dice.
47 Posted 30/06/2021 at 19:45:58
Nominations for the post, early season, please !.
48 Posted 30/06/2021 at 20:05:44
Anyway, I think The Waiter will win us some silverware or at least a place in Europe. We just have to get rid of those who are not good enough and those who do not want to play for us. Then get the new ones in (a striker, two wingers, a playmaker, CB and a right back).
I think Rafa has been guaranteed of big signings, that's why he came here.
At Newcastle he did not have much but still did Ok.
If he (Brands) can get the right persons in it could be interesting.
49 Posted 30/06/2021 at 20:09:34
Off TW I did chat with friends and family saying ‘whoever the new manager is I will support them once at Everton and evaluate them then, with the caveat 'although Beneathus or Moyes returning would severely test that resolve!!!'
Now Benitez is confirmed Ill stick with my first clause above and support and evaluate him by his performance with Everton.
I can understand the rage some express at his appointment, even though I personally find it ridiculous that many are declaring ‘thats it! Im finished with the club! Good luck with that.
What I cant agree with are the claims by some that the board and Moshiri in particular has been maliciously incompetent in even inviting him to be interviewed for the post.
This is not a knee-jerk reaction, hurriedly appointing the first candidate in a flustered manner. In the first week after Carlos unexpected departure, the Echo reported the club received more than 40 applicants. The board itself would have drawn up a list of potential managers. Everton is an English PL club. It is a much desired position.
The club has been a model of discretion, maintaining total radio silence on the issue in the last 4 weeks until today. I personally dont disbelieve Moshiri when he said that the club did their due diligence, identified the qualities they wanted and interviewed several strong candidates, some of them multiple times.
The notion that the clubs guardians paid no heed to the possible consequences to the reactions of Blues should they appoint Rafa is a quaint but unrealistic one IMO. At least one voice on the board would certainly have drawn attention to it.
Knowing all that and having interviewed ‘several strong candidates multiple times, Moshiri still went with Rafa and the Spaniard accepted. Like Moshiri's serious injection of funds and his determination to push through BMD, in the final reckoning he has chosen possibly the hardest candidate to 'sell' to the fans. But he has done it anyway. That doesn't necessarily equate to arrogance or stupidity as some are labelling it, but rather ruthlessness and determination to achieve his long-term goals.
Moshiri choosing Benitez and Benitez accepting suggests to me that both have ironclad cojones.
Now as the manager of ‘them of course we mocked him and wanted him to fail. But personally, I have to say I was impressed by the previously mentioned cojones he displayed in his time at Chelsea. Booed and detested by his own supporters, he simply shut it all out and won a European title with them.
And that is a quality long associated with Rafa Benitez. The ability to shut out all the noise and be totally focussed on the task at hand, never more so than on match day. Its a good quality to have. And its going to be a necessary one.
His professionalism and attention to detail is self-evident. Whether he is the man we need is another question. But then, any and every appointment – be that manager or player – never, ever comes with gilt-edged guarantees.
What I do know is that in just over 5 years at the club Moshiri has had 6 different full-time managers and two in-house caretaker managers. The attrition rate is too high. We need stability and continuity and to start seeing some genuine progress on the core interest of most supporters, Evertons first team.
And I for one genuinely hope Rafa Benitez is the man who can deliver on that.
50 Posted 30/06/2021 at 20:23:24
51 Posted 30/06/2021 at 20:59:45
52 Posted 30/06/2021 at 21:26:48
As we know Moshiri has a significant financial stake in the clubs future prosperity. While ideally he would not have chosen to upset a large section of the fan base, he has decided that the best interests of the club, and his financial stake, will be served by appointing the best available candidate for the job. Any other appointment would have represented an even bigger gamble.
The suggestion the Fans Forum should be consulted about the appointment of the manager is arguably the most laughable contribution on here.
53 Posted 30/06/2021 at 21:36:10
I'm just trying to understand the incentives and motivation of various assignments in this ostensible solution to a football problem
54 Posted 30/06/2021 at 21:46:47
55 Posted 30/06/2021 at 21:48:47
Any Evertonian SHOULD care about his association with Liverpool, but I will just have really try to not let it cloud my vision until he has been given a fair chance such as one home game and one away.
