Serial incompetence in front of goal sees another shocking home loss

Michael Kenrick 01/05/2021 601comments  |  Jump to last

Michael Keane is fit again but he does not walk straight back into the starting XI, which is unchanged
Everton 1 - 2 Aston Villa

Everton were back at Goodison Park this evening, exposing a maddening panoply of incomprehensible inadequacies as they once again failed painfully to press their claims for European qualification.

Abdoulaye Doucouré is still out injured, along with Jean-Phillippe Gbamin. So it was to be the same side that beat Arsenal with Sigurdsson and Gomes as the midfield powerhouse for Everton tonight. But James Rodriguez with a repetition of his troublesome calf injury aggravated in the warm-up, he was replaced by Alex Iwobi in the starting XI, a potentially huge late setback for the Blues, with Virginia added to the bench.

Michael Keane is fit again after missing out last time with a slight hamstring problem but is on the bench with Yerry Mina, Josh King and Bernard — Nkounkou the only not-quite senior player on the bench tonight.

For the visitors, Ross Barkley returns to the club he used to love, while Jack Grealish is absent as he recovers from a shin injury.

Another brilliant start from the kick-off, hoofing the ball upfield and out for a goal-kick to the visitors. But they did get it back and actually put together a decent move, Iwobi's shot being blocked.

Everton put themselves under pressure with a series of dreadful clearances until Villa blazed the ball over the bar. Everton tried to play out but struggled to get beyond a busy midfield. Holgate got caught dithering and Watkins was all over him, easily beating Pickford.

Watkins then tried a similar move on Godfrey off a long ball and it almost worked, Pickford making a last-ditch block. But Everton won a corner at the other end and a fantastic ball from Digne to the far saw Calvert-Lewin deliver a fierce header that was unstoppable.

But Everton were somehow all at sixes and sevens in defence, Watkins failing to profit and more shots needing desperate blocks. But they finally took the game to the other end and a brilliant first-time cross bounced up for a difficult diving header that Calvert-Lewin could not divert past Martinez in the Villa goal.

Villa got a free-kick that Barkley tried to put in the top corner but over-hit it. Everton were caught again and Pickford had to block Watkins again, and then recover to bat away his deep cross/shot to the far post.

Another unbelievable goalmouth scramble off a brilliant ball in by Cash somehow failed to go in, Pickford getting a vital interception before the follow-up from El Ghazi hit the bar. Sigurdsson tried a shot but the execution was off. He was set up again with some neat passing but shot blindly into a defender.

Gomes and Digne conspired to give the ball away in attack and Villa moved up, with Barkley in space, hammering his shot onto the base of the post and away. Iwobi got free and looked to play in Calvert-Lewin but the Everton forward just couldn't pick it up. Douglas Luiz was booked for his grappling Richarlison but Sigurdsson's dangerous ball in was punched away by Martinez, Coleman firing the return ball high and wide.

Brakley then set up Watkins for a shot that screwed across Pickfords's goal and just past his far post. There could be no complaints about lack of tempo although the purists will want to berate some of the haphazard defending that had made it a much more watchable game than many that have preceded it this season. The half finished with a couple of well-delivered corners from Digne but the Villains were first to make contact.

Iwobi fed Digne for a great cross in and a Villa block in a lively ending to the half that epitomized the game up to this point. Villa's chances had looked more dangerous, having twice hit the woodwork, and they will feel they should be ahead.

Villa made the better start to the second half, Watkins winning an early corner. Another back-and-forth, end-to-end spell ensued without any danger being created for the moment. A lovely move off a back-flick by Allan saw another great cross from Digne but Calvert-Lewin had failed to anticipate it and ut himself in the right place.

Everton got more chances to threaten but first Richarlison then Iwobi then Allan all made the wrong choices. And so up to the other end for Watkins to create even more danger. Richarlison benefitted from a poor clearance to get behind the Villa line but, for a Brazilian, his shot was shockingly abysmal.

Iwobi picked up the ball in space and promised this time to cross effectively... but of course he did no such thing, and the pendulum swung back to VIlla, although this time they struggled to play out as the game saw its quietest spell.

Gomes, who had been more lively than effective, was replaced by Delph, wearing the correct socks this week. Calvert-Lewin had a nice long run and shot fairly hard for him from outside the area, but directionally it was simply woeful. Bernard came on for Iwobi.

Everton would pay dearly for their ridiculous lassitude in front of goal. After Digne needlessly gave the ball away, Traore set up El Ghazi with just enough time and space to curl an unstoppable shot past Pickford with just 10 minutes left. Sigurdsson departed for the perennially poor King. Surely there could be no way back from this latest catastrophic result?

King was just as bad when he was gifted sight of goal, driving it well wide of the target. And the game pretty much fizzled out in a stream of Villa substitutions, for another utterly incomprehensible home defeat.

Kick-off: 8 pm, Saturday 1 May 2021 on BT Sport 1

Everton: Pickford, Coleman (c), Holgate, Godfrey, Digne, Allan, Gomes (69' Delph), Sigurdsson (82' King), Rodriguez Iwobi (78' Bernard), Richarlison, Calvert-Lewin.
Subs not Used: Olsen, Viginia, Keane, Mina, Nkounkou, Davies.

Aston Villa: Martinez, Cash, Konsa, Mings (c), Douglas Luiz [Y:41'], McGinn, Watkins, Traore (88' Ramsey), Targett, Barkley, El Ghazi [Y:90'] (90' Davis) .
Subs: Heaton, Taylor, Wesley, Nakamba, El Mohamady, Hause, Philogene-Bidace.

Referee: Simon Hooper
VAR: Graham Scott


Reader Comments (601)

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Jay Wood
[BRZ]

1 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:03:53
Same starting XI as last game to Arsenal.

Barkley starts for them.

Tony Hill
2 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:05:59
That's good enough for me.
Christy Ring
3 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:06:16
Would have preferred Davies ahead of Siggy in midfield, Villa have a lot more pace
Thomas Richards
4 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:10:26
Maybe Mina for Holgate but, apart from that, the side is the one I wanted.
Tony Twist
5 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:12:09
Weak in midfield, play one of Gomes or Sigurdsson but not both. We will be under pressure due to those two.

Clean sheet, professional performance and 3 points please, Everton.

Kevin Molloy
6 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:22:52
if and when we lose the ball how do we not start to collapse like a burst balloon with a midfield of James Siggi and Gomes.
Still, what the hell do I know. No doubt we will now power past them like they weren't there.
Darren Hind
7 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:24:29
Carlo once again going for Mason. At least he will play in his favored position
Thomas Richards
8 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:26:42
Cant win Carlo.

If he plays a defensive midfielders hes too negative.
If he goes with the better players he leaves us too open

Simon Dalzell
9 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:30:09
Maybe my mother for Holgate, but apart from that, the side is the one I wanted.
Will Mabon
10 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:31:48
There is of course always the option to bring on Davies for Sigurdsson or Gomes. Not a hugely seen tactic but hey...
Martin Mason
11 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:32:02
Kevin@6 I think they will play a diamond in midfield with Siggi ahead of three midfielders.
Kevin Prytherch
12 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:32:29
Holgate again at centre back.

Good - he's our best defender there and the only one who looks like he can actually anticipate anything.

Thomas Richards
13 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:34:13
Better than Godfrey Kev?
Neil Lawson
14 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:34:43
Unchanged from the team who managed one shot on target at Arsenal. That bodes well !
Tony Everan
15 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:34:56
Tough on Tom Davies as he played well against Tottenham in the last home match.

I am too wary of that midfield being outdone for intensity, which has been the story of the season at home. I'm still confident though, with Allan being back and Sigurdsson playing better lately.

Will Mabon
16 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:35:06
"Ross Barkley returns to the club he used to love".


Great line, Michael.

Dave Abrahams
17 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:37:27
Thomas (8)well Thomas we didn't play very well at Arsenal, to put it mildly, but they say, never change a winning team, Although that's what Carlo has done in the past, changed a winning team and lost the next game.

No doubting Carlo is a lovely genuine man but he tends to drive me crackers with some of his bleedin' selections, best of luck with that midfield Carlo, but we are due a big win tonight with plenty of goals, I think the last one was over six months ago v WBA, not knocking you Carlo, just a couple of little digs, I hope you have the last laugh tonight.

Tony Hill
18 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:40:14
I fancy us for goals tonight, Dave.
Thomas Richards
19 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:40:22
Martin Keown singing the praises of Allan there.

Guessing you would have Tom Davies in there Dave

Thomas Richards
20 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:45:13
James out.
Iwobi in
Neil Lawson
21 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:45:48
Iwobi. Oh dear oh dear oh dear.
Brian Williams
22 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:46:20
Like for like Thomas. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Thomas Richards
23 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:47:30
Identical twins Brian 😁
Neil Lawson
24 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:48:49
Fascinated by Carlo's polo shirt. Truly naff. Can't even say it's his lucky one given recent results. Come on Carlo. Get yourself a decent one. Oh, and a decent right winger too, please.
Jay Wood
[BRZ]

25 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:51:00
Oops! Rodrigues injured in warm up. Alex Iwobi comes in.
Kevin Dyer
26 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:51:57
Saying calf strain for James, again. Really disappointing and hurts our chances a lot.
Kevin Molloy
27 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:53:23
big opportunity now for the player to show just exactly why we did pay over 30 (thirty) million pounds for Alex Iwobi.
Dave Abrahams
28 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:54:22
Thomas (19) definitely Thomas, did well v Spurs but got dragged off, got ninety seconds v Arsenal, but Iwobi in for James will change our fortunes forever, are you bleedin' real Carlo, just another little dig Carlo, hope you don't mind, we take plenty off you. I fuckin'wobi though!!
Thomas Richards
29 Posted 01/05/2021 at 19:56:39
Big improvement off Tom this season, Dave. Same with Holgate last week.

Anyways here we go.

James Owen
30 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:10:34
Ancellotti has made some comments about Richarlison not delivering but having a good spell when Calvert Lewin was out.

Maybe there is a connection there.. 🤔

I would like to see Calvert Lewin being a little more unselfish and aware. Instead of thinking only of himself getting goals maybe if he sought to create more chances for Richarlison when he's in a good position they would develop a better partnership.

And probably more goals would come for Calvert Lewin too because Richarlison would start to return the favour.

Kevin Dyer
31 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:14:57
Oh dear, Holgate...
Ernie Baywood
32 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:15:19
Advice waiting to happen. Happened twice in 10 minutes for one goal.

Can't understand our approach here.

Mal van Schaick
33 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:16:04
Holgate is a disaster. Get rid ASAP.
James Owen
34 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:16:17
Ancellotti has made some comments about Richarlison not delivering but having a good spell when Calvert Lewin was out.

Maybe there is a connection there.. 🤔

I would like to see Calvert Lewin being a little more unselfish and aware. Instead of thinking only of himself getting goals maybe if he sought to create more chances for Richarlison when he's in a good position they would develop a better partnership.

And probably more goals would come for Calvert Lewin too because Richarlison would start to return the favour.

Alex Gray
35 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:18:34
Mason Holgate single-handedly throwing our season in the bin. Get rid.
David Thomas
36 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:19:17
Holgate our best defender there. You couldn't make some of these comments up.
Kevin Dyer
37 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:19:48
Awful start to the match. A lot of time for the players to respond but if we do not beat this Villa team it puts our Euro chances into perspective.
Sean O’Hanlon
38 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:20:46
What a load of shite by Holgate!

Is there any Plan B to get the ball out of defence? Pickford's had more of the ball than anyone on the pitch. Dreadful!

Simon Dalzell
39 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:22:35
Kevin (12). Are we watching the same matches. I'm sticking to Calamity Kid.
James Owen
40 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:24:16
I have a theory about James Rodriguez's tight calf muscles.

In some South American countries including Columbia they drink a lot of that tea "maté" There are fotos of him on Instagram drinking it.

Now, I know whenever I drink tea or coffee I get muscle cramps in my legs... although I am already a bit of a crock to be fair...

Would he think about cutting out the tea for a few weeks..? See if that pesky calf loosens up, that has ruled him out of so many games..

It could be the caffeine!
Worth a try!!

Kevin Dyer
41 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:25:34
Great by DCL. There's goals in this game, that's for sure!
Ernie Baywood
42 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:27:52
Again, we wait to screw up before looking like an attacking threat again.

If we can play like this, then why would we ever bother with the strange passing game in our back line?

Kevin Dyer
43 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:30:29
Pickford is playing a blinder tbf.
Neil Lawson
44 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:47:09
Time now Carlo to prove your worth and managerial skills. Defensively it is a shambles. He has to make positive changes. Will he ? I have my doubts. Must be proactive not reactive.
Dave Abrahams
45 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:55:45
If I thought they were bad versus Arsenal, what about this shambles, front, middle and especially back!!
Jay Wood
[BRZ]

46 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:56:59
Mason Holgate was one of our best players under Carlo last season, until he injured himself at Spurs. Injured himself again pre-season v Preston and, for the most part, has got nowhere near those standards this season.

He'd already had his pocket nicked by Watkins in identical fashion to how he coughed up the goal. He looks a shambles at the moment and I for one cannot understand the nonsense some trot out about Michael Keane in comparison.

Pickford - out of necessity - is having a storming game. Great header for our equaliser, but in the main they are running our defence ragged.

Unless that is sorted, we lose this.

Kevin Dyer
47 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:59:24
Ancelotti must be doing his nut watching the lack of control we have out there. Offensively, we've been pretty good but – oh my word – we've been ripped apart defensively.

Pickford, as our last line of defence, has been as good as I can remember.

Iwobi has had an excellent first half, needs to grab this chance with both hands and carry on. Calvert-Lewin has been dangerous and looks fit again. Gomes is having a very good game in possession. Sigurdsson is also dangerous and is running like a man possessed. Richy is having one of those erratic games that could end up a 5/10 or an 8/10.

I think the team looks pumped up, desperate to get the win here. Maybe this is causing us to lose shape and get torn apart on the counter? Allan is trying to hold the fort all by himself in the centre.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Mina come on and us shifting to a back 3, but not sure who'd get pulled off in midfield? All three are busting a gut.

We have to win this game. It's still there for the taking.

Thomas Richards
48 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:59:29
Normal service is resumed.
He played very well last week, hopeless this week. Not good enough
Tony Hill
49 Posted 01/05/2021 at 20:59:38
Villa are a good side. It's an entertaining game. We've had our own chances.

I've just tuned into the Live Forum. What a zoo of stupids.

Pete Hughes
50 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:03:14
Thank fuck for Pickford, we would be 4 or 5 down otherwise!
Kevin Dyer
51 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:05:23
#49 Tony, I sacked off the Live Forum ages ago, it does my head in the nonsense and knee-jerk reactions on there, beyond idiotic.
Neil Lawson
52 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:06:10
No change.

I really think that is very poor management from a man lauded as a tactical genius... etc, etc.

James Owen
53 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:09:32
Don't be such a meanie, Tony! [49]
Paul Smith
54 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:17:04
Guaranteed to come on here and see people slating the Live Forum. Stay off it then if you don't like it.
Kevin Dyer
55 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:26:59
#54 Tough it out Paul, it's only an opinion.
Neil Lawson
56 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:31:55
Sorry, everyone, but Ancelotti is in need of therapy. Ridiculous management.
Sean O’Hanlon
57 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:32:55
Oh great. He brings on Delph! Ancellotti what a tactician!

Just waiting for Villa to score, or for us to scrape a draw.

Absolute garbage.

Neil Lawson
58 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:43:33
Why can I see what that fraud manager cannot?
Christy Ring
59 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:44:20
At 1-1, why would you bring on Delph?
Sean O’Hanlon
60 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:48:36
I'm glad people are beginning to realise what a fraud the manager is. We deserved to be beaten – and frankly I don't give a shite about this team anymore.

Disgraceful performance – AGAIN!

Michael Lynch
61 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:49:38
We really do lack quality. Hard to understand how we're in the top half of the table.
Michael Lynch
62 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:55:21
Strange season. We've looked awful when we win and awful when we lose. Complete lack of quality and identity as a team.

Hugely disappointing performance yet again.

Thomas Richards
63 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:55:33
Poorest game Ben Godfrey has played for us. Holgate just not good enough.

Result was inevitable

Paul Smith
64 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:55:54
Enough is enough. Carlo's decisions are baffling. Where next?
Alex Winstanley
65 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:55:57
Sick of this shite home form!
Kieran Kinsella
66 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:56:03
Tactic seems to have been “hold on for your lives and hope James does some magic.”

Once James decided he didn't want the aggro and sat this one out, we had no Plan B.

How shit must King be that Richarlison is undroppable? What has Tom done to exiled? At least he occasionally looks up and goes in the opposition half?

Neil Lawson
67 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:56:59
Seething. Absolutely seething.

Don't defend the Manager. He picks the team. He sorts the tactics. He has a real responsibility for a lot of the shite we are having to endure.

Yes, a number of the players are not good enough. Neither is the Manager.

Joe McMahon
68 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:57:12
Has so much ever been spent to be so lethargic, clueless, low scoring, slow and just pitiful watch?
Christy Ring
69 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:58:00
Agree, Paul, 1-1 and we bring on fucking Delph.
Tommy Coleman
70 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:58:16
Predictable crap.
Kevin Molloy
71 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:58:49
All-in-all, that was absolutely dreadful from start to finish.

Carlo, mate, this is fucking shit.

Dean Richardson
72 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:58:57
Subs were wrong and way too late. We see the lads knocking them in in training but they must leave their scoring boots at home. Got to hand it to Villa.
Jay Wood
[BRZ]

73 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:59:33
Who would happily swap Watkins for Richarlison, at any price?

The Godfrey-Holgate dream team so many advocate worked a treat, didn't it?

Goodness, this team can frustrate the hell out of you.

Terry McLavey
74 Posted 01/05/2021 at 21:59:55
Past your best, Carlo, as clueless as the parade of previous so-called managers this now sorry club has employed.
Paul Birmingham
75 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:00:42
Well, the worst fears, their forwards worked their socks off, as we had a midfield of butter and so the best team won.

Alarm bells and the lack of big game management again means it's almost killed any European hopes.

What the fuck is Delph in the squad for? He's despicable. Still, we can only hope and see if Sheffield Utd beat Spurs, Man Utd best Liverpool, and then ifs and buts.

Fair play to Jordan Pickford but another atrocious defensive mistake that was avoidable has caused our own downfall.

Hard to pick up but West Ham on this performance looks a very big ask, but this is Everton.

For me, the midfield didn't get going tonight and surely now Tom Davies must start next week.

For now it's what-ifs and let's enjoy the rest of the weekend.

Paul Smith
77 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:01:08
Dean @72, we did hand it up Villa – on a plate. Gutted tonight.
Martin Berry
78 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:01:16
We have been dreadful at home all season, and our football has not been much better. I said it against Arsenal last week (and it gives me no satisfaction) that we can't put two passes together... and as for keeping possession? It's totally alien to us, so we lose matches.

How many chances do we actually create during a match? Very few. Have you noticed how many goals we have scored from set-pieces? From open play, we're clueless.

Carlo needs to get his act together during the summer and decide what to do because clearly it's is not good enough as teams with poorer players are frequently out-playing us! We need three dogs in the centre as two is not working, oh how we have missed Doucouré!

Bill Fairfield
79 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:02:49
This is torture to watch, utter shite.
Richard Grey
80 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:03:00
Terrible performance again. Never looked like getting anything from this.

Basically gave Villa both their goals then had nothing going forward ourselves. Dom can't score outside of the 6-yard box, only James can and he's injured every other game.

I've given up on Richarlison, he has no footballing brain, gives the ball away all the time and has no second touch.

We need better players, but Everton will continue to fall foul of the transfer market and miss out on the best players, it seems. I hope I'm wrong though.

Roman Sidey
81 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:04:48
I love this club, but I hate this team.
Stephen Brown
82 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:06:12
I wish I didn't care.
Eddie Dunn
83 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:06:17
The shape was wrong; once again, Gomes and Sigurdsson start. Ripped apart by good movement and balls over the top. No Keane to blame, we had 2 pacey (?) centre-backs. Some dreadful performances Godfrey, Seamus, Digne and Holgate.

Carlo brought on Delph when he should have brought on Davies. King also too late.

Richarlison has forgotten where the goal is and his pitiful lack of peripheral vision or greed prevented Sigurdsson having a tap in. Same old!

John Raftery
84 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:06:26
We never looked solid tonight. Many have called for a more ambitious approach from the manager, especially in the home games. The problem with that is, as soon as we throw men forward, we leave ourselves far too open to the counter-attack.

Time and again tonight, Villa exploited that and, but for our man of the match, Pickford's heroics, might have scored five or six.

With the current personnel, we have only one way of delivering results. That is to sit deep, defend in numbers and hope for a goal on the break or more likely at a set-piece. We now fight for 8th.

Andy Walker
85 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:07:08
The main culprits Neil are those responsible for bringing Delph, Sigurdsson, Iwobi, Gomes, and Bernard in, whilst failing to bring another decent striker to the club. Then look at the academy and question why no youngsters have come through.

We just don't have good enough players, particularly in midfield where we are way too slow and can't break through the opposition's lines anything like enough.

Richard Nelson
86 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:07:24
So predictable... the arrogant, nonchalant, gum-chewing Holgate sets the benchmark.

And don't get me started on the Manager... enough said!!!

Dave Abrahams
87 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:07:45
Every player was poor, some were very poor.

None of them was as poor as the manager... were there any tactics?

Nothing changed at half-time, abysmal in everything they tried to do, with shooting at the target absolutely pathetic.

One player seemed to age in front of my eyes, he got older and older with every passing minute and I had him down as a good player.

Never rains but it pours at Everton, no end to it.

Tony Twist
88 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:08:18
Second rate. Clueless manager. Don't care what he has done in the past – just what he does now for us. Unfortunately us Evertonians have been starved of success and will cling on to anything and the majority won't see the most obvious flaws.

This manager is flawed. There is talk of Couthinho, that sums it up. The manager is just looking for someone to reliably come good or to blame if they don't. It's lazy and it's people dodging blame.

The worst thing is the lack of clarity of who chooses what player to buy, again so it's difficult to prove who is to blame. It's laziness; get young, powerful players with skill and build a team. Stop trying to find the easy fix, Everton.

Lee Courtliff
89 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:08:19
I can't believe how poor our ball retention is. We simply can't keep possession.

Every team that comes to Goodison seems to dominate the ball against us. The stats might not be saying the same but it certainly feels like it when you're watching.

And the selection of Delph ahead of Davies is one of the most mystifying decisions I've ever seen in my 30 years of supporting this club!! Just bizarre.

And...well, everything is shite. Even when we won last week we were still shite.

It's painful to watch.

Ernie Baywood
90 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:08:34
You could see the plan in the second half. And it was my worst fear at half time.

Defence was iffy in the first. Midfield was lacking throughout. It made for great entertainment with Villa having the edge in an end to end game that saw chances at both ends. So our solution in the second half was to sit deeper. How did that work out, Carlo?

After conceding the first goal we showed the way we should be playing. If you're stronger attacking... then attack!

But no, we abandoned that and relied on on notoriously porous defence to see the game out.

Not good enough. And not even decent to watch.

We are the classic case of a team playing to cover up its weaknesses rather than playing to its strengths. That's a guaranteed pathway to being bang average.

Neil Lawson
91 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:08:35
The only positive is that it's fewer than 24 hours to Line of Duty.

I wonder whether if Carlo switches on to watch, that he will put on ITV and not realise until after the second ad break.

Andy Crooks
92 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:09:33
What is the road map for reaching the point when it might be okay to say that some of the shite served up at Goodison Park this season might, even slightly, be down to Carlo Ancelotti?
Hywel Owen
93 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:10:17
If James cannot stand the aggro, do not pay his ridiculous wages this week – or any other week.

I have been following Everton since 1960 and I have never seen such a bunch of incompetent lazy twats. The whole squad, with a couple of exceptions (namely the young players) needs to be cleared out. Do not sign any more over-the-hill foreign trash who are here to gather their wages and little else.

Recruit players who can at least be decisive and pass the ball accurately and are prepared to put in a shift. There are plenty such players in the Championship. Stop trawling for "out of favour" players in Spain and Italy. There is usually a reason they are 'out of favour' and that is that they are lazy rubbish.


Rory Grant
94 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:10:30
Nothing to complain about. Better team won. Organised better, tactically better, individual effort better, etc.

Ancelotti has to answer big questions: What has he actually achieved at the club? Maybe better than his predecessors but the quality of play is atrocious. Nothing will be achieved with the current dross.

Nicolas Piñon
95 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:10:35
Interesting to see what will happen now if Richarlison wants to leave for Champions League football next season... cause then, Ancelotti's time may be over...

John Keating
96 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:11:52
It's repetitive every game. How are we so bad making easy passes?

Week-in & week-out, we put ourselves under unnecessary pressure. Holgate and Iwobi should have been binned at half time. From kick off, Villa showed their tactics regarding Watkins but Holgate and Godfrey didn't have the sense to sort themselves out.

Poor from Ancelotti tonight allowing players not performing staying on the pitch.
Season over.

Phil Rodgers
97 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:12:47
There are no words to describe how much I hate this club (on the pitch) at the moment. They just suck the life out of me. Inexcusable performance after inexcusable performance. Pathetic, limp, scandalous are the words that come to mind. If we were a dog, we'd be put down. I really, really wish we were a dog.
Paul A Smith
98 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:14:36
We went for it and it was shocking to see so much wasted possession. Richarlison the biggest culprit.

Great header from Calvert-Lewin to equalise but he was virtually anonymous after it.

And Barkley is still a better footballer than Gomes ever will be.

Peter Dodds
99 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:15:01
So many players not comfortable on the ball, unable to handle fast passes or shield it and keep possession under pressure. So little composure when a goal-scoring opportunity presents itself (Richarlison).

So slow to make tactical changes and substitutions when change is needed (how many runs did Watkins make behind Seamus?). Poor all round.

Darren Hind
100 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:15:09
Barkley – the player who is finished – once again ran rings around us. Gone back to Birmingham with the Brazilian Peter Reid's knickers in his arse pocket.

Pro... err... gress.

David Hallwood
101 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:17:01
Nicholas #95,

Where would Richarlison go? None of the top 5 would take him, neither would Barca or Real. The Italians maybe, but on present form, he'd be lucky if Watford came in for him.

Watkins gave him a lesson in how to stretch a defence, I'd happily swap them.

Oliver Molloy
102 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:17:43
Carlo Ancelotti and these players can thank their lucky stars Goodison Park is fucking empty of fans.

No excuses, just another terrible performance; without the creativity and vision of Rodriquez, we are a very ordinary team.

What in utter fuck does our manager see in Iwobi???

Rob Hooton
103 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:18:11
Nicolas, 95,

Richarlison is one of the many reasons our season is over, he loses the ball almost every single time he gets it and is well overrated (in my mind anyway) and still only potential. I hope he stays and gets better, but I can't see any bigger club willing to pay what we would want for him.

Some real crappy performances this season, I'm fed up with them.

Paul A Smith
104 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:18:17
Darren @100, he does, and Watkins is swinging your man Holgate's pair in the dressing room.
Kevin Prytherch
105 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:18:26
Holgate and Godfrey didn't have the best of games tonight, but they are young centre backs and will learn from games like this. I remember Jagielka getting ripped to bits by Lee Hughes the year before he was one of the best centre backs in the league. This is a partnership worth persevering with.

Although Holgate got caught with an inexcusable mistake, the amount of times our defence had the ball and had absolutely no options ahead of them was unbelievable. Without James, there is zero movement in midfield. The only player in the middle (except Allan as this isn't his game) who tried to get on the ball was Gomes, and he got taken off.

I still find it incredible how Brands escapes more criticism on here. We had, at one point, Sigurdsson, Iwobi and Delph in midfield. I wouldn't be confident against non-league clubs with that midfield. Bernard for Iwobi doesn't exactly change much. Can anyone honestly believe that those 4 in the same team would frighten any football league opposition?

How Ancelotti believes that, needing a win, any 3 of those 4 would produce results ahead of Davies or a more attacking King is beyond me. After 30 years of management, his substitutions should be better.

Another opportunity lost, another set of baffling subs. Groundhog Day.

Mike Regan
106 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:18:59
Utter shite again.

I hope to God he sells Richarlison in the summer – he's just not good enough!

Jerome Shields
107 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:19:04
Everton motivation-wise were not at the races from the start. In the first half, Pickford was having to make too many saves, for a team set up to principally defend.

Second half, Everton were far too loose and the finishing was absolutely dreadful. Calvert-Lewin cannot shoot to hit a barn door and Richarlison is a head-down merchant. They finally got what they deserved on that display.

Same old mid-table players who fail when points are needed. A lot of players didn't turn up as usual. Total lack of spirit. Thinking of their Summer holidays. Carlo will have to become Houdini to get into the European Conference League with these players.

When I look at the table and Everton need points to advance, it's been the same old story for over 20 years. Looked at the Table before the match and I had the same old feeling.

Fact: Everton are a mid-table side of two results and a loss. You can get a Top Manager and a shed full of money and Everton will give you the same results.

Kieran Kinsella
108 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:19:47
Andy Crooks

Speaking as an alleged “Carlo apologist”, I'd say he erred tonight in picking Iwobi ahead of? Anyone else.

He erred in leaving Tom out; he failed to motivate at the start and at half-time. Bringing on Delph was a mistake, bringing on King so late was pointless.

That said, our defenders are playing like they did under Silva when everyone blamed zonal marking. Maybe he wasn't that bad after all.

Alan Burnham
109 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:19:47
Time to ask serious questions about Ancelotti. Holgate should never have been on the pitch – an insult to Keane. But for Pickford, we could have been thrashed. So many mediocre players in our squad. Hopeless.
Ian Riley
110 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:20:05
It's Everton, Carlo will be offered a contract extension.

Please, please, please tell me what match we have played well this season? Matches we have won have been against teams in poor form.

Sorry but we have too many average Premier League players. Top 10 is all we deserve and all I can see for next season and beyond. I feel for our owner living through a pandemic and owning Everton!!

Neil Lawson
111 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:20:24
Europe? The only European matches this team will achieve are trips to Cardiff and Swansea.

It would be horribly embarrassing to play any half-decent (or quarter-decent) organised European team.

Darren Hind
112 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:20:59
I've got the next three nights off. I won't let this team ruin them.

Ron Sear
113 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:23:09
Well at least the 'players' won't be using social media at the moment so they can hold on to their belief that they can play as a football team.

Gawd, this was horrible to watch, it would be utterly embarrassing if they actually made it into Europe and they methodically destroyed the illusion of the quality of British football.

Derek Moore
114 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:23:32
The odd away form and home form are a concern, but in reality, I think the manager has done a fair enough job.

I've seen enough of this squad over the weeks, months, years to know as well as anyone else what the shortcomings are. Today, if we're lucky, should really serve as a fitting tombstone to this playing group as we know it.

We all know what they can do and we all know – we know painfully well – what they can't. I think we are far better under Ancelotti than under that clown Silva or that fat chancer Allardyce. Or the lazy Dutchman for that matter as well.

We are far better basically, but nowhere near good enough. We've got the equivalent of a veteran Ferrari mechanic, and we're gifting him half an Austin Allegro is how I would put it. I feel as though Ancelotti is getting the most out of a fairly shitty playing group if we're honest. I'm just not sure the wisdom of paying a guy like we're in the Champions League, when we're not; we don't deserve to be, and don't seem to be heading there anytime soon either.

This has to be now on Brands but he bafflingly has a new contract? Who knows what the fuck is going on?

But surely we didn't poach and pay the piper for this top and pedigreed European gaffer to manage this group right?

To my mind this is a huge transfer window really. We either move forward or we don't and if we don't then this is pretty pointless in truth.

Until the window though, I'm following the Everton players themselves based on today's shameful showing.

Thinking about anything except football and Everton.

Season 20-21 is over, boys, stay well and healthy and see you on here for the transfer tattle!