56 Posted 30/06/2021 at 21:58:56
It's nowhere near as bad as calling somebody a fat "c--".
58 Posted 30/06/2021 at 22:09:19
59 Posted 30/06/2021 at 22:36:22
60 Posted 30/06/2021 at 22:48:56
61 Posted 30/06/2021 at 22:51:50
62 Posted 30/06/2021 at 22:55:24
63 Posted 30/06/2021 at 23:03:26
Aside from managing Liverpool, aside from his trophy winning record, Moshiri has decided that his vision for Everton is an experienced manager to take his plans forward.
Only time will tell, if Moshiri has made the correct choice. He and others are putting the money, but if this choice turns sour and the fans become alienated with the running of the club, their feet may do the talking.
64 Posted 30/06/2021 at 23:10:33
Whilst reading, I was thinking it was a great pity the EFC board couldnt have read a draft of this piece a week ago on the assumption Benitez was going to be appointed. It might have given them pause for thought as I very much doubt they have put so much consideration into their decision as you have put into this article!
Anyway it is what it is and we now have to pray that by some quirk of fate Moshiri has stumbled from the frying pan and avoided the fire.
65 Posted 30/06/2021 at 23:34:46
66 Posted 30/06/2021 at 23:41:21
The problem for me is that even if you completely remove his affiliation with the reds from the argument, this still feels like a step backwards for the club.
It feels like we're replacing Ancelotti with a similar yet far less successful version.
The biggest stick that was used to beat Carlo with was that the football was dull. And I think that is ultimately what worries me the most about Rafa.
It's not the small club jibe. It's not the Champions League win. It's not the Agent Rafa chants. It's the fact that I watch football to be entertained, and I can't stand the thought of a season of boring football.
I'm willing to give him a chance to prove me wrong, but as you have alluded to, it will get very toxic around here very quickly (even more than we've seen so far) if he doesn't do anything mightily impressive within the first handful of games.
67 Posted 30/06/2021 at 23:51:21
Some players will get well ruffled!
68 Posted 30/06/2021 at 23:57:21
We were not that far off our target last season and fell short at the final hurdle. All of our own making.
To a point Lyndon makes in the article and one called out many times by many of us. We need better players, regardless of who the manager is. The team was improved last summer; now we need to further improve and add depth to the squad.
69 Posted 30/06/2021 at 00:21:23
70 Posted 01/07/2021 at 02:15:37
If you look at the managers we have had in the last 5 years, they now manage Barcelona, Real Madrid and Belgium, and one that managed us 10 years ago who will be in Europe with West Ham next season.
I only hope Rafa Benitez can help us. The home support is going to be critical next season.
71 Posted 01/07/2021 at 02:55:25
Unfortunately, the admin on the Everton USA Facebook group has annoyingly allowed them the spam post every article they produce.
It seems that a good portion of their writers are from India, with many without any connection or interest in the club (even though they claim all they write about is Everton). It seems that every article they put out is just pure click-bait.
72 Posted 01/07/2021 at 06:23:12
They both have a larger body of work smattered with successes, but took a pragmatic approach to these roles.
Hopefully Rafa will be supported in terms of recruiting players in the same way it was planned to support Carlo.
73 Posted 01/07/2021 at 09:03:17
74 Posted 01/07/2021 at 09:30:16
As I see it, he's the best available manager and was chosen by people who have committed hundreds of millions of £££'s with more to come. Opinions are fine, but the actions we've seen and may yet see, are just totally counterproductive.
If we want to see EFC get over the mess that Ancellotti's left us in; and hopefully progress, then the only thing that we can do that is positive, is support the team and support the manager.
75 Posted 01/07/2021 at 09:54:33
I'm not interested if he's on the beach at Hoylake gazing out over the Irish Sea dreaming about our 'Glorious Past ' that was when we had gas mantles and buttonhook shoes. I have thought he was yesterday's man. However, he's here and we have to get on with it. If he doesn't do well in this gig he will know it and so will everyone else. Any player not trying will feel his wrath as it won't just be reflecting on the team but him as well.