Kieran Kinsella
116 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:24:32
Andy 85,

To your poin,t The Athletic ran a piece saying Brands is impressed with Gordon's bench warming on loan and told Carlo he needs to be in the first team mix next season. Jesus wept...

Tom Harvey
117 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:24:36
Ancelotti is playing similar football to Moyes at the end of his 11 years, but without the cutting edge.
Colin Glassar
119 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:26:16
Everything that needs to be said has already been said. Therefore, I'll keep me trap shut.

Our season ended in February. The last couple of months have been an illusion.

Gary Willock
120 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:27:24
Villa were the better team all over the park. Looked like they had everything that we currently lack: ability to pass quickly and accurately, quick on the counter, skill and goal threats from 3-4 different players, etc.

Carlo has been simply too inconsistent this year - and it's reflected in the results. He's played multiple formations, and players (Gomes, Iwobi, Sigurdsson and Richarlison) in multiple positions. The team is disjointed, and lacks any identity.

No new contracts for anyone in the summer. If Carlo, Sigurdsson, Allan or even James want to be here for longer, then let them earn it in the run up to January or over course of next 12 months.

Other things I think we need to see :

- a consistent and preferred defence.
- a consistent shape and formation.
- players played in one position.
- youthful backup in every position, and then being given a chance if his preferred “experienced” players are not at the races.

Anything short of this, and maybe in 2022 we could afford to pay off the last 2 years of his deal and roll the dice again. Doing so now would be suicide, because nobody in their right mind would come here.

Barry Hesketh
121 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:27:54
Don't blame Martnez, Koeman, Silva, Walsh, et al they are not plying their trade at Everton FC any longer. Forget about the alleged crap squad that Ancelotti inherited, forget about the injuries or any other of the ready-made excuses that are trotted out on a regular basis.

During a normal season, If Evertonians were leaving Goodison Park having witnessed poor performance after poor performance and gob-smacking home defeat after gob-smacking home defeat, the airwaves, and the terraces would be calling for the head of the man in charge and they would be right in doing so.

I realise that these aren't normal times and that we're not the only team to struggle at home this season; however, there comes a point when we have to say enough is enough and I believe that that point has been reached.

We can't keep saying that Carlo has a plan when he clearly doesn't, we can't keep saying this addition or that addition will solve the issues because one or two players won't make such a significant difference, we can't continue to sign players that can't string 3 games – or 3 passes – together due to lack of fitness or lack of mental toughness or whatever it is that continues to thwart our ambitions.

For every derby victory at the enemy's ground, there is a home defeat to Newcastle, for every win at Spurs and Arsenal there's a home defeat to Burnley or Fulham, for each point gained on the road there's dropped points at home to Villa, Palace, Leeds, et al.

It's been a rubbish season, with some ridiculous performances and equally gob-smacking results, in ordinary times we'd be looking for a new manager, in ordinary times the baffling decision-making and tactics by Ancelotti would have received howls of derision from many fans.

The one thing that has been proven this season beyond all doubt, is that it's not the fans who are to blame when the Everton team plays badly or doesn't win, it's the manager, his players, and the tactics that this manager employs which is totally responsible for one of the worse seasons for Everton at Goodison in living memory.

Renew a season ticket next month? On the performances and results obtained at Goodison this season, it will have to be carefully weighed up as far as I'm concerned.

Mike Doyle
122 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:27:57
Absolute garbage – not helped by inexplicable substitutions.

According to other TW threads, 6,500 will be allowed into Goodison for the Wolves games. I wonder how many will turn up? And will they have cushions?

Jeff Armstrong
123 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:29:10
I would have any manager who has an imagination, leaves someone up at corners, plays a couple of kids, does not have his substitutes predicted half-an-hour before they happen! Even down to the actual subbed players and the minute!

Who picked Holgate?
Who picked Gomes?
Who brought Delph on?
Who ignores King and Nkounkou?
Who keeps everyone back for corners? Who allowed Kean to go on loan?
Who has the imagination of a caravan site?

Stephen Brown
124 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:29:17
You're getting to the point really where you'd ask which player would you keep? I honestly can't name many:

Pickford – maybe on current form
Coleman – great servant, great bloke... but now finished
Digne – since new contract not great but I'd keep
Holgate – please sell
Godfrey – keep
Allan – keep
Gomes – please sell
Iwobi – possibly worst pound for pound signing in history
Sigurdsson – no pace
Calvert-Lewin – keep unless bid of over 㿞m
Richarlison – fingers crossed someone bids silly money

What a job! How many of this lot get in Moyes's best team? How many get in Martinez's best team?

All on Easy Street and under no pressure to win.

Kieran Kinsella
125 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:29:43
I'd also quite like to kick James in the bollocks and ask him to rate the pain compared with his mysterious calf injury that pops up any time it's cold windy or he's asked to play more than 60 minutes in a fortnight. Talented player but seems like a complete wimp. Misses so many games yet never seems to require surgery or have a specific issue.
Simon Dalzell
126 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:30:29
Some poor players, and some under performing. Richarlison arguably the biggest culprit.

Getting the best out of what you've got is obviously the bottom line. Is Carlo doing this? Not even close. I see a tired man trapped in the headlights. A dinosaur of a man living on his past glories with teams full of stars.

This is now becoming a broken record. Week after week baffling selections. Holgate... Diabolical. Delph on as first sub again, and too late again, Bernard and King. He seems to be learning nothing. Hapless, dazed, confused. No plan, no clue.

The manager is a big handicap. These sentiments have been brewing for months. Tonight was the last straw.

Ian Edwards
127 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:30:41
Same team selections, negative formations and subs. One home win since Xmas. Mr Ancelotti... you're failing badly. Clear your desk and go.
Derek Moore
128 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:31:54
To be fair, Kieran, after you said that, I'd quite like to kick James in the bollocks as well. Not sure I'd start or stop there though.
Tony Twist
129 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:32:47
Everton may say the right things to external matters but they get it terribly wrong internally. You can see it in the way the team plays, there is no pressure to improve.

A typical Everton move would be to extend Sigurdsson's contract. He is exactly what is wrong with Everton, he does what he feels is enough for Everton; no more, no less and half the time he is made captain for it.

And as regards Big Dunc, he has to shoulder a portion of the blame also; he is ever present for the last few failures with regards managers, he needs to make a difference – not sit tight waiting for the big job.

The aging Ancelotti's time will end soon enough, Duncan needs to influence the spirit in this team if nothing else as I think we have prospered playing games without the crowds. When they return, timid little Everton will be in trouble again.

Stephen Vincent
130 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:33:24
It will cost Moshiri north of 㿅M to get rid of Ancelotti, so I suspect he will go nowhere.
Anthony Murphy
131 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:34:50
It's unbelievable how we struggle to string meaningful passes together. It's a rarity to see us pass the ball five times or more unless it's backwards or across the back line.

I used to hate our passing game under Martinez as it seemed unnecessary and at times lacking end product, but at least we passed it with a level of confidence.

We now just seem to treat the ball like a hot potato. We must be the worst passers of the ball in the Premier League.

Colin Wordsworth
132 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:35:04
Gomes cannot play against a pressing midfield; apparently he was too slow even for the Spanish league. We should never play him and Sigurdsson in the same side: no drive, no pace, no passion.
Colin Glassar
134 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:37:12
Calvert-Lewin and Richarlison need to take a look at that old geezer, Aguero. I know many on here only want us to buy kids and discard most players over 28 as having no resale value but, give me an Aguero, Dzeko or Cavani any day over some pimply-faced 18-year-old. Let's get Aguero!!

Just read that we are ready to make a bid for Sergio Aguero.

Jeff Armstrong
135 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:40:23
Ancelotti is clearly a busted flush, even if he was given 5 great players by Brands, he would still be negative in selecting, keep everyone back for corners, try to defend 1-0 leads, and often come unstuck, but would continually try the same thing every time he gets a lead, because that's his DNA. Once crowds come back to Goodison, he will not last long!
Kieran Kinsella
136 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:40:51
Richarlison needs to call up Brazilian Jo and ask him if he has any regrets, just so he knows what his future holder
Rob Dolby
137 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:41:59
No idea why we persist in trying to play from the back when we have 2 centre-backs that aren't good on the ball or have midfielders that look like they want the ball.

We give away soft goals every game. I would rather Keane and Mina play each week with Godfrey right-back and Coleman right mid.

Our poor build from the back play could have been punished multiple times. I don't see why we can't go more Route 1 at times to Calvert-Lewin and scrap for the 2nd ball.

Villa deserved the win and their 2nd goal was a cracking finish. We had very similar positions around the Villa box but couldn't even find the target nevermind test the keeper. Some right embarrassing efforts at shooting.

Pickford my MotM.

I am writing off Europe now and fully expect villa to finish above us.

I am putting our poor home form down to the lack of crowd. There is no way we would put up with stuff like this with a full house watching.

Big summer of transfer activity for the club and Ancelotti.

James Byrne
138 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:43:06
Most people will see another poor home performance. Points dropped etc.

Some fans might see it as a team trying their best to avoid the Europa League!

Nicolas Piñon
140 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:45:48
In order to get a chance of making it to Europe next season, we need to bring a quality midfielder, a quality right-back, and a quality centre-back. Apart from that, we must keep Richarlison, Calvert-Lewin, Digne, Allan Doucouré and Godfrey. All other players are secondary needs.

Personally, I would let go Bernard, Delph, Holgate and maybe Rodríguez (too much expectation for a player with too poor fitness).

I believe the problem in our squad is we have too many high-profile players with little hunger or humbleness, and football is about mixing personalities and styles of play. Gomes and Sigurdsson is the perfect example. Both in the same team gives no defensive equilibrium but, as we don't have other options (or because Ancelotti doesn't trust other options), we play inferior teams who run more and end up loosing.

The summer window will be key: Everton must get it right. Ancelotti made improvements this season, but he needs to work a lot in the summer cause not winning at home for so long won't be enough to cover all his Italian charm. Fans getting back to Goodison Park want wins, not words.

Tony Hill
141 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:46:02
Until we get rid of our underlying mental frailty, we will go nowhere. This is not about Ancelotti – though he has been mediocre – any more than it has been about other managers. It is about a culture of weakness and sentimentality.

That culture has been there, 4 or 5 years excepted, since the 1971 FA Cup semi-final. We delude ourselves if we get distracted from that central truth.

How do we fix it? Don't know. But it needs a type of magician.

I love the club and I wish everyone all the best on here, but I'm taking a couple of steps back. This is a very long project, if it is ever going to happen at all – which I doubt. At my age, peace of mind counts for a lot and, for my remaining years, I am going to look for more restful things.

UTFT.

Kevin Prytherch
142 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:46:02
Jeff @135,

What are the chances of Brands finding 5 great players?

I'll give him Doucoure and Digne, but every other success has been at the request of a manager.

Tony Everan
143 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:46:30
The midfield against Tottenham had its best game for months. We looked sharp and outplayed them. Why oh why change it again and again when something had clicked?

I'm struggling to understand any rhyme or reason to some of the decisions.

We were back to our disjointed and dysfunctional worst. The first half was a total mess, Holgate's transgression was a mere distraction to the appalling play throughout the team. The basics of passing and ball control were again, all too often elusive. At the top level, a team just can't get away with such poor basic play.

Without exaggeration, Aston Villa should have had five tonight. Only Pickford and the woodwork prevented it.

For me there needs to be a cooler head at centre-back. Mina or Keane with Godfrey.

Then there needs to be a level of organisation in midfield; Gomes and Delph are too slow for the modern Premier League, Sigurdsson is not a midfielder, he's a floater, a No 10 luxury. Iwobi tried today, but doesn't contribute enough to justify being selected.

Carlo has to get a grip and stop fielding teams that are weak in midfield. Every home defeat this season has stemmed from it.

Jeff Armstrong
144 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:46:37
Stephen Vincent, 㿅 million buys you an average player these days, managers are relatively cheap to change compared to players.

For fuck's sake, Gomes cost 㿀 million, Iwobi 㿈 million, we would be happy just getting them both off the wage bill!

Getting rid of Ancelloti would be cheap at the price.

Roman Sidey
145 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:50:17
The vitriol toward Ancelotti I understand, but I just don't agree with it. The players signed since he came in (King aside but it's harsh to judge him after about 35 minutes of football in 4 months) have all been better than what was already at the club.

He is still having to work with about a dozen players who simply aren't good footballers or who are years past their best. Anyone who's coached any sport at any level knows you can go over and over and over the basics until you're blue in the face but, at the end of it all, it's what's between the players' ears that is the biggest factor.

With the exception of perhaps Sigurdsson (who has other major issues) & perhaps Digne, none of the players Ancelotti inherited can be described as smart footballers.

Kieran Kinsella
146 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:50:48
Jeff,

If we sack Carlo, we have the same muppets in the squad who've failed four managers. At this point are proven to be shit, so sacking Carlo would be cheaper but we'd still suck. I'm hoping they we replace the worst players and find Carlo isn't the problem. If he is a problem he's a secondary one, the main problem is the legacy of Walsh's spending spree.

Joe McMahon
147 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:50:48
Colin, Aguero will be wanted by a few clubs, unfortunately I can't think of a reason why he would choose Everton. Any everyone would offer him big money. I'd just be happy with Tammy Abraham, and concentrate on right back, and 3 new midfielders with pace, but ain't gonna happen.
Michael Connelly
148 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:51:12
Surprised we didn't go with 3 at the back this evening; maybe Mina wasn't 100%.

Coleman only works as a wing back these days, and was poor for the winner. Wide open in the first half with a back 4.

Iwobi offers fuck all; Gomes likewise. Richarlison can't hold onto the ball. Sigurdsson wasn't great, but at least he had been playing well.

Doucouré badly missed, but he's not perfect either.

Stephen Vincent
149 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:51:53
Jeff, you are absolutely correct, but if you add it all up under Moshiri compensation to managers is almost £100m and it must stop somewhere.
Kieran Kinsella
150 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:55:44
“Young” Holgate has now played with SEVEN different men on the managers bench at Everton. Galloway and Browning must be kicking themselves
Tony Twist
151 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:56:07
Sorry but I don't want Ancelotti anywhere near the purchasing of players now. It's time for one person to shoulder the responsibility and with that the blame. It's Brands'a job; it is time he did his full job.

Time to do his homework and buy young players that have the necessary fitness, dedication and skill and that are young and devise a team that can press teams when necessary and transition effectively. A team of steel that understands that winning matches is what it is all about.

We are not a retirement home for players.

Frank Fearns
152 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:58:37
It can't get any worse than that can it? So disorganised, unable to pass the ball, unable to control the ball, woeful in defence and just no confidence in striking the ball in forward positions. I dread to think what it would have been like with the crowd there. I really do not know what this team is about. I see other " lesser" teams putting so much into their game with pace and commitment and I look at this bunch of players who are supposed to be better given the staggering amount of money each receives but put I woeful performances in this and so many other matches. I should know better having followed Everton for donkeys years. I despaire again.
Paul A Smith
153 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:58:41
I can't believe people can watch that game and have nothing but criticism for the manager.

They can't even pass to each other. Richarlison and Gomes pass to the opposition more than some of the opposition pass to each other.

We are all gobsmacked by James because he can pass a ball consistantly.

Calvert-Lewin lines a shot up on his instep and somehow slices it.

Poor subs? Fucking hell – look at the bench.

Love to know how any manager changes the game from the bench with nothing better to choose from than what is on the pitch.

Lev Vellene
154 Posted 01/05/2021 at 22:59:11
Pathetically predictable...
Thomas Richards
155 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:02:05
Anyone defending or deflecting away from Holgate's performance needs to have a word with themselves.
Colin Glassar
156 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:02:09
Joe 147, I'd add players like:

Harry Winks
Dele Alli
Max Aarons
Tammy Abrahams
The kid from Brentford

There are good, young(ish) players out there who could resurrect their careers (like Lingard) if given the chance.

Hugh Jenkins
157 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:04:29
I love this site.

Carlo Ancelotti – who has won absolutely everything in the game as a player and a manger – comes to Everton... and he turns to shite?

in the past, of couse, every team he has managed has been bought and polished before he arrived. He never had to pick the team, or make substitutions – they were all pre-ordained and made for him. In fact, the guy has never done anythinhg usefull in his life.

And then, in 2019, he rolls up at Everton's door at the time that we happen to be looking for a new manager?

We didn't chase him, of course, because of his past reputation! And, there were no other sides in the mix that might have liked to get him as manager at the time. But, looking for an "easy berth", he chose Everton and that is how we ended up with him.

So, having saddled him with a squad of misfits from previous transfer windows, we expect him to produce us a "Champions League" qualifying team in his first full season with us.

I am getting fed up with reading the "I could do better with this squad" comments on here. Some of us / you need to start gettin back in touch with reality.

If anyone is in a false positin in the leaguie, we are, because, with our current squad, I reckon 15th would flatter us.


John Raftery
158 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:05:11
It is interesting to note that when we played Villa in August 2019 we had Coleman and Digne at full back, Keane and Mina at centre back, Gomes, Sigurdsson and Schneiderlin in midfield, Calvert-Lewin and Richarlison in attack. We lost 2-0.

Our lack of pace, power and quality in midfield was a problem then. Without Doucouré and James, it remains just as much of a problem nearly two seasons later.

Kieran Kinsella
159 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:08:27
Hugh,

Precisely. Keane has veered between decent and terrible under six managers; Sigurdsson has hidden from the ball under the same number; Pickford ditto; Holgate under 7; and so on.

But yeah, Carlo is entirely to blame. He made in my view errors today but that's just a sub plot to the shitness of the long-term players.

Barry Hesketh
160 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:09:05
Coleman, Sigurdsson, and James have been mentioned in despatches as perhaps extending their contracts in the last few weeks. No to all of them. Yes, they have provided moments in their Everton careers, and in Coleman's case, very many good performances. But if Everton FC wants to be involved in European football, then they should allow those contracts to be run down and allow any of those players to leave when the opportunity arises.

The club should also be looking to replace the very many players who are just not up to scratch with hungrier, younger players who can be developed, such as Godfrey, and then, with luck in 2 or 3 years, we may have a decent side.

Hanging on to ageing players who are possibly better than the younger ones currently in the squad, is a recipe for failure and Everton has been down this road far too often. I'm certainly fed up with the ground-hog nature of watching Everton and yearn for some radical changes at the club.

I have seen not a lot of progress in the last 18 months and it could be argued that we have actually regressed.


Paul Swan
161 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:12:32
Completely pissed off with everything to do with this team at the moment.

Ancelotti is showing absolutely no difference to the last 3 managers, in fact, the standard of football is unbelievably worse. Give him more windows and you will simply waste more years.

And before the cries go up ‘Who would you replace him with?' – I don't know. But what I do know is that this is not working.

Same mistakes, week-in & week-out, but he gets a Get Out of Jail Free card based on his CV.

I'm completely disillusioned with the entire situation at the moment and have no desire to pay to watch this turgid crap next season.

Si Cooper
162 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:13:49
Interesting perspectives on this game. I didn't see the overall midfield display as the main problem tonight; we know we lack drive without Doucouré and the creativity quotient nosedives without James.

Schoolboy defending, shocking decision-making when attacking, and absolutely pathetic attempts at shooting handed the balance of the game to Villa.

What has happened to pairing Richarlison with Digne on the left? When you put Richarlison central or on the right, he seems to lose his peripheral vision and also displaces Calvert-Lewin from where he has been his most effective.

Bringing on Delph looked pointless, just a waste of a substitution. Surely it was worth giving Josh King 20 minutes and just going for the win?

Manager and players equally culpable for me.

Svein-Roger Jensen
163 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:14:40
The "Bottlers" Strike Again!!!

They ruin every weekend!!!

Kieran Kinsella
164 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:16:10
At least if we are not in Europe we will have more time to claim we didn't care about the Carabao Cup anyway...
Ian Edwards
165 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:16:24
Hugh Jenkins. Rubbish.

We are supposedly chasing Europe, drawing at home, and Ancelotti brings on a defensive midfielder. He continuously plays the same failing formation at home. Never tries anything different.

He ould start King with Calvert-Lewin and play Richarlison deeper running at people. We have so many players deep that we have to go backwards. Holgate lost the first goall turning to pass back as there were no forward options.

One home win since Xmas. He is no better than Allardyce. In fact, I would say he worse.

Forget what he did years ago with other clubs. It's what he is doing now that counts and it is shite. Get him out. Now.

Terry Farrell
166 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:20:13
I said it 6 months ago and we are still doing it! You cannot start with Iwobi, Sigurdsson and Gomes in a midfield of 5 and think we can win the game unless we get lucky.

Yes, we missed chances... but Villa dominated and without Jack Grealish they are half the team. You need mobility, speed and tackling ability in midfield and expecting Allan and Richarlison to manage all of it is unrealistic.

Another massive opportunity wasted!!!!!!!

Svein-Roger Jensen
167 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:21:04
What a cowardly performance!!!
Colin Glassar
168 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:25:47
Great post, Hugh. Like many on here, I get frustrated with our zombie-like performances but, after watching the highlights on MotD, you realise we have a lot of zombie players, ie, slow in foot and mind.

Villa ran us off the park for large parts of the game because their players are quicker and more energetic than ours. Gomes, Sigurdsson, Allan etc are slow. Tom Davies and Bernard are weak and slow. Iwobi is shite. Rodriguez is slow. Without any velocity in midfield, we are sitting ducks for attack-minded teams.

Say what you want about Ancellotti but neither Pep, Nagelsmann, Klopp, Tuchel, Eddie Howe, Fat Sam, Harry Potter or any other saviour you have in mind could improve our current midfield.

We are where we are because we have slow, weak-minded players who can't cope under pressure.

Mark Wilson
169 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:26:37
Crushing disappointment. Everything to play for, a performance so poor it's hard to describe.

The team and squad is an embarrassment. We don't compete, we are often a disorganised bunch of passionless but very rich young guys who seem determined to make us a laughing stock but are incapable of understanding what's at stake. In these circumstances, any other manager presiding over this shite would be under huge pressure.

But no fans in stadiums, alongside the guy's undeniable likeability etc etc, offer him a degree of protection not seen by most of his predecessors.

I've typed this. I've re read it. Yet I somehow cannot believe we've just done it again. Tossed away a very, very, real chance of decent European football next year. Surely everyone else around us can't lose tomorrow?

Hugh Jenkins
170 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:28:42
Ian Edwards (165) – Rubbish! We were totally out-classed and out-played. It was clear that their players wanted it far more than ours did.

Often, you can blame that on the manager... but, in this case, I don't think you can... because only 4 of them are his signings.

You tell me who he could have brought on from that bench that would have changed the game in our favour – and I will say again "Rubbish", becuase that is your opinon – not fact.

Grow up and begin to realise that we are dealing here with the real world – not fantasy football. Last time I looked, Roy of the Rovers hadn't actaully signed for us and, until he does, keep your fantasy predicitions where they belong.

Rob Dolby
171 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:37:16
Ian 165. Who do you want to replace Ancelotti with?

This is one of the most bizarre seasons. Best away form for 30 years and worst home form.

Out of possession in away games we seem to play deep and have a shape to our play.

At home, it's like 11 strangers on the pitch with us looking exposed every time we lose possession.

I can't see where our next win is coming from. We have no momentum at all.

Ian Edwards
172 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:38:00
The real world, Hugh, is that we have a manager that is producing the worst results at home for decades. Not sure why you're happy with that.

I'm surprised why people expect better from a manager sacked by his last three clubs who is proving to be worse than Allardyce.

No wonder he lost in Istanbul.

Svein-Roger Jensen
173 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:43:23
I am writing with regard to my absolute astonishment and disbelief as to the sheer magnitude of the team's complete lack of talent and failure to carry out the jobs for which they are paid to do.

Let me just say that they have collectively reached a level of inadequacy and ineptitude that neither I nor modern science had previously considered possible.

Paul A Smith
174 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:44:53
If we sign Coutinhio we make this slow side another yard slower. We can't be making desperate moves like this to improve surely?
Jeff Armstrong
175 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:45:00
Let's face fact: Ancelloti is okay at managing great players. He is obviously useless at managing average players. End of debate.

Where we go from here is a question, but Ancelloti is not the answer.

Thomas Richards
176 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:45:22
A little less passion if you don't mind, Svein.
Bill Gall
177 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:45:56
It is all very well saying "Let's buy Aguero" but he needs someone to pass the ball into the spaces he can score from. The midfield we had today couldn't pass wind – never mind give a decent pass to a forward.

We all watch the game and have our own opinions, but the one thing that keeps cropping up seems to be a lack of commitment and that is the manager's problem. It seems he keeps picking the same players who have the same lack of concentration, unable to pass to a player to run onto; instead they pass to a player who is marked.

There is something fundamentally wrong when, watching a game, you are fully aware of when the opposition is going to score, and not surprised when they do.

We are not the only team who needs new players; apart from the top 4/6, every team would like new players but they usually turn up with a game plan and commitment to get a result. We seem to have a number of players who just turn up for the game with no reaction, win or lose.

No matter who he plays, Ancelotti should be able to get a better reaction from the players at the club than what he is, and regardless, he should leave them on the bench when they are not making the effort, and riding on the back of those players who make the effort.

It seems every season we are bringing out the same excuse, wait till next season when the manager brings in some new players and we will see an improvement. So far, any improvements we have made only seem temporary, and it is a sad thing that a club the stature of Everton will have to rely on the reputation of a manager to bring players to the club.

If we continue to perform at these levels we are at, I am afraid that Ancelotti's reputation will soon tarnish.

Mike Price
178 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:46:59
The scary thing is, we have actually been very lucky in lots of games this season. Not something you associate with Everton – and worrying because we haven't played well or dominated a single team in any competition, despite spending hundreds of millions and paying millions on a relic ‘Hollywood' manager.
Svein-Roger Jensen
179 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:47:47
This may sound like an exaggeration, but believe me when I say that I have passed kidney stones which have brought me a greater level of pleasure and entertainment than watching these worthless excuses for professional footballers attempt to play a game they are clearly incapable of playing, week-in & week-out.
Trevor Peers
180 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:51:53
Carlo is good at coaching world class players, but how many of them type of players is he likely to bring to Everton? None that are young enough and good enough, is the answer.

So the truth is he's the wrong man for us; we need a great organizer... not a motivator of great players.

Moshiri hasn't got a clue who is the right manager for us and we will continue to struggle, I'm afraid. Carlo will be here for 2 more years for sure, unless we get involved in a relegation scrap. Pretty grim outlook with no quick fix.

Barry Hesketh
181 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:53:49
Hugh @170

There it is, their players wanted it more than ours did; how can that be the case? We had an outside chance of bringing European football to Goodison next season; Villa were playing largely for pride although, given tonight's result, it wouldn't surprise me if they finished above Everton.

Fulham, Newcastle, West Ham, and other teams have also looked hungrier than Everton at Goodison Park this season, which cannot be accepted by any of us under any manager.

Ancelotti takes the credit when the team plays well and when it wins, but he has to take the flak when either or both of those things don't happen. Even when Everton has gained all the points – mostly on the road – they haven't been great performances and on most occasions the performances have been riddled with poor play and incompetence, that is the real issue that makes some of us question whether Ancelotti is actually worth his salary and has us asking if long-term will he prove to be the solution or one of the problems.

Why should his critics provide a list of who should manage Everton? We have no say on that; it's up to Moshiri and the Board to decide upon that. We can only judge on what we see on the pitch and mostly it's been very unsatisfactory.

Svein-Roger Jensen
182 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:55:25
I ask you to please take matters into your hands. Use your imagination, guys – strangle yourselves or cover yourself in tinfoil and take a fork to a nearby plug socket, or something. Just put yourselves and us fans out of our collective misery.
Michael Stancis
183 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:56:38
There are some players in this team who I honestly have the same level of hatred towards them as Liverpool players.

Gutless, spineless and pathetic. If we finish in Europe this season, then I don't know whether to think those we finished above are actually shite or if we have been the luckiest team ever.

André Gomes is the slowest player in the Premier League, let alone at the club. I'd even go and say he is up there with the worst midfielder in the league. Never ever want to see him in an Everton shirt.

Alex Iwobi is actually the most hopeless Everton player I have ever seen. And I saw Kone and Niasse. Headless chicken would be an improvement. I never want to see him in an Everton shirt again.

Fabian Delph... Why? Just why???

Mason Holgate is just a cocky little fucker. Does not matter what level you play at or experience you have. That first goal is absolutely disgusting from him. But an average player with arrogance. Always a sign of trouble ahead. Get rid.

The rest were poor tonight. Not up for it bar from Pickford and maybe Calvert-Lewin. The rest were poor as usual at home.

Carlo Ancelotti's substitutions are an absolute joke at times. Only one player had come off the bench this season and scored in the league. 33 Games and only one sub has scored. And that was a penalty. Disgusting. Not Carlo's fault that one. But the Delph for Gomes one is like replacing diahrrea with vomit. Worse than the other.

Richarlison and Calvert-Lewin have only scored in the same league game once this season. And yes one was a penalty.

Never a team game or performance, is it? We get outrun every game, we can't attack, we can't defend and, worst of all, there are no leaders on the bastard pitch. Where was the leader to give Holgate a fucking earache after that goal??? All far too nice to one another.

Same old, same old same bottle job and 'flatter to deceive' Everton. Once again, we have mentally tapped out due to the thought of being competitive. Bottlejobs the lot of them.

One home win in ten... Vile!

Any one who writes match reports on this game may as well just copy and paste their report from the Newcastle, Fulham or Burnley games. Might as well do it for Wolves and Sheffield United too.

Laughing stock we are. Sooner the season finishes the better. Fuck off, Everton.

Svein-Roger Jensen
184 Posted 01/05/2021 at 23:59:31
So, in summary, you pack of repugnant, sputum-filled, invertebrate bastards, leave this club now and don't you dare look back. You've consistently demonstrated less passion and desire than can commonly be found within the contents of a sloth's scrotum, so frankly you can just all fuck off – don't pass go, don't collect your wages, don't ever come back again.
Jeff Armstrong
185 Posted 01/05/2021 at 00:01:37
Correct Barry, the continued question for anyone criticising Ancelloti is “who would you rather have?”
my answer is, Ancelloti, but doing a lot better than he has been.
(“Has been” being the scary bit!)
Jerome Shields
186 Posted 01/05/2021 at 00:03:02
This lack of motivation when needed to gain points is a perennial Everton problem. It has happened under successive managers and right through the Moyes era. It also affected the motivation of transfered in players. There must be something wrong with the culture that exists at Finch Farm for Everton to have a trait that those fans who have followed Everton for years, clearly recognise.


Thomas Richards
187 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:05:38
That's more like it, Svein.

Bravo!

Rob Dolby
188 Posted 01/05/2021 at 00:06:10
Svein 179. Are you a character from an Ingmar Bergman film? Fin.

Mike 178. Lucky, you don't know the half. Luxury, we used to sleep in a shoe box in the middle of the road.

Ian 172. Change the record mate. Every Evertonian is frustrated at what we are watching. The final line of 172 looks like pure bait and is embarrassing.

Anthony Murphy
189 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:09:21
Svein, I don't know how long you have been posting on ToffeeWeb but please, never stop 😂
Kieran Kinsella
190 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:09:48
Svein @184,

You and I cry, but the sun is still in the sky and shining above you. Let me hear you sing once more like you did before Sing a new Song, Chiquita.

Svein-Roger Jensen
191 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:13:17
I considered, for a second, that I was perhaps being a little too harsh. But then I recalled that I have blindly given them all the benefit of the doubt for too long now. Yes, for too long they have failed to earn the air they've been breathing by offering any kind of tangible quality as footballers. As such, I feel it's only fair that they are sent packing!!!
Jeff Armstrong
192 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:18:27
Now how could I, a pipefitter who's been on the ale since 4pm, go on the Live Forum at half-time (8:50 pm) and predict Ancelloti's subs in the next half, not only the names, but the actual minutes they would happen???

If I was on a betting site, I could make a fortune...