Lyndon mentioned Galtier and also wrote a great article about him. I fancied him for us but there you go.
One of the reasons for Lille's success was their player recruitment policy. That was down to Luis Campos, a great scout. Just check out some of the players he's found. He could find gold on Asda's reduced shelf. They have both gone their separate ways.
Marcel is our DoF. He is now on the board, will he be able to spend time looking for some upcomer at a third division club or a minor French league ? Luis Campos is reportedly having talks with Arsenal about joining them.
Everton should be talking to him also. I think he could be a wonderful asset. He probably has a list of young players. We should be trying to get him. In all this managerial turmoil this might not be noticed.
Liverpool isn't as attractive as London, however, if the Wirral is suitable for Rafa it could suit Luis.
I'd even take him for a pint.
76 Posted 01/07/2021 at 09:59:24
I got the impression from Hunter's piece that he's painting a scenario that he hopes will happen, therefore if Benitez fails – like many think he will Ü he can point to the fragility of Everton as a reason to excuse his former hero.
I'm not saying that he has got the wrong impression of the mayhem that may exist at the top of Everton FC but, like most of his LFC-loving friends in the media, he will try to spin a positive for his club and their former employees at the expense of little old Everton.
This is the dilemma that Evertonions now face: support the club unconditionally or continually criticise the appointment of the manager that many didn't or don't want. It's hard to create a siege mentality when there are real or imagined rifts at the top of the club; it's even harder when the supporters are so conflicted about their own behaviour and how it might affect the club they support.
The most important element will be how the players react to this summer's events: will they be able to show professionalism and fortitude? Will they be willing to give everything to Benitez in every match? Or will they behave like shrinking violets and hide behind the discord that might manifest itself in the coming weeks and months?
Like the football that we are likely to witness next season, none of it's going to be pretty, but sometimes in life, something has to be fully broken before it can be properly mended. Let's hope the club is able to come out of the next 12 months in better shape than it looks at the moment.
77 Posted 01/07/2021 at 10:23:21
I've ordered patatas bravas and chorizo, so I hope he doesn't spill any on his crisp white shirt on the way over to my table.
Of course, he has my support and all that - I just wish I felt a bit more excited...
78 Posted 01/07/2021 at 10:32:36
I'm glad he's been chose, as I see him as the best of those who appeared on any list, other than the likes of Mancini, and why on earth would he come.
It looked to me that at the 2nd half of the last season, Ancellotti, and several of the players, were losing enthusiam (if they ever had any!) week by week, and towards the end, ancellotti looked like he wanted to be anywhere other than at our club. Or in Crosby for that matter after the break in.
Anyone who thinks we will get into the top 6 this year, without an influx of good players and the departure of a number of the first team squad, I think is being optimistic. If Benitez can get the players looking like they are up for a game and can keep going for however many minutes there are on the clock. Then that'll be a good job well done for the first season.
I think he's the man to do it, time will tell, but again, we have a massive part to play, it's not what we write on here that counts, it's what we do at the match.
79 Posted 01/07/2021 at 10:47:37
I thought Hunter painted a reasonable picture of the dilemma that Everton are now faced with; big-stakes gamble by the owner and fissures in the board and fanbase. Hunter like other EFC-supporting journos (Phil Nulty, Paul Wilson et al) mostly over-criticises the club to balance his support so he can't be accused of favouritism. I think he pitches the situation pretty well, it's a bit of a mess that could become a very big mess or work out; let's all hope its the latter.
80 Posted 01/07/2021 at 11:58:32
"there is something admirable about a man, who has done plenty of good for the city of Liverpool away from football, still wanting to manage our club in the face of such vocal opposition".
81 Posted 01/07/2021 at 12:15:48
Most angles have being covered of the appointment but I want to float one that is not to my knowledge getting much of an airing. Alisher Usmanov - possibly for our club this could be the most significant aspect. If he has played a key role in appointing Benítez does it follow he is now a major player at Everton? If so then maybe we have some financial clout at long last. Financial Fair Play rules etc etc permitting. My guess is that finishing second is not something he would easily accept.
If he is truly on board then for myself this is the bigger story.
82 Posted 01/07/2021 at 12:55:28
83 Posted 01/07/2021 at 14:25:12
Farhad Moshiri seems to be absolutely determined to make the club successful and, as he has very rich and influential connections, the spending will continue.
It's a long time since Benitez had the luxury of a big transfer budget which I am sure he will now get, so hopefully we will see what he can do with a higher calibre of player next season.
He is our manager now, so let's wish him good luck.
84 Posted 01/07/2021 at 17:16:36
85 Posted 01/07/2021 at 17:43:20
Sad really that so many Evertonians will be wishing defeat on match days, just so as they can 'I told you so.'
I didn't like Rafa when he was Liverpools manager because he was a winner. Same job for us will do me.
86 Posted 01/07/2021 at 19:30:34
Not my choice of manager (but genuinely didnt know who Id actually want from those mentioned, just glad it isnt Martinez), but hes here now and we have to get behind him.
I just hope Brands is already trying to shift the deadwood and Benitez doesnt want to see them in action. We already know there are a lot of players who need to leave and should not be given another chance.
A good summer of recruitment (including outgoings) is crucial for the season ahead (and atmosphere inside Goodison and on here)!
87 Posted 01/07/2021 at 19:34:23
88 Posted 02/07/2021 at 14:46:18
Nothing to me is more symbolic of the total shambles that has been the Moshiri era than this hire.
You can mark my words out, here and now. This won't end well because it has absolutely no chance whatsoever of going well. This has-been of has-beens will be gone in 18 months, but the jokes at our expense will last for much much longer than that, I assure you.
Another sad day in a recent history littered with them. Joke of a club makes joke of a managerial appointment, that's the real headline here.
89 Posted 02/07/2021 at 22:24:30
"Regardless of the appointment of Rafa Benitez, I think we will be okay in the long run because money doesn't seem to be a problem."
Do you think Moshiri is going to be out of pocket after his spending? He'll pass on the debt to – have a guess who? Or he'll sell the club and pass the debt on to the new owner who will then pass the debt on to – have a guess who?
Football, as the red half of this city have already found out, is about to become expensive, for you know who?
90 Posted 02/07/2021 at 23:19:19
It seems that, by an osmosis-like process, Usmanov has formally entered the boardroom.
91 Posted 02/07/2021 at 23:26:03
He's probably been there all along… after all, the holding company that owns Everton FC works out of the same company office that Usmanov owns in that tax haven called the Isle of Man.
92 Posted 02/07/2021 at 00:11:09
It's his fault alone because he's the owner. If, however dodgy it may be, he's not the owner, then the full responsibility passes to the unknown enigma who is our actual owner.
It no doubt takes a lotta bottle to realise you've stupidly squandered £hundreds-of-millions but in appointing Benitez, of all people, the owner now needs to immediately step up to the plate in terms of trying to maintain a hugely diminished football-credibility by writing-off his squandered money, and signing some proper, expensive players to at least give the hitherto stultifying shit-house a chance of delivering something us fans (and the owner, according to his latest confession to the risible TalkShite) have a wish to see.
That's what "project" Ancelotti needed though, wasn't it?
Or is Benitez identified by the owner as "a magician"?
93 Posted 02/07/2021 at 00:30:02
Will he make the effort at his age? I'm in my 70s and doing more creative work, art and music and writing and other extramural activities than I ever have. He's much younger than me and knows it's his last chance at success at the job he loves.
He's obsessive and can channel all his creative energy into this job. It's what he lives for, like many on this site, except that he gets paid a ton of money for it.
Can he get the players to perform? Apparently he's a hard-ass with both players and owners. What's not to like about that?
Will he give us entertaining attacking football? For me, football is only entertaining if our attacking football brings results. The best managers start from a strong defense and develop an attacking program from that base. This is key to Rafa's success or failure and he knows this and we all know this.
Hoping the stars are aligned, however improbable it may appear, and we are chanting Rafa's name at a new stadium.