This manager is a complete waste of money, time, and discussion. He is going through the motions; this time next year he will be history.

Bill Gall
193 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:19:14
If anybody can't understand the problem – and that includes Ancelotti – just look at our fabulous Goal Difference of +3. That in the case of same number of points as other teams, is a loosing position.
John Boon
194 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:21:46
So many loyal Evertonians and ToffeeWebbers are criticised for posting negative responses. Please, it is almost impossible to find anything positive when watching Everton play home games this season. Plus the fact that we have been very lucky in many away games.

As an 80+ fan, I hate wishing any part of my life away by the usual "I wish this season would be over"... Unfortunately that is just how I feel after watching one more inept display.

I have been fortunate enough to have witnessed "Great" Everton teams. This certainly is not one of them. But it is not just the system; the true fact, whether we like it or not, is that we just do not have enough good players. I just hope Moshiri has plenty of money because we will need to spend a bundle to get anywhere near a decent team.

Svein-Roger Jensen
195 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:25:11
In the event that our beloved owner can't afford the expense (understandable given that he's soon going to have to assemble a new squad from scratch), then I am prepared to sell my family (including my unborn child) to a dubious consortium of Middle Eastern businessmen in order to pay for the flights. I'll drive you there myself, one by one, without sleep, if I have to.
Stephen Vincent
196 Posted 01/05/2021 at 00:25:22
Hugh #157, you are wrong. He wasn't expected to produce a Champions League team in a season and a half, what we were entitled to expect was a team that was well coached and motivated and that played to a consistent positive game plan.

I can forgive non-qualification for Europe but not the spineless, clueless negativity we have witnessed over the past 6 months.

Please don't give me "What can you expect from the squad he inherited?" What I do expect is a motivated group of players and I expect at the end of a game to be able to say they did their best. With a few exceptions I haven't seen any evidence of that for a long time.

I mean, Iwobi... does anyone coach him on the art of crossing a football? Delph ahead of Davies? Sigurdsson and Richarlison, clearly hugely talented footballers, who turn up at matches when they want and wander around aimlessly when they want.

Lloyd Brodrick
197 Posted 01/05/2021 at 00:27:10
Absolutely shocking!

How can they call themselves professional footballers? Cannot time a pass, cannot hit a 190+ ft² target, poor control, cannot beat a man... it's pathetic.

Kieran Kinsella
198 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:29:36
Rob Dolby

Ingmar Bergman – lol. Made me smile, which is a first after that game.

Kieran Kinsella
199 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:32:11
Michael 183

Just to be clear, you feel we could have done better?

Farhad Zaman
200 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:35:02
I'm not as articulate as you guys, but I will give it a bash and try and make my points.

I'm a Londoner through and through, my brothers support Arsenal & Spurs, and all my cousins, like most Asians, follow Liverpool, and some Manchsester United.

I like to be different and somehow I picked Everton at aged 11 – not even knowing where they were based. I'm now 41! It was the season where Peter Beardsley moved that I started to follow The Toffees properly. In that time, I've only seen the FA Cup win in 1995.

I have so much I want to say, but I'll start by saying I have more than my doubts about Ancelotti. Some of his previous aides were so talented, that they more or less managed themselves, and he was the perfect figurehead massaging big egos to good effect etc.

If you look at the end of his time at Bayern Munich and also Napoli, a lot of the players complained about the training and the intensity etc. If you watch our training sessions that the club post on YouTube etc, I often see James (when he's actually fit) just standing and talking to Ancelotti. The whole training sessions to me more resemble a group of mates having a little kick about in the park.

The team we started off with this season had a real balance, and all the players playing in the right positions. With a fit squad, I trust Carlo to pick the right team. But no team, particularly Everton will ever have a fully fit squad to play all season, and this is when Carlo's team selections and tactics baffle me totally.

Today's team should have been:

Pickford
Coleman Mina Godfrey Digne
Davies
Allan Gomes
Iwobi (as James was injured)
Calvert-Lewin Richarlison

I know I'll get so much stick for Iwobi, and we can do far better than him, but, to be fair to him, he's either a Number 10 or on the left-hand side, linking play with Digne overlapping, and never ever ever ever a right winger like Carlo sticks him out there to play. Yes, he had a couple of useful games there, but he's simply a square peg in a round hole out there

As we all know, our midfielders all need to play in a 3 to be remotely useful. Gbamin is the only natural holding midfielder and we all know what's happening to him injury-wise. But, if he's injured, then Davies has shown it has to be him in the Number 6 role. Allan and Doucouré are box-to-box midfielders who can track back but do not hold their positions like Gbamin or Davies would. And Gomes plays far better with a holding midfielder behind him, and a box-to-box player next to him. I know we need to upgrade massively on Gomes but, while he's here, when selected, it should only be in a 3 and with the right balance, as I picked.

One thing I'm going to bring up, and I want you guys to let someone in the club know: Why oh why oh why has no-one picked up that Ben Godfrey is a left-sided centre-back???

Go and watch his games at Norwich, or ask Daniel Farker where he played him, and ask Ben himself, and he will tell you this too. This is why he was comfortable at left-back, and each time he played on the left of a 2 at centre-back or left of a 3, like against Liverpool, he is far more comfortable. He is a right-footed left-centre-back like Gary Cahill was all these years, and Virgil van Dijk etc.

And Mason Holgate is a right-sided central defender, whose best position – and only position where he is good – is the right centre-back of a back 3.

So what does Carlo do??? He plays them the wrong way round!!! Godfrey has always looked so much less effective on the right side, and even at right back; just because he's right footed doesn't mean he'd be comfortable there. I've noticed since England U21s played Godfrey on the right-hand side, Carlo must have thought "Oh, that must be his position!" I mean, for crying out loud – that was Aidy Boothroyd picking him there, so of course it would be wrong!!

Just watch how uncomfortable Holgate and Godfrey look, playing the opposite of their best sides, and yes I know you will all say they are pro footballers and it shouldn't make a difference... but with these two it does.

If Carlo has a much stronger squad with players all flexible and comfortable on the ball, he will do well. But I think Carlo is a luxury kind of manager.

I personally would die for a modern day manager in the mould of Thomas Tuchel who can work with the players and also know the importance of intensity and athleticism in today's game.

We desperately need: Max Aarons, Bissouma, Ousman, Dembele, Zaha, or players of this ilk. And add to that Coutinho, Isco as James Rodriguez will never be fully fit all season.

I know this ain't PlayStation but I'd fund the players of that type by selling Moise Kean, Calvert-Lewin and Richarlison and many of the deadwood. We'd get good money for all the above. And for sure sell Keane, keep Mina, sell Holgate, and by two more centre-backs who have pace but are comfortable on the ball.

Richarlison is a good finisher, but his all-round play will never be good enough, I feel; his touch, awareness and passing is atrocious. I'd even have Anthony Martial if we could instead of him.

So sorry for the long essay, but I'm just on my own as an Everton fan in London and I have to have this rant. This team just drains the life out of us Evertonans. Every time we have a chance to make inroads... we flip.

I give up as "It's the hope that kills you," as they say, and I'm losing hope; we will forever be the team that just makes up the numbers.

Brian Wilkinson
201 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:53:39
More worrying, we have 4 games inside of 10 days, half of these struggle to last 90 minutes or one game a week.

You would expect the likes of Nkounkou, Broadhead or King given some game time to ease the fixture congestion, but you just know it will be the same starting 11 starting one week, the usual subs coming on.

Then, the following game, those who came on, will start the next game, with the three players coming off rested on the bench, until coming on in the second half... nearly always the same 14 players, every single match.

Don Alexander
202 Posted 01/05/2021 at 00:58:11
Yet another anaemic, ambitionless performance with the usual traits of incompetent passing, poor control and pedestrian pace.

Tony Hill (#141) completely sums it up regarding our Premier League history. It's an embarrassment to us, delivered on a plate for decades by our self-described greatest fan, and now the muppet he's conned into buying us.

I suggest it's also resulted in us being regarded Europe-wide, for decades now, as the softest touch in our league. I'm sure we're seen as the English version of Espanyol (they're the other team in Barcelona if you're wondering, runners-up twice in the Uefa Cup being the pinnacle of their "success").

This is what Farhad Moshiri and his trusted advisors have delivered over 5 years — at significant expense.

This summer, Farhad Moshiri has to decide on how much more he and his advisors wish to invest to sign players with basic competencies such as accurate passing, positioning and shooting. Pace is more than "desirable" too. It's essential.

If he doesn't provide the basic ingredients to Ancelotti, he may as well bin him and sign Sean Dyche, a man who makes mince seem like gourmet fare to a(nother?) ravingly loyal, but peculiarly accepting of mere survival, fan-base.

Kevin Dyer
203 Posted 02/05/2021 at 01:01:32
#86 Richard did you notice that Watkins was chewing gum? Does that make him arrogant also? What does chewing gum have to do with anything?
Tom Harvey
204 Posted 02/05/2021 at 01:06:57
Hugh Jenkins @ 170

"you can blame that on the manager – but, in this case, I don't think you can, because only 4 of them are his signings."

Hello Hugh,

This is professional football and practically every manager who joins a club, joins the club having no players that are his. What he has, he works with, motivates and sets them up to win.

You're basically implying we have to wait 2 or 3 years for players who are loyal and grateful to Ancelotti for being brought to the club before we can see any decent football or consistency.

Morinho was sacked because he couldn't get what he had at the club going.

Ancelotti so far has not shown anything to suggest he can pick the right teams / tactics and send out highly motivated teams on a regular basis. He certainly makes some questionable in-game decisions when under pressure.

Gavin Johnson
205 Posted 02/05/2021 at 01:15:49
The new contract and pay rise has gone to Holgate's head. He was abysmal tonight...

Gomes and Iwobi need to be offloaded, along with the usual suspects, this summer... But who would want them?!

Maybe a loan move back to Portugal or Spain for Gomes, but I can't think of any club who would want Iwobi, not for fee anyway. He's got to be up there with worst buys in Premier League history for the money we paid.

Kevin Dyer
206 Posted 02/05/2021 at 01:22:46
We have many problems as a team and Carlo absolutely knows this.

This was us playing a high line, pressing actively and playing on the front foot, which many on here have clamoured for – and we saw the result. No doubt losing Rodriguez in the warm-up made us less effective with the ball, but the gameplan couldn't be changed. Villa hit the channels with direct balls behind our high fullbacks all first half. They didn't play through us, so how our midfield and Iwobi were responsible I have no Idea.

Holgate made a bad error which cost us a goal but they could have scored another 2 or 3 first half that had nothing to do with him. Better defenders than him have been caught in possession like that. I seem to recall Virgil van Dijk doing this early season.

I thought the players tried hard and were desperate to win but the gaps we left were brutally exploited.

We're just not that good. We've been outperforming our metrics all season. Offensively we are in the bottom third of the league in most categories, except chance conversion, iirc.

Richarlison is having a stinker, doesn't make him a bad player but no-one is undroppable. Calvert-Lewin relies on service. James is fragile. Iwobi was decent today, carried the ball well, but lacks cutting edge. Gomes is a good recycling midfielder but offers no goals, assists or defensive cover. Sigurdsson is dangerous and runs all day but can only play as a No 10. Allan's a great player but needs another combative midfielder alongside him as he is not fast.

Ancelotti doesn't trust the bench.

Delph, whilst unpopular, was not to blame for that loss, although not sure why he's getting game time ahead of Davies, who has a future at Everton.

Dreadful result but wouldn't be at all shocked if we beat West Ham Utd next week and Villa away after that.

Svein-Roger Jensen
207 Posted 02/05/2021 at 01:24:48
Spineless embarrassing performance... and it hurts — especially when 6 points were up for grabs!!!
John Kavanagh
208 Posted 02/05/2021 at 02:11:37
I'm so pissed off with Everton, I can no longer even be bothered to join the justified anger on TW at the repeated failures that we know will once again be there for all to see next season.

Another Groundhog shit season that we know will be repeated year-in & year out – regardless of how much money is put in and who the manager is.

Colin Malone
209 Posted 02/05/2021 at 03:22:27
Michael Keane being dropped raises questions for me about Carlo...
Kieran Kinsella
210 Posted 02/05/2021 at 03:33:06
Kenwright is the only explanation.

We've tried every kind of manager (young upcomers, Champions League winners, long-ball merchants, hard workers, mercenaries); we've tried every kind of signing (world class, heart-on-sleeve, young, old, British, foreign)... yet, over 25 years, we remain stagnant.

Other teams float past us from obscurity and win silverware (Portsmouth, Leicester, Swansea); our old rivals continue to win. Yet we just remain 8th-ish.

The only explanation is that Kenwright joined some kind of Satanic kabal whereby he made a deal with the devil for control of the club at the expense of the one thing that matters: success.

Kenwright Out!

Brian Murray
211 Posted 02/05/2021 at 04:13:17
He will hang on for dear life if Carlo succeeds or not. That's modern day Everton. It's ingraine.

Case in point: Seamus Coleman is offered a job for life. Same with Baines, although he loves the club too much just to take a wage.

Roman Sidey
213 Posted 02/05/2021 at 04:15:15
Kevin Dyer, the difference between Holgate running around chewing gum and Watkins doing it is the latter is actually working hard and doing his job whilst the former has been putting in barely any effort and stinking the place out. The lad can barely kick a ball properly and he walks around like he's King Dick.
Steve Brown
214 Posted 02/05/2021 at 04:26:40
Poor selection, tactical set-up and substitutions from Ancelotti. Terrible performances across the team. Pickford had a blinder, Calvert-Lewin worked his backside off with no service and Allan was solid and that was it.

Some comments on the game:

a) Holgate has not been in the form all season to play CB in a back four.
b) Godfrey is a left-footed centre-back, so play him there.
c) Any midfield combination of Gomes - Allan - Delph - Sigurdsson is too slow for the Premier League.
d) Sigurdason – who I have slated – was good until we moved him out wide left.
e) Why did Tom Davies not start with Allan?
f) Richarlison has been woeful for weeks and needs dropping.
h) We are so poor at the moment that we look better without the ball than we do with it.
i) We need more pace and energy in midfield next season.

Phil Smith
215 Posted 02/05/2021 at 04:28:53
Once again our defence is gifting the opposition goals and Richarlison is completely ineffective/inept up front. I'd rather he played Bowler and Broadhead to play off Calvert-Lewin than Richarlison and Iwobi but he would never try and mix things up.

We have to spank West Ham or that's our season over.

Alan J Thompson
216 Posted 02/05/2021 at 06:03:22
Just finished watching the match on a dodgy service. Everton scored and I thought 1-0 but the commentator said that they had drawn level and the stupid thing had gone straight past their first goal so spent a while going back to find it and haven't read any postings here either.

"Howler" Holgate probably wishes everybody's service by-passed it, another "footballing" defender who manages a goal every couple of games. Like the love of overlapping full backs, they must be able to defend first and stop the silly, avoidable errors. Attractive football is one thing, stupidity is quite another.

Then we had Richarlison and Calvert-Lewin who don't seem to be on the same wavelength and while the lad comes in for more than enough criticism why do we continue playing Iwobi as a right winger when he so obviously isn't, even as a late inclusion.

And then the almost obligatory substitution around the hour mark but seriously, Delph? The only thing that came to mind was a rehash of an old standby, in this case, The Manager sees more of him in the Sick Bay and Recovery Room than we do.

With the exception of Pickford, the whole thing was a shambles both on and off the field. Into Europe next season? Only on their holidays!

Anyway, off to the Quacks and in even more pain now.

James Power
217 Posted 02/05/2021 at 07:13:03
Iwobi is a graveyard for any promising move. He works hard and short passes are all that's in him, but there is no point in him otherwise receiving the ball in an attack. Through balls more than five yards and crosses just don't come from him. It's painful to watch.
Mal van Schaick
218 Posted 02/05/2021 at 07:18:54
That performance epitomises, where we are as a squad, and where the management are with it.

The selection of Godfrey and Holgate as a centre-back pairing, when we had Keane and Mina on the bench means that either the latter were carrying injuries or it was a massive selection blunder. Holgate is at best a championship player.