It's the hope that kills you but, without that hope, life has little or no meaning. Especially for this Evertonian.
94 Posted 03/07/2021 at 07:53:06
95 Posted 03/07/2021 at 08:23:57
96 Posted 03/07/2021 at 08:37:24
97 Posted 03/07/2021 at 08:44:59
98 Posted 03/07/2021 at 09:23:58
Usmanov has not 'formally' entered the Boardroom.
If you had said, "Usmanov has informally entered the boardroom" – you'd probably be closer to the truth, as Tom @91 indicates. But to 'formally' do so, there would need to have been some public announcement from the club… and Companies House would have to be notified.
I recall talk of a 'shadow director' a few years back but that was aimed at Sir Philip Green, who faded away once Bill had found Farhad. I don't recall the issue recurring with respect to Usmanov.
99 Posted 03/07/2021 at 09:29:40
100 Posted 03/07/2021 at 09:33:47
Another season of grinding out 1-0 wins away from home might be acceptable, but a continuation of Ancelotti's grim defensive tactics at home would be a big mistake and would quickly kill off his chances of winning over the fans. He has to be bold and attack teams at Goodison.
Hopefully there will be some signs of a change, in our summer signings, they will be crucial to Rafa's chances of getting off to a good start, we'll just have to wait and hope he spends wisely.
101 Posted 03/07/2021 at 09:35:41
102 Posted 03/07/2021 at 09:52:42
I made the mistake of posting on Toffee-web while watching Andy Murray struggling at Wimbledon and Belgiums “Golden Generation” failing to deliver at the Euros.
Clearly multi-tasking isnt my forte.
103 Posted 03/07/2021 at 09:54:30
If we get another season like the last or even worse I really don't see how he repairs the damage on the pitch or with the fans.
104 Posted 03/07/2021 at 10:06:47
105 Posted 03/07/2021 at 10:29:15
If we don't have that then why bother about where we finish in the League or the type of football we play. Sod it, as we're a small club? Well, I'm an Evertonian and proud of it!
106 Posted 03/07/2021 at 10:46:37
You are correct that Usmanov is not on the board but without doubt he is the man in charge at Goodison, his accountant is front of house to take any flack but I don't think anyone can doubt who really pulls the strings. Just like his pal Abramovich owns Chelsea but in all his time has hardly said 2 words to the press in all that time, instead has Bruce Buck as his chairman to make any club statements.
For those not sure about Usmanovs power at Goodison I would remind them that he had a meeting with Ancelotti prior to him signing his contract, and it was on his boat that the deal with Benitez was finally settled.
But despite who holds the power the people who hold the ultimate power are the match going fans. Just as Abramovich replaced Di Matteo who had won the Champions league with Benitez despite their fans despising Benitez almost as much as that feeling permeates through many Everton fans. And although they won the Europa league even Abramovich realised with the groundswell of Chelsea fans protesting on a regular basis he couldnt keep Benitez in charge. I think this is what will happen with us, there will come a time when it becomes untenable for him to continue if the backlash from the match going fans continues.
107 Posted 03/07/2021 at 11:52:29
If there is no doubt Usmanov is in charge at Everton, how is it that this breach of Company Law is not being investigated by the authorities?
How is it that the FA, PL etc are not all over this?
I can doubt this, Brian, because a lot of this stuff came out in the Panama Papers, was covered extensively, and never went anywhere.
Ancelotti himself said he met Usmanov but it was socially and unrelated to EFC.
Having said that, he undoubtedly cant be ignored, because of the level of investment his companies make in the club. And if rumours of the Stadium Naming Rights deal, £200M over 10 years are correct allegedly, hes not going away. But if this happens, its bound to attract attention, in any case, so Id think exercising caution might be recommended.
Influencing is different to being in charge, and is also legal, at arms length.
But none of us can claim there is no doubt.
108 Posted 03/07/2021 at 12:26:42
109 Posted 03/07/2021 at 12:45:53
I never suggested that Usmanov has breached company law, what he said some months back is when journalists asked him why he didnt want a seat on the board his answer was he could be more useful by not being on the board.