Villa wanted this more than us, hitting the post and crossbar. Everton capitulated under their pressure and we resorted to kicking them off the park.

I've had it with Richarlisons attitude. If you don't like playing for Everton go elsewhere and we will find your replacement.

The whole of the midfield is also a problem. Keep Doucouré and Allan, the rest can go.

Rob Hooton
219 Posted 02/05/2021 at 07:54:57
I actually expect to be bored shitless and not entertained when I watch the blues these days and I only watch out of some demented sense of duty (and because there's naff all else to do).

I really need to cut myself off from it if I can, we are pointless in the modern game and I need to have the same apathy as our sack of shit players.

Brian Murray
220 Posted 02/05/2021 at 08:12:32
There's not a manager even at the top level that would almost insist or take it for granted that he would be here at the opening of the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock. That just shows how cosy and nice things are at Everton Football Club. No wonder ex-players adore us.

Nolan at West Ham is a great servant also... you don't hear he has a contract for life no matter what level of coaching badge he bothers with!

Bill Fairfield
221 Posted 02/05/2021 at 08:19:28
Another depressingly aimless season comes to an end, just like the football Everton play – it really is awful to watch.

Thing is, you're expecting it before a ball is kicked every week. Some of the players' places in the team seem assured – no matter how crap they play. Once again, I can't wait for the season to end.

Danny O’Neill
222 Posted 02/05/2021 at 08:28:54
No point analysing that. Poor. Villa done us tactically. Pickford played well. End of analysis.

I've been banging on for weeks that if there is truth we can improve on the standard of centre back we should. Priority? I said a few weeks ago maybe not but if we can do it. Although after last night I would be inclined to believe there is truth in the rumours and the manager sees it as more of a priority than we do / did. It was evident last night. It was evident against Tottenham. It has been evident all season and seasons prior.

Hugely disappointed. I'm in the would love Europe camp. I guess for those who see anything other than Champion's League as a distraction, we don't need to worry about Europe next season.

Brian Murray
223 Posted 02/05/2021 at 08:35:02
Fahad Zaman @200, and others.

No-one gets any pleasure in having yet another weekend ruined and them low-lives over the park sniggering at us. Another big chance gone and this group saving Digne, Allan, James (I know) and maybe the goalie, are nowhere near the Top 4 level... never will be.

As for Carlo, well remember the last "What a manager!" quote from the blubbering Niagra Falls face? History may repeat but, by the way, I won't ask you to suggest an alternative. Not with your name anyway. Your namesake might just might step up and throw more money at us.

Big big question: Would you trust Carlo to not only spend it but to instil hunger and desire into a new batch? And dare I say it, have a plan that a pipe fitter (see other posts) can predict after being on the ale half the day. Let the good times roll, Carlo!

Craig Walker
224 Posted 02/05/2021 at 08:44:24
I just want this season to end now. The last performance I was happy with was the derby. We have too many players who are simply not good enough for where we aspire to be. The performance against relegated Bournemouth at the end of last season was a signal of what we have seen far too often at home. The only encouraging thing for me is that we were better with 2,000 fans watching against Chelsea and Arsenal.

I'd consider making our lads change in the portacabins from now on.

Hugely disappointing considering how we started and some of our away results. I think of my late dad “thing is with Everton, they'll let you down”.

Joe McMahon
225 Posted 02/05/2021 at 08:57:24
Craig, your Dad was 100% correct. I was thinking the other day, I've been supporting this wretched club for 45 years and In that time we have landed only 5 trophies, and of course 4 of those came in a 4 year period. I may be incorrect here but is it 8 trophies since the war?

This is why the media ignore us, and you can't blame them. Nothing since 1995 is scandalous and I can't see Carlo with his decorated record changing it. Negative low-scoring sideways slow football will not work in the Premier League – even with a much different class of player. Sick of it and sick of this club, and the constant piss-taking we get.

Neil Cremin
226 Posted 02/05/2021 at 08:58:23
Only one comment: Following Everton for over 50 years has its ups and downs but this year must be one of the most frustrating seasons.

For years we have been lacking a genuine playmaker, with a big engine, who moves the ball forward and at pace. Until we get such a player or combination of players we are going nowhere. The nearest we have had in the last 10 years is McCarthy - Barry combination.

Our current set of “playmakers” are pedestrian in passing, no engine and no hunger to win. As long as we have this set up, teams like Newcastle, Fulham, Leeds, Burnley know that all they have to do is get at us at speed. Just like our old “Dogs of War” days.

Aspirations of even top half need to put on hold until we find somebody to build a team around – just like Rice at West Ham, Grealish at Villa etc.

Andy Walker
227 Posted 02/05/2021 at 08:58:53
The main problem with our squad is the lack of quality and pace in midfield. Carlo knows it, hence he bought Allan, James and Doucouré last summer. The problem is they've only played a handful of games together all season and many times we've only had one out of three of them available.

So we have still had to make do with combinations of Iwobi, Davies, Bernard, Sigurdsson, Delph, and Gomes. Carlo knows these players aren't good enough, he's even played Coleman and Digne in midfield on occasions ahead of some of them.

This summer, we need another couple of decent midfielders who can carry the ball, have a bit of pace and can break through the opposition lines. We also need a right-back and another striker. Regarding the latter I'd sell Richardson, assuming we can get stupid money for him, and buy a couple of replacements.

Kevin Dyer
228 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:02:42
Roman #213,

Watkins is supposed to be running around; Holgate is a central defender, I'd be alarmed if he was doing that.

Godfrey was almost as bad as Holgate today. He made one huge error, a result of us trying to play out from the back, no need to pile on the lad.

Some of you act like you know the fella personally. As far as I can make out, he is professional and is trying his best. If he was some arrogant slacker, Ancelotti would have him nowhere near the team.

He's just one of this season's scapegoats and the gum thing is just the same irrational bias as Tom's hair or skateboarding.

Kevin Dyer
229 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:06:39
Phil #215,

I agree that Richarlison is struggling but people need to stop with this Broadhead nonsense. The lad is 23 already and flopped at League One level. He is nowhere near good enough and we'd be rightly laughed at for dropping a Brazil international for him.

Richard Nelson
230 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:15:22
Kevin @ 203,

It's not the chewing of gum, it's the way you chew it...

You can chew gum and exude arrogance like Mason Holgate, or you can chew gum with determination, sweat & effort... like Ollie Watkins!!!

Tony Everan
231 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:17:09
It's not what you chew, it's the way that you chew it.

And that's what gets results.

Paul Birmingham
232 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:18:28
Svein, well said.

How many bad days at the office can you have at home in a season...?

The natural tendency of our defenders is generally to advance, stop, turn around, pass back, sideways, and concede momentum and initiative. No team has to break sweat to press Everton.

Fans or no fans, it's the same for all teams, adapt, improvise and overcome, as we do in life.

Mike Doyle
233 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:19:35
Bill 177,

I agree totally. Aguero is a brilliant finisher. However, throughout his career (especially his 10 years at Man City) he has played in teams that have created chances for him.

This wouldn't happen in the current Everton team that creates so little from open play. He'd soon get pissed off with Richarlison's refusal to pass to him (or anyone else it seems), Iwobi's inability to put a cross into the right area etc... Need I go on?

Nick Bower
234 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:19:37
Next season, we will need to find a galvanising figure like Bruno Fernandes at Manchester United. A player who can motivate a whole team through his sheer ability & excellence.

For a while, James Rodriguez was that player for us, but his demise to debilitating injury has to be one of the leading causes for us failing to secure European football this time around.

Stephen Brown
235 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:20:19
My 6-year-old son asked me: "Who was our MotM?" and I said "Pickford."

"Who was next best?" he asked... "Urggg, ummmm, erggg! Nobody really," I said.

Home v Aston Villa and our much-maligned keeper is our best player by a mile.

Really depressing stuff!

On the defence, Mina and Godfrey should be first choice and stick with it! Keane next up and get what money we can for Holgate in the summer.

I don't want to be cruel to Iwobi but how on earth can anyone justify paying 㿊 million for him? His crossing is absolutely abysmal, I think the commentator said he'd scored 1 goal in the Premier League. Someone earlier said Bolasie, Walcott and Gordon would have done more and you can't argue! What about Moise Kean given a proper run?

As another aside from the commentary team, I'm sure they said Calvert-Lewin 14 Premier League goals were the most since Tony Cottee in 1992-93 surely this is not correct? Lukaku ( 2/3 times?) and Yakubu must have scored more league goals in a season?!

Andy Walker
236 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:33:11
Brought a chuckle. Thanks Tony.
Clive Rogers
237 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:33:43
Stephen, I think they said goals in the opening 10 games was the most since Tony Cottee, not the full season.
David Thomas
238 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:37:14
Out of curiosity, when does a player stop becoming a young player who is developing and becomes a player who people can judge whether they are good enough or not?

I only ask because young Holgate is 25 in approx 6 months.

Richard Nelson
239 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:38:17
Tony @ 231... exactly!!!
Terry Farrell
240 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:40:51
I commented this 6 months ago and it's still crucial: we cannot play 3 midfield players out of 5 from James, Gomes, Sigurdsson, Bernard and Iwobi. We immediately surrender midfield and chase shadows!

How Davies did not start is a mystery. How he did not come on at half-time is stupidity. I love Don Carlo... but come on!

Pickford was brilliant. Mason Holgate has been getting away with that turn too often and Watkins knew it was coming.

John Hall
241 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:43:29
Watched ESPN earlier in the week here in Asia and Graig Burley was the pundit giving his say on all things football and I quote what he said about Arsenal and Everton after last weeks game:

"I wouldn't open my curtains to watch either of the current Everton or Arsenal sides."

I can't stand this dick of a pundit personally but he was probably about right based on what we are seeing.

Carlo, I fear that you won't last 5 minutes serving up this dross when the crowds are back in the stadium.

Danny O’Neill
242 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:43:47
Tricky one David Thomas.

I'm always a bit cautious on putting an age on players as, like with any profession or education, players will develop mature and hit peak differently. You get freaks like Rooney who are ready made out of the box at 16, but they are rare.

Generalising, it depends on the position, but what I don't like is the current trend of ageism and determining any player of the age of 30 is done. Simply not true. Especially in the modern game.

Bogdan Kotarlic
243 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:42:02
A good match, especially in the first half. Villa were the better side and they deserved to win.

Our form at Goodison Park this season has been awful and we are now probably going to finish 8th or even 9th. We are probably not going to play European football next season.

I think that we should change a lot in the summer. Some players are simply not good enough to play for Everton. If we want to improve, we must get rid of five or six players and buy five or six that could bring us more quality. This team would finish in the mid-table in the next season too.

We were outplayed by Aston Villa yesterday, they had four or five good chances and we only had one or two. Gomes and Iwobi played very badly and this is not the first time that has happened.

I sincerely hope that we can play some good football in the remaining matches but, given our current form, we will be lucky if we win one or two matches. Sad but true.
Kim Vivian
244 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:44:07
@231 - bananaramaskins. Very appropriate.
Matt Byrne
245 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:48:23
Who are worth keeping?

Pickford
Olsen
Coleman
Digne
Keane
Mina
Godfrey
Allan
James
Davies
Doucouré
Calvert-Lewin
Richarlison

The rest are rubbush. Even some of these haven't performed but we know they are decent. That means we need at least 7 or 8 new signings. Over to you, Marcel Brands...
Clive Rogers
246 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:49:05
It was a mistake not picking Davies.

Sigurdsson and Gomes can't tackle. Sigurdsson tracks back and covers a great distance but never gets a tackle in, while Gomes is too slow and gives fouls away and his passing is variable.

Davies has his faults but always get some good tackles in.

Christy Ring
247 Posted 02/05/2021 at 09:54:56
I still can't understand why Davies was left on the bench for the last two games, he's the only midfielder we have with pace. If you are looking to win the match, why would Carlo bring on Delph – it's mind-blowing!!

Gomes and Sigurdsson together has never worked, and I can't believe there's talk of Sigurdsson getting a contract extension. We need pace in the side, and Sigurdsson, Delph, Bernard and Iwobi should be moved on this summer.

Hugh Jenkins
248 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:03:04
Our goal difference is a pretty good indicator of what is wrong.

Out of the top 9 teams in the division, we are the only ones not in double figures for GD, and we are at least 7 goals worse off then the next lowest GD.

Danny O’Neill
249 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:06:12
Goal difference always tells you a lot, Hugh. Obviously points matter the most, but generally, goal difference is a good indicator of how a team is performing.
Raymond Fox
250 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:06:58
It's so Everton, is it not?

We are still not good enough, we lack what the very best players give you.

I said before the game that we don't score enough goals, that's what's killing us the most. (I suppose that's stating the bleeding obvious.)

If the opposition score... we're goosed!

Daniel A Johnson
251 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:07:10
So we all now realise not even Carlo Fantastico can polish a turd.

As for James the sick note, just get rid. We've had enough of unreliable leeches saying Everton feels like home.

Rich Storey
252 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:09:38
Stephen (124) ,

I was thinking the exact same thing: How many of the current players would have got into a peak Moyes team, or the 2014-15 Martinez team? The answer is none.

We've actually gone so far backwards, it's embarrassing – and spent half a billion pounds in the process.

I pine for players such as Cahill, Arteta, Baines, Jagielka, Distin, Pienaar, Barry, Howard, Barkley, Lukaku, Mirallas, Naismith, Deulofeu, McCarthy (I could go on) – all signed for relatively small fees; all proper players who gave a shit and understood what it takes to play for Everton... unlike this current crop of shite.

Daniel A Johnson
253 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:22:00
I'm just gonna say it: Carlo has to go.

No top 6 club would put up with what Carlo Fantastico has served up this season. The football has been dross and cowardly. Even the players are showing no signs of improving.

I don't care what he's done before, we have an old manager on a cushy number on ٧M a year just phoning it in. Right here, right now, he's not good enough. The lack of fans have given him a free pass this season. If this kind of football continues, Goodison Park will get toxic when the fans go back.

If fat Sam was responsible for this dross, then this forum would have gone nuclear months ago.

Robert Tressell
255 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:28:22
In addition to the Rich 6, we have Leicester City, West Ham Utd and Aston Villa to contend with. The latter two will be thinking, like us, that a good summer window might get them where Leicester are now.

It is interesting that none of these clubs will be looking at the likes of Koulibaly, Coutinho, Rabiot, Douglas Costa or Isco. They will carry on picking up the players everyone knows about from the Championship and the heavily scouted young talent across Europe who are on an upward trajectory with something to prove.

And funnily enough, the Rich 6 aren't even hugely interested in the aging / fading glamour signings either (possible exception of Rabiot and maybe Koulibaly). It's just us fishing in this market and to no great effect. Maybe it's our attempt to pretend to be a big, rich club instead of the mid-table club we really are.

Steve Brown
256 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:28:27
There are five games left and I would just like to see the same team play the remaining games, in a formation that doesn't change.

Here is my team, but others will have their own thoughts:

Pickford
Holgate Keane Godfrey Digne
Davies Allan
James Sigurdsson King
Calvert-Lewin.

Len Hawkins
257 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:30:05
I don't know how many times I've said it but here goes again: the aim is to get the ball in the opponent's goal... simple. So why are we p-assing the ball around at the back, losing the ball between our goal and the half-way line, and – worst of all – have midfielders who in the main can't pass wind???

Yet another loser is joining the coaching staff to join the old boys, won sod-all team. For Christ's sake, Everton, shake the club up – get ruthless. Nice homely clubs win nothing.

It is sickening to watch multi-millionaires playing like an infants' school team.

Mr Moshiri... get ruthless! Weed out the hangers on who won sod all and get someone who'll take no shirking in the coaching team.

If you get caught with the ball outside your own area, trying to mess around instead of getting it upfield, you should be fined and dropped. Oh, hang on, we'd have no team.

A timber sawmill worker could count on the finger of each hand the number of players that do try.

Robert Tressell
258 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:31:53
Whatever we think, the only chance of Ancelotti being sacked is if there is a collapse and genuine risk of relegation. For Moshiri, the quality of our play is a total irrelevance.

And why does it really matter if we finish 9th as opposed to 7th? It matters to us obviously – but why does that matter to a man trying to build a stadium and redevelop some docks?

Martin Berry
259 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:32:32
It really makes you wonder what they are doing in training as there only seems panic when we have possession.

No-one can seem to keep the the ball or have any continual passing, the off-the-ball movement is poor compared to other teams winning at Goodison. Additionally, rotation of players and formations seems to be confusing the team.

I will give Carlo a summer window and another season. If I am still writing this in May 2022, then he will have to go. Of course, I wish him success as he is a good man but this season's home form is just inexcusable.

Daniel A Johnson
260 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:33:08
Coutinho and Aguero.

Just the kind of players we don't want, another set of ageing injury prone mercenaries with no love for the club.

We need to find players who are young and hungry, like Cahill and Baines.

Brian Harrison
261 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:33:58
I don't know what is happening at Everton anymore.

At the start of the season, we were scoring goals for fun, played good attacking football. Now, we have turned into an Allardyce type side: very defensive, looking to hit teams on the break.

I was delighted when Carlo signed, a serial winner, a first for us, to sign a manager who was used to winning trophies, as neither Catterick nor Kendall nor Royle had done before joining us. But some of his decisions of late are really puzzling.

Why has he abandoned his centre-back pairing of Mina and Keane who were proving to be as good a pairing as there was in the Premier League?

I don't know who Carlo thinks is our best midfield... and why this insistence on getting Delph on the pitch? It is a real puzzle.

As others have mentioned, our goal difference is the worst of the Top 10 sides, and when you think how we started the season, this highlights a big problem.

James is an extremely talented player but, if he spends most of the season injured, then he can't contribute to the team.

Iwobi and Bernard have never been good enough, and the signing of Josh King is another puzzle... I mean, surely the question has to be asked: Who sanctioned this transfer? As, by the looks of it, then it certainly wasn't Ancelotti.

So, in our last 9 home games, we have collected 6 points from a possible 27; in anybody's language, that's relegation form. I know many sides are not as prolific without the fans inside, but just look at the sides who have beaten us at home – half of them have been in danger of going down.

I have no idea where we will finish in the Premier League but what I do know is, next season with fans back, they will not put up with this negative approach to games as we have shown lately. So Carlo, you have a lot of work to do in the close season; otherwise, we will be in danger of sliding to the wrong end of the table, and I don't think Moshiri will risk not being in the top division when the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock is completed.

Danny O’Neill
262 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:39:09
Coutinho and Aguero. Serial winners.

Cahill & Baines. Admirable servants with no trophy count.

I get the sentiment, but if we want to install winning mentality, you bring in winners. Not lovers and sentiment.

Ian Edwards
263 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:47:37
My team next week:

Pickford
Coleman Godfrey Keane Nkounkou
Richarlison Allan Rodriguez Digne
Calvert-Lewin King.

Robert Tressell
264 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:49:58
Danny, there's no benefit in having the world's most decorated sick bay. Aguero has only managed 10 games this season and scored twice. Coutinho has played 12 games this season and scored twice.

El Ghazi, signed for about ٦M from Lille has hit 8 in 23 – including the winner against us last night. Villa will buy more like him and overtake us if we stock up on the proven winners no-one else wants.

Scott Robinson
265 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:51:48
I think Martin Keown's summary at the end was very interesting. Keown described what Ancelotti said in his post-match interview – the team had no balance, concentration etc... This was accredited to the coaching.

Look at Holgate's mistake – why didn't he release the ball immediately to Digne on his left? Either the player isn't good enough to do that or he isn't coached.

Then Keown said that Ancelotti will go to the transfer market this summer.

So which is it – the players or the coaching?

Julian Exshaw
266 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:52:53
Bad players or bad coaching is a kind of chicken-and-egg argument. Who or whatever is at fault, we would have expected better than this after a year and a half under Carlo.

Put simply, our football is boring – totally and utterly boring. Were this style of football to come with a hint of success, we might tolerate it, but it isn't and it's getting worse if anything.

We trust in Carlo to get it right because he has won at Champions League level. But so did Jose Mourinho and where is he now? His reputation is in tatters and he appears to have lost the plot.

Does Carlo want to blot his copybook managing an 8th-placed team? Can he work his magic with 2nd-tier players? Lots of questions but no obvious answers.

The old joke is 'a team has more chance of qualifying for the Eurovision Song Contest ' than it has of getting into Europe's elite football competitions. Well, last night it would have been 'Everton, null points'!!

Ian Edwards
267 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:54:19
Our fans:

When Silva was manager, it was his fault.

When Koeman was manager, it was his fault.

When Martinez was manager, it was his fault.

When Allardyce was manager, it was his fault.

When Ancelotti is manager... it's the players' fault.

Just listen to yourselves.

Danny O’Neill
268 Posted 02/05/2021 at 10:57:00
I get that Robert and excuse my scattergun-ness this morning. Frustration, thick head, woke up on the couch at 2am with the dog licking my face!

I always advocate a balance of experience and potential. I don't like discounting players just because of age and the reality of the modern game is you won't get a full season out of most players.

Balance of buying players with experience and players like Godfrey.

I think our priority last summer was midfield and defence. It is likely to be both again but agree, we need something else in the creative and attacking sense. What we all knew is coming home to roost. Better first 11 when all fit but thin squad now biting us. And to be fair, the manager has to take blame for the tactics as Villa could have claimed likewise last night.

Ian, I swap Mina for Keane but other than that, not a bad call, although I don't like 4-4-2. Any update on whether Doucouré could come back in? He's training I believe? Been a big miss.

George McKane
269 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:03:53
We have to thank Moshiri's money for BMD and Ancelotti for attracting some "names" but because of that we cannot keep bowing our head in praise to them - - great innovators make decisions - -to copy (which is what we seem to do continuously - - let's copy the German/Liverpool/MU/whatever model - - to copy is human - - to create is divine - - time for creativity - - innovation - - the "system" we have is not working - - so let's change it - - chasing name managers/players is not working - - Brian @261 say "I don't know what is happening at Everton " Brian don't lose any sleep mate - - there are Managers/Coaches/Advisors getting paid in the 𧴜,000's who cannot get it correct - - we have (supposedly) everything in place - - Owner/Manager/Coach/Scouts/New ground - - and still it is dreadful - -seriously woeful - -basics are incredibly poor - - picking bad players - - picking players obviously out of form - - no tactics - - average teams overrun us - - seemingly not seeing poor play ( Iwobi/Holgate and many many others) - - what is going wrong at Everton - - I haven't got a clue but it is dreadful and if it was happening in my own organisation - - Link - -I would and have been decisive and incisive - - you know I write long metaphysical posts about "going to the game" and show my love and passion for "the match" - - not going to the game has underlined - - several underlinings - - the fact that the actual football part of going to the game is dreadful/dull/unimginative/predicatable/shallow/passionless/tiresome - - I know we have tried the younger managers in Martinez and Silva - - but this is prehistoric - - give me young hungry players and managers with something to prove and a desire to prove not a begrudging sullen gob - - Ancelotti and I guess Moshiri are nice men - - Ancelotti speaks well of The Club and The City - - get some fire in your belly - - my Aunty Mary is a lovely nice lady(God Beles me Aunty Mary - - who died a few years ago - - the last of my Nin's siblings - -but I don't want her to mange Everton - -be brave - -be bold - stop trying to fool us - be truthful if that's possible) - - Poets

Lying to the young is wrong.
Proving to them that lies are true is wrong.
Telling them
that God's in his heaven
and all's well with the world
is wrong.
They know what you mean.
They are people too.
Tell them the difficulties
can't be counted,
and let them see
not only
what will be
but see
with clarity
these present times.
Say obstacles exist they must encounter,
sorrow comes,
hardship happens.
The hell with it.
Who never knew
the price of happiness
will not be happy.
Forgive no error
you recognize,
it will repeat itself,
a hundredfold
and afterward
our pupils
will not forgive in us
what we forgave.
Come on Everton - - be something - - be yourself - - all the Community Stuff is marvellous BUT we need to see something strong/beautiful/meaningful/authentic/imaginative on the pitch and on the football side.
What is wrong at Everton - - I cannot work it out - - but it's obviously a BIG - -as Aristotle said a year or so ago in The Dark House "For extreme illness you need extreme medicine".
For our loyalty and commitment we need more than words from The Management - - we need positive and real ACTION.
Cosmic Blue grooves To All My Fellow Blue Sufferers.

Daniel A Johnson
270 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:13:59
What was obvious yesterday was that we set foot on the pitch and didn't seem to know what we were doing. So much for the fabled tactical nous of Fantastico.

What about the fabled coaching prowess of Fantastico? Well the players seem to have regressed and he still doesn't seem to know his first choice 11.

Yesterday's performance was just simply shocking and it has Fantasticos grubby hand-prints all over it. But hey, he's been sacked by Chelsea, Real Madrid, PSG, Munich and Lazio so must be good.

I look forward to us signing some old foreign big names on over inflated wages as sweeteners as they don't really want to come here. Rinse and repeat for another season in 2021-22.

Brian Harrison
271 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:15:43
Robert @255,

I agree 100% with those comments, we have ended up paying top 6 money to journeymen players. Aguerro, Courthino and some others named – their best days are behind them. We should be looking at players who could be the next Aguerro or David Silva.

I know a lot on here have a go at Moyes but he could spot a player and basically kept this club afloat with his astute buys that we sold for top prices and, while having to sell his best players, he still had us in the Top 8.

I posted the other day maybe managers like players have a shelf life, when you look at Capello: great CV but couldn't weave his magic with England; Van Gaal, another who couldn't get Man Utd going; of late, Mourhino has struggled to replicate what he created at Porto, Chelsea and Inter.

Maybe Carlo is going through that same cycle of not being able to create at Everton what he did at a lot of his previous clubs. Maybe what worked for these managers early in their careers just isn't relevant today who knows.

Danny O’Neill
272 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:17:04
Therapeutical George. Thank you.

As you say, extreme illness requires extreme medicine.

We have been ill for 30 years. It won't be fixed in 12 months. Chances are in 30 months we see ourselves on a more stable footing.

Danny O’Neill
273 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:21:18
The thing being, the season isn't finished.

Hope. Why, even in the midst of a dreadful result and display, do I always have hope?

Ian Horan
274 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:21:55
Having now calmed down, criticism of Allan is crazy. He ran himself into the ground, covering three roles.

Holgate needs dropping, he just doesn't read danger, Watkins ran our defense ragged. At no point did Carlo see the problem. If your defense is being cut to ribbons, you need to cut out the feed for the runners.

Collectively, we are shite at the moment. I love Seamus but so many of our goals conceded are similar – not closing down and turning our backs or side on. Closedown, take the ball in the face if necessary.

There is so much wrong with us at the moment. We played open last night and got what we deserved. The current squad can't go toe to toe with anybody in this league, that is why Carlo has garnered points playing cautious pragmatic football away from home.

It's now 4 wins needed, ever the optimist. I think I need medication.

Tony Everan
275 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:26:39
With regards to Coutinho and Aguero, I'm very wary of signing Coutinho on a massive contract.

Aguero is a different kettle of fish, a lot of clubs utilise a striker in their thirties as a complimentary player. Filling rotating a goal scoring substitution. To me Aguero comes into this class of player, a player to compliment and supplement and attacking group of players a top six club needs. I'd have him for this role in a heartbeat.

Elsewhere, we still need that midfielder and right sided forward we bang on about week after week, year after year. These players have to bring new energy and dynamism into the team, along with technical ability.

Andy Walker
276 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:31:25
Hi Ian, a way too simplistic generalisation. I've been blaming the lack of quality in our squad since the Koeman days.

Moyes got our best squad together in the last 20 years, despite having little money.

Martinez inherited it but his tactics and style of play was a mismatch for those players. He had a lucky first year in charge and then the downward spiral started.

Koeman, Silva, Allardyce all suffered from a poor squad of players and it's the same now for Ancelotti. Ancelotti has found a pragmatic, defensive style which he employs often (not yesterday) which has got us results against teams we've sat back against. That style has been mostly out of necessity though as he simply hasn't got the players to play a high energy, press, attack style game. I'm sure he knows that and we will see some new, much more dynamic, midfielders come in, along with a right back this summer.

Daniel A Johnson
277 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:31:29
Daily Mail has leaked the conversation Carlo had with James on the phone when signin:

Carlo: Hi Hamez, how are you doing?

James: Hey boss, long time no speak.

Carlo: Fancy joining me here at Everton FC?

James: Who are Everton FC? Don't know who they are...

Carlo: A Club in Liverpool, they wear Blue and White. Just to clarify, you won't be playing for them, so don't get your hopes up.

James: Oh right hmmmmm... I'm not sure, boss, plus it's cold in England.

Carlo: Don't worry, James, it's very easy here. You can earn big wages with no pressure and expectation. They think they are a big club but it's laughable really. I'm on ٧M a year. Plus if you want, we can agree that if it feels a bit cold, we can just say you are injured, so just play when it suits. Honestly, boy they didn't see us coming, even my son is here. Big wages, no expectation, and an easy cruise to a Top 10 finish is like winning a trophy for them.

James: Okay, boss, let me think on it.

Carlo: Okay. I'll email the proposed contract.

James: How much money!!!! Okay I'll sign.

Carlo: Fantastico, James!!! Plus all the players are rubbish so you are guaranteed to look good, and if any problems behind the scenes with board we can just blame the rubbish players, lots of them.

James: I live stream Call of Duty games so can't play most days?

Carlo: No problemmo, James… I'm sure we can invent an injury?

James: Fantastico!!!

Robert Tressell
278 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:32:02
Danny, I agree that you need a blend of youth and experience. However, in Pickford, Digne, Keane, Coleman, Gomes, Mina, Allan, Sigurdsson, Rodriguez, Iwobi, Delph, Calvert-Lewin, Richarlison etc etc we already have very experienced Premier League players and seasoned internationals. We don't need more.

What we need are very talented U23 types who will fill the circa 3 spots in the first team and give us a bench that is not just making up the numbers but genuinely pushing for a first team spot and, before too long, will overtake the first team players.

That might mean O'Neil instead of Douglas Costa. Or Olise instead of Isco. Or Sima instead of Aguero. It doesn't do much for the vanity but the squad would be in better shape for the next 5 years at least.

Danny O’Neill
279 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:32:56
I think we all do, Ian. For me, Sunday morning wine. If it's good enough for Jesus!

That's where I coming from, Tony; absolute short-term thinking. Do something here and now. I think someone like Aguero, who still has a couple of years in him (admittedly limited game time) compliments someone like Calvert-Lewin, both as a partner striker and on the training ground.

Pat Kelly
280 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:36:49
Sky Sports reporting our approach to Crystal Palace has been rejected. Hodgson is staying where he is.
Danny O’Neill
281 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:38:22
All I would add to that, Robert, is that our collection of seasoned and experienced internationals aren't of the same standard.

But, I do agree with your point on building for the future so we don't end up with the situation we have now of trying to clear out deadwood and having to consider overrated deadwood as good.

We need a centre back. I hope the Koulibaly rumours have legs.

Winston Williamson
282 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:41:05
Forget Aguero and Coutinho. Having them 6-7 years ago, fine, but they'd only add to the slow, one-dimensional play we've become accustomed to these last several seasons.

We need to throw the net wider. We need pace, power and purpose.

We need a fast right back, who can defend.

We need a left-footed central defender, with pace, so we can play a higher defensive line (at home).

We need a powerful, pacy, right-footed attacker.

We need two central midfielders, who can pass and move, have a bit of pace and are powerful.

We need another striker. A quick and powerful striker.

That's 6 players by my count. Not fucking two.

Financial constraints mean we'd need to off-load at least six as a counter measure:

Mina or Holgate or Keane (not arsed which tbh)
Iwobi
Sigurdsson or James (not arsed which – I'm actually fucking furious James thinks he can just pick and chose which games he fancies playing in... fuck him)
Delph
Gomes
Bernard
King

The above will never happen in one window. Mainly because every club and it's mascot knows how fucking shite our players are!