He obviously knows that were he to become a board member he couldnt pump in the money he has, because it would transgress the FFP rules. But by being a sponsor its harder for the FFP rules to be applied to someone who wants to sponsor a club by pumping in hundreds of millions.
This is why Mansoor had a problem with FFP rules at City as the money being pumped in was by companies he owned, so the link wasnt just someone sponsoring a club it was the owner using his companies to be sponsors.
110 Posted 03/07/2021 at 13:14:33
I agree with all of that, and I think it probably lets him get involved in other clubs too. All the while flipping the finger to Arsenal!
The other point you made originally involved Abramovich and Buck. The real comparison with them is Moshiri and Kenwright. And you can see 2 different ways of running a club here. Chelsea do it right with owner and Chairman working together, but the Chairman doing his job, and the owner in the background. Our owner is way too visible, especially whenever changing Managers, way too frequently, especially this time.
Dysfunctional relationship? Love of the limelight? Lack of trust? Whatever, Moshiri is pushing it a bit by being so obvious, not being on the Board himself.
Im really hoping and expecting some real restructuring of the Board taking place sooner rather than later, to make it fit for purpose for a forward looking company.
111 Posted 05/07/2021 at 20:39:51
This appointment is the greatest stain on our history. Here we have a money-grabbing martinet whose best days are behind him. Worse still, you must remember who made the first noises to appoint him. Our old friends, the Liverpool Echo, Sky and Jamie Carragher. Do you find it acceptable that these people pick Everton managers?
That they are delighted with the fact that they now have Klopp at Liverpool and Benitez at Everton, the whole city sown up, Liverpool FC 1 and Liverpool FC 2 to brown-nose to? You will not hear an anti-Benitez word from this lot, or any other ex-red pundits (God knows there are plenty of those).
Did you know that Jamie Carragher has said that now we have Benitez, he will buy a bag of popcorn and sit back and watch the fun? Did you not see that Benitez has to arrive at the training ground in a blacked-out van, presumably packed with bodyguards? It is shameful.
We are literally being laughed at. We have no identity anymore and should just be a feeder club to Liverpool FC - Athletico Liverpool anyone?
And to those Everton fans who say "I love the club, not the manager" – can you really not find a better thing to do than watch three more years of dross? Show some class and keep away.
I am finished with the club because I wont be bought by Sky and the rest of that shower. Have the guts to do the same. It is a great feeling when you cant be bought.
112 Posted 05/07/2021 at 20:59:45
113 Posted 05/07/2021 at 21:00:06
"Finished with the Club"? Sounds to me deep down you're not a True Blue, so staying away should not be a problem to you. I could never turn my back on Everton FC.
114 Posted 05/07/2021 at 21:11:13
115 Posted 05/07/2021 at 21:13:28
Not your post, but because I don't recall ever seeing your name I used the TW search facility to find if you have ever posted on TW before. You did. Once. In November 2011.
Funnily enough it carried a similar msg to the one you closed your latest post with. For anyone interested, read David's words of wisdom at post #1 in this thread from the archives.
David's text in full:
'Saw the news today about the Everton free school. Why? Free schools are a flagship Tory policy. They are designed to privatise education by the back door, reducing teachers' pay and conditions. The Tories will bribe those making bids for free schools. This is public money being given to private organisations. Why is our club dealing with such a vicious government? These people hate our city with a vengeance (remember the European ban, anyone?). For a club in such a poor area, with a fan base largely against the Tories, why are we having dealings with them? Is it to get a bribe to build the Park End development and call it a school building? Enough is enough for me. What a disgrace our club has become.'
I am a season ticket holder and so are my two children. However, they will not see another penny from me.
Why? Free schools are a flagship Tory policy. They are designed to privatise education by the back door, reducing teachers' pay and conditions. The Tories will bribe those making bids for free schools. This is public money being given to private organisations.
Why is our club dealing with such a vicious government? These people hate our city with a vengeance (remember the European ban, anyone?).
For a club in such a poor area, with a fan base largely against the Tories, why are we having dealings with them? Is it to get a bribe to build the Park End development and call it a school building?
Enough is enough for me. What a disgrace our club has become.'
Presuming the club never received another penny from you in all that time, and presuming you were true to your declared words from 10 years ago that 'enough was enough' for you and that you DID turn your back on the club, why the hell would anyone take seriously anything you now say?
116 Posted 05/07/2021 at 21:23:52
117 Posted 05/07/2021 at 21:27:30
I find a lot of intrigue, more than anything. Interest in how us Evertonians feel about it. I explain my discomfort, but not dismay, and use the ToffeeWeb poll to explain there seems to be a near 50-50 split, but now more of a lets get on with the business of the new season.
Maybe Kopties are laughing? But talking to my Merseyside family and my brother-in-law in particular who is a big red and not happy at all, I'd call it a nervous laugh if they are. A front to mask their own disappointment and probably just the opportune excuse to take the piss.
Disclaimer; obviously, I can only go on the conversations I've had.
118 Posted 06/07/2021 at 09:45:22
I've got half-a-dozen old school mates who are all reds, and they're not laughing. Their assessment of Everton is similar to mine, in that if we let our best players leave in their prime without equivalent immediate replacement or better, and don't improve our strength-in-depth, then we're unlikely to progress beyond midtable.
They believe that Benitez would make this problem unlikely to keep happening under his watch, and that's where my opinion differs. I can't see the choice of manager having much effect, unless Everton solve this perennial problem of letting the best players go too soon. All clubs lose players, but top clubs tend not to lose them in their prime, but tend to sign them.
If we aim to be a top club, we need to behave like one in terms of player recruitment and retention.
119 Posted 06/07/2021 at 09:59:58
We need better players, whoever the manager is or was.
And, yes, you can lose players, sell them. But have a strategy to replace them. Like that lot across the part have done to very good effect in the main.
120 Posted 06/07/2021 at 10:03:47
Not a single person I've spoken in my non-ToffeeWeb football interactions to thinks Benitez is an improvement on Ancelotti. Not one of them thinks he's likely to do any better than Ancelotti did, nor play in any significantly more pleasing way. Not one of them thinks the club is anywhere near the top six nor even a remote candidate to get there quickly.
Nobody is laughing now, but we haven't kicked a ball in anger yet. When Benitez has departed, and is giving inside interviews telling the world the differences between "professional Liverpool" and "amateurish, bumbling Everton", there'll be plenty of time for jokes at our expense.
121 Posted 06/07/2021 at 10:18:04
I didn't say an improvement; if anything I've called it out as being a lesser model if you look at past CVs. Kind of more of the same but not quite the same pedigree.
I just haven't yet had anyone laughing at us, which is the point of the poster I was originally responding to. My brother-in-law is equally as uncomfortable as me, which is interesting given he's a red!
122 Posted 06/07/2021 at 10:43:32
On the Farley video that I posted, each to his own. I found it quite funny and I have seen Farley post videos mocking Liverpool players too. For me, it was using humour to highlight the irony of hiring Benitez as manager from all points of view. Let's not turn into Koppites for god sake - humourless, over-sensitive and inflated sense of worth - otherwise the next 12 months will be even more painful than they are already likely to be.
123 Posted 06/07/2021 at 10:53:27
124 Posted 06/07/2021 at 12:05:12
125 Posted 06/07/2021 at 12:23:01
David @ 111
I don't agree with your response to Lyndon's last paragraph in the original article. If Benitez was able to do all that Lyndon suggests and ends up winning a trophy, surely even the most bitter blues should afford Benitez some sort of respect.
Lyndon didn't actually state 'for ever' but I suppose the implication is there. Can you manage if Benitez actually stayed the course of his contract and delivered the title – would that get that your respect? It would get mine.
As for your comments about who made the first noises to appoint him, I think you will find that Moshiri is his own man and will, with the advice or hindrance of others (and not the media), have drawn up his own list. You might remember that, according to much of the media, we were about to appoint Moyes, Nuno, Potter, Martinez and no doubt many others.
As for other's comments about Darren Farley and his mocking of Everton. As far as I am aware, he supports Liverpool. Am sure if he supported Everton and was making fun of Liverpool we would be laughing too. Over the years, he has targeted many players and managers from different teams, not just Everton-related. He is reasonably funny and his impressions are usually good. The choice of Benitez as manager is a good opportunity for Darren Farley – one that he couldn't miss taking.
as Steve @ 122 says 'Let's not turn into Koppites for god sake – humourless, over-sensitive and inflated sense of worth – otherwise the next 12 months will be even more painful than they are already likely to be.'
126 Posted 06/07/2021 at 12:47:38
I have tried to make sense of it in that it could surprise us all and he gets us playing nice winning football. He could simply just steady the ship for a while and use his experience to bring some solidity on the playing field.
That was one half of my brain.
The cynical side of me is saying that its such a bad move in bringing Benitez here that if it goes badly early on then the supporters will turn on Benitez, Moshiri and indeed each other and the club ends up in a more chaotic state than ever.
The risk is so great that it simply has to go well in my eyes.
The current playing staff are not really going to help Benitez here. We need to bring in a really dominant center midfield player. I like Allan but he lacks pace. Doucouré for me just cannot pass the ball any where near good enough so unless Benitez can work a miracle with formations we are going to struggle.
With Seamus coming to the end of his career and Digney not far behind him I think we are struggling for a leader. Somebody who knows the club. Ben Godfrey may be that player if we can keep the wolves at Bay. This is a very big year for Michael Keane also. He needs to step up mentally and show he can stand up to pressure. I really hope he can because we need a core of UK players to give us some steel.
Still need some fresh faces coming in and a few stale ones leaving.
I cant believe Im saying this but good luck to Rafa Benitez. I think we are all in this when I say hes going to need it.
127 Posted 06/07/2021 at 13:21:50
128 Posted 06/07/2021 at 14:28:46
I agree, there is the danger of this going toxic early, but now it's happened, let's hope not, because now most of us, even those who didn't want it, accept it's happened, it will mean things have gone wrong on the pitch.
We need better players to compliment the ones we brought in last summer and those who improved. We cannot expect Benitez to be a magician (to coin a phrase) and turn this current squad, as is, into challengers. The squad isn't good enough regardless of who the manager is.
I disagree on Digne. He's 27 and probably hitting peak. He still has 3 years+ in him at the top if he's around with Everton that long.
I've been vocal in my opinion about Michael Keane. At 28 and our oldest senior centre back, he's as good as he's going to get. And in my opinion I'd rate that as okay on a good day. And even then, only when we play a system that suits him, which Ancelotti fathomed out pretty quickly. But that means playing compact and on the edge of our own box for long periods. Not what I want. We need a different type of centre back in my opinion.
To Tony's final point, and I'll again contradict myself here, which is fine. I come on here often as many will have noticed, and always like to learn and be educated by the views of others. Once the dust settled, I thought Benitez to be a lesser Ancelotti, as I have said. Similar but not quite on par in terms of CV or pedigree but fitted the profile the owner(s) seem to want.
But that Observer article called out a good point that made me think. Benitez could be a better fit as he's achieved success with so called lesser clubs who are not quite there but have the aspiration to do so. Ancelotti didn't have that on his CV as some continuously and ultimate, it seems rightly, pointed out.
All we can do right now is see where this takes us. Hold on tight!
129 Posted 06/07/2021 at 15:53:07
My mistake as I thought Digne was 29. I think he's a top player and possibly captain material but Rafa will decide that.
It will be a shame to see Seamus coming to the end of his career. He's high up on my list as the best signings ever. Players with his hard work and ethics don't come along very often.
I live in hope for Michael Keane but you are probably more honest in your description of him. I feel a similar mistrust for Mina. He's awkward and uncompromising with mistakes all over his game and yet sometimes domineering.
As for Mason Holgate, he left us with a lot more questions than answers last season so not sure what his role is going to be.
No doubt the defense will be Rafa's starting point but, for me, it's midfield we need to spend big on. Maybe Gbamin could save us some money if he's finally recovered.
I normally hate the long wait for the season to start but I am dreading this one for some reason.
130 Posted 15/07/2021 at 14:20:40
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