Svein-Roger Jensen
283 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:46:59
Another window, another window,... I hear it in my sleep.
Tony Everan
284 Posted 02/05/2021 at 11:55:31
Robert, I think you are right to keep banging he drum for for the majority of new signings to be younger, dynamic and more hungry players.

The team needs a shot of adrenaline that these players will bring. (As long as they are not Sandro Ramirez types that is!) They'll need to be very well sourced and properly scouted no good getting a “bargain” that turns into another ball and chain.

I think we should be willing to spend a bit more than we would like on proven talent from he Championship. Say Aarons, Buendia, Sarr. It should be noted that Godfrey was probably our best signing in the last window. (And he didn't come as a cast off from a greedy 12 club.)

There's a staleness about the team that won't go away. Only these type of signings are going to change it.

Robert Tressell
285 Posted 02/05/2021 at 12:01:00
Danny, that's true the quality doesn't always match the experience. But what that means is we need established players who can play many games like Rice, Ings, Ward-Prowse, Grealish and Sabitzer.

The trouble is we either can't afford them or they don't want to come (Zaha only grudgingly perhaps because having turned us down 2 years ago he still finds himself at Palace with time running out).

If we got Aguero and Coutinho we could be paying 𧷤k per week for an extra 4 goals in our goals scored column. Koulibaly is a bit different I agree, but a better version of Mina is not what we need to beat the likes of Villa, Fulham, Newcastle etc.

Jack Ledwidge
286 Posted 02/05/2021 at 12:03:33
I wouldn't go near the Aguero's of this world. Everton for too long now have become a resting home for seasoned players. These players might give a very short term boost, are on inflated wages, and can unsettle a group. We need to scour Europe and beyond for talent. Despite our rocky form, players crave the premiership. There are only 7 teams above us competing for players. We are an attraction for players on an upward trajectory who don't necessarily demand champions league football. Our player of the year Godfrey is case in point. We have so much dead wood ( too many to mention) on the despatch conveyor belt that it gives real belief to potential incomers that a place is up for grabs. It's a huge summer for both CA and Brands. On a final note after the Brighton game Seamus was interviewed. He started off by commenting how well Brighton were coached. He repeated it again, and then I felt realised oh oh by finishing saying CA was a great manager. It struck me as if he was subliminally giving a message.
Andy Crooks
287 Posted 02/05/2021 at 12:04:29
Kieran, back @ 108, that's a good post. Like most supporters of Carlo you can acknowledge on a game to game basis that he,like all coaches, makes mistakes. I never use the word"apologist" not even way back when it was MOB and Apologist. Why should anyone apologise for a sincerely held opinion.
However, I don't think I made it clear what my concern is. Supporters will not decide after one game, well, that's it, I have had it. Loss of confidence is a gradual thing. I think judgement of Ancelotti is constantly being kicked down the road to the transfer window. I suspect it will then be kicked down the road until the players have time to bed in. Then, there may well be terrible luck with injuries.
You can make excuses for anything, I have emptied my pockets doing it for race horses. The point I was trying to make is this:
I am starting to get a wee bit of fear. I would hope by now to see better, to see a better tune got from this team. A sign that good times are within our grasp, because, frankly, our home performances this season would have seen other coaches come under pressure.
I remember asking in the Moyes days if this was the best our money could buy, if no one else could do better. Right now, I continue to believe that there is no viable alternative. We are on this road and we must stick with it. It is not a pleasant journey.


Eddie Dunn
288 Posted 02/05/2021 at 12:05:17
Fahad - I think Carlo put Godfrey on the right side because he was worried about Seamus being done for pace.
In hindsight it didn't work, in fact, a couple of times they overloaded us on our left side and Seamus had to scurry over to help out.
For me Digne had a terrible game.
Mind you so did Allan.
Iwobi surprised me with some positive touches and attacking intent in that first half but reverted to type after the break.
The team seem incapable of the most simple passes. Several times little 3 yard passes were bashed into teammates shins!
Carlo is to blame.
He has made the same tactical mistakes, the same lazy selections, and baffling subs. Then he goes on camera blaming the team for not showing-up. He has failed to motivate, failed on selection, failed on tactics, failed on subs.
It's groundhog day again.
The one bright spot is we might fail to get into the Europa Conference, where average teams play pointless games to wear out their squads, so that the big boys can keep them knackered and claim the Champs League spots.
Fuck Europe, fuck Carlo and fuck these pampered ponces. These clowns are ruining football, their wages are crippling the clubs and yet they are largely average journeymen.
Yet they manage to ruin our lives on a regular basis.
One exception is Pickford who has exorcised his personal demons and is lean and quick. Domenic should get his transfer to United, he is wasted here.
Richie is an ego too far. We could have scored when he had Siggy through on his left. He never looks up and his finishing has turned to shit. Holgate started the rot with a gormless action. How many gaffes does the lad have to make before being dropped?
Earlier in the season having watched Villa have a cracking game with Leeds I said on here that Villa were better than us in every position. Many disagreed. Last night only Pickford would have got the nod in a combined eleven.
The Villa coaching team have lost their best player and yet that side were motivated enough to tear us apart. Pickford kept it respectable. Our great Manager sends out teams of cocky, lazy, uninspired, slow and selfish prima donnas who look aimless and confused.
Carlo to blame again.
Danny O’Neill
289 Posted 02/05/2021 at 12:07:00
Now you're teasing me with Sabitzer Robert! I'd live to have him join Everton.
Dave Lynch
290 Posted 02/05/2021 at 12:26:52
I'd have Aguero in a heartbeat.

He'd bring DCL on no end.
Hes hardly played this season so will be fresh as a daisy.
You can't teach what Aguero has and thats a strikers instinct and players like him never lose that.
DCL is not a natural striker, he'll score goals but he's manufactured, not instinctive.

Brian Harrison
291 Posted 02/05/2021 at 12:30:38
When I look at the quality that the top 4 or 5 clubs have in depth, then look at our squad its light years behind them. I don't see us in the next 4/5 years having a cat in hells chance of challenging that elite group, as to do that would take billions being poured in like Mansoor did when he took over at City. Although Moshiri has poured in millions it has made little or no impact on our finishing position. I am sure some will point to Leicester and say they havent spent billions to break into the elite group and thats correct but they have recruited well and sold brilliantly. Kante, McGuire, Chilwell and the midfield player they also sold to Chelsea. Were apart from Lukaku who have we sold for decent money nobody, but have spent enormous sums on some very ordinary players.

Under Moshiri we have had Martinez, Koeman, Silva and Allardyce and now Ancelotti. and all have been given money to spend, yet making top 6 seems to be classed as a good season. But would Man City, Man Utd, Chelsea or our neighbours see that as a good season no, if they did the manager would be sacked and that's the difference in expectation in us and them. Ambramovich come in for terrible stick for sacking Lamphard, but he brings in Tuchel and are now in the FA Cup final and probably the champions league final, I bet there arent to many Chelsea fans criticizing Abramovich now.

Daniel A Johnson
292 Posted 02/05/2021 at 12:46:40
Exactly Brain [291]

If that was us teary eyed Bill would have made sure Lampard lasted the season and more. But Abramovich pulled the plug and reaped the rewards. There is no such thing as loyalty in football just cold hard results.

Its about expectation and what you are happy to accept. Levy wasn't happy with a euro quarterfinal, his team in 5th, and a cup final and pulled the trigger on Mourinho.

Ancelotti is all about safety and stability for Moshiri. A safe pair of hands financially rewarded to not rock the boat and steer us into the safe waters of the top 10 each season while BMD is being built. Nothing more, sadly he's going nowhere.

After all the hype and hyperbole from some on here and I include myself in the early months, Ancelotti has proved he doesn't have the ability, fire and motivation to move us up a level. Look at the progress Rodgers is making with Leicester as a comparison. What has shocked me is how poor some of our performances have been. At times we've looked disorganised and clueless and happy to take a point from kick off against teams below us. Not what you would expect from the godfather of football.

Without a doubt our squad is poor and unbalanced. Gomes, SIggy, Delph, Iwobi and Bernard have no long term future at the club. Allan and James have been in and out with injuries with the only highlights being Doucoure and Godfrey.

Question marks remain over Keane, Mina, the arrogant Holgate and Coleman (could it be one season too far for him). Plus the erratic scoring form of DCL and the scowling Richarlison it doesn't look good for the 20/21 season. Richarlison needs to seriously step up and DCL needs to score more with his feet.

Thomas Richards
293 Posted 02/05/2021 at 12:52:16
"When I look at the quality that the top 4 or 5 clubs have in depth, then look at our squad its light years behind them."

Nail on the head Brian.

How many of our players could get a game for City, Chelsea etc.

Bob Skelton
294 Posted 02/05/2021 at 13:00:04
Its the same old story week after week, whenever we try to take teams on we get exposed as having players with big reputations and little talent. Sigurdsson, Iwobi, Gomes, Delph to name a few. Tactically we keep trying to pass out from the back with players who would struggle to pass wind than pass to someone in a blue shirt. Can you imagine the opposition team talk - just stand in between the centre halves they'll soon give us the ball. Happened again yesterday.
Quite pathetic.

No pace in the midfield, I bet they can run to the bank with their cheques than they can on the field. Teamwise and tactics we are so poor, we have a team of Toffees with pretty wrappings and shitty tasting caramel inside.

Rant over. Off to take the dog for a walk and pick his shit up, but I'm use to that normally wears blue though...

Clive Rogers
295 Posted 02/05/2021 at 13:27:58
We definitely need to add to our striking options in the summer. Yesterday's game was further evidence that Richie and DCL are not a good fit together. Richie is not playing well at present, losing the ball far too often and while Dom is good in the air, his shooting is abject. This season has shown that they are just not on the same wavelength, playing as two lone strikers in effect with zero communication. King is not the answer also. The best course would probably be for one of them to move on and another striker brought in.
Alan Johnson
296 Posted 02/05/2021 at 13:28:42
If DCL is worth £85mll. What price Ollie Watkins?
Anthony Jones
297 Posted 02/05/2021 at 13:33:09
This team are not worthy of the top 4.

The players might believe they are due to their inflated salaries, but we have bought too many high profile flops.

Good luck to West Ham and Moyes. They are the story of the season for me.

Brian Murray
298 Posted 02/05/2021 at 13:38:25
Carlo playing a very dangerous game with his gushing praise ( wonder where he gets it from ) of his players and offering jobs for life. Plus if he doesn't phase out siggy this summer it will tell us all we need to know about this fierce ambition Elstrone said we have ( remember that open day in sky at finch farm ) my arse. All this runs a lot deeper than a pacy full back and Doncoure absent. Sad.
Soren Moyer
299 Posted 01/05/2021 at 13:39:09
As many of us have said it before, Ancelotti is NOT the right person to build a winning team. Never has been. Brandt is not the right DoF. Where are those so called "hidden gems"!!? Godfrey was not hidden as we all knew about him and a few others at Norwich! Richarlisson is a fucking embarrassment and waste of 40m!!!! And how the hell is Kenwright still at the club and has a say in everything!!!? This club needs to be spring-cleaned from top to bottom.
George McKane
300 Posted 02/05/2021 at 13:46:03
Soren - - nice to hear from you apart from LF - - good piece - - we agree with different wording - - your spring cleaning to my disinfecting. Needed seriously and urgently.
Clive Rogers
301 Posted 02/05/2021 at 13:51:44
The longer the season goes on, the more players we seem to need. The consensus is about 8 at present. 15 by the end of the season.
Thomas Richards
302 Posted 02/05/2021 at 13:58:16
If the target next season is top four Clive it is quicker to say how many of the current squad are capable of playing to that standard.

Very few unfortunately

Clive Rogers
303 Posted 02/05/2021 at 14:19:54
Thomas, sad but true.
Thomas Richards
304 Posted 02/05/2021 at 14:19:56
Two simple choices:

1. Back the manager when he says "It is a long term project, if we are patient it will work."

2. Sack him and start again (again).

Si Cooper
305 Posted 02/05/2021 at 14:33:07
Scott (265), coaching can't eliminate human error.

I didn't see Keown's assessment so can't be sure, but to blame coaching for Holgate's error would surely only apply if you mean the players are told they should never simply resort to just leathering it anywhere upfield or into the stands, even when put under pressure.

I doubt any coach would make that demand, so for me it comes down to situations where the player has to decide whether it's safety first or that he can still wriggle out of danger. Holgate simply chose badly for me.

Much later on in the game, Holgate opted for a very tight turn when a Villa player was right on top of him. It worked out and I haven't seen any adverse comments about it.

People judge things too much on ‘outcomes' for me. A player has to be reasonably frequently ending up looking daft before you can say they have an insurmountable problem with attitude.

Joe McMahon
306 Posted 02/05/2021 at 14:41:10
Dave Lynch @290,

I'd like Aguero as a player and on the coaching team, More so on the coaching team. Richarlison & Calvert-Lewin would both benefit from his nous, he is one of the best finishers I've seen.

Soren Moyer
307 Posted 02/05/2021 at 14:47:04
George @300. I didn't go through every post on here obviously 😬 but glad to know there are others in the same wavelength, my friend.
Rob Halligan
308 Posted 02/05/2021 at 14:47:07
Thomas # 304. I think we all know the answer to your options, well the sensible ones of us anyway, and it certainly isn't option 2.
Thomas Richards
309 Posted 02/05/2021 at 14:52:03
Rob 👍
Brent Stephens
310 Posted 02/05/2021 at 14:59:56
Thomas. Not option 2. And anybody suggesting option 2 surely needs to say which coaches are on their shortlist - lacks credibility otherwise.
Mary Coleman
311 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:02:52
Duncan Ferguson is the man!!!
Thomas Richards
312 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:03:16
Brent, 👍
Rob Halligan
313 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:06:09
Brent, you ask "certain" people who would they like to replace Ancelotti, and do you know what, they can't give an answer, unless it's someone like Chris Wilder, or some bloke called Steve Cooper from Swansea.
Brent Stephens
314 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:06:43
Mary, I'd be interested in what the actual case is for Duncan, what his CV offers?
Billy Bradshaw
315 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:07:36
Who will we blame if Kenwright leaves and the next 25 years turn out like the last 25?

I just hope we can do our complaining in a new ground.

Brent Stephens
316 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:08:25
“Wilder” suggestions might be made, Rob!
Si Cooper
317 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:09:13
Farhad (200), sorry but just wanted to check whether you think Ancelotti's training means the players aren't as fit as they should be?
If so that could be easily assessed by how our players match up when they turn out for internationals.
I don't think I've heard any suggestion that our players are obviously the weakest links in those circumstances.
Thomas Richards
318 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:12:08
Eddie Howe
Sean Dyche
David Unsworth
Paul Hewitt
319 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:16:16
NO manager on earth could get a decent tune out of these players, NONE. Not Pep or Klopp or any manager you wish to name. Apart from a small few the rest are crap, utter rubbish a disgrace to the proud shirt.Some might not like to hear it but it will take Carlo time to turn this mess around. We need to clear the squad of the utter dross we have and fill it with hungry fast energetic players. I wouldn't sign a player over the age of 23. There must be loads of players out there who fit the bill. Time for Brands to earn his money I think.
Rob Halligan
320 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:19:25
Might as well be, Thomas, after all, Dyche and Howe have won sweet FA, just like the aforementioned Wilder and some bloke called Steve Cooper from Swansea.

We can be stuck in mid-table mediocrity for ever more, and plod along, happy in the knowledge that we won't win anything or qualify for Europe, but also won't get relegated.

Rob Halligan
321 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:20:48
FFS, Paul Hewitt talking sense!!
Christy Ring
322 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:21:07
Totally over the top suggesting we get rid of Carlo. He has only brought in four player's who are definitely an improvement on what we have. Hopefully this summer he can bring in a full back, a couple of wide players with pace.

I wouldn't mind making an approach for Gilmour, who's not a regular at Chelsea. He's young, aggressive, has pace, and would add bite in midfield.

As for Coutinho, he's only a mercenary now, and past his best. Aguero a class act, but he's missed a lot of games this season with injury, would it be a risk worth taking?

Thomas Richards
323 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:21:45
Cant take the posters who have offered them names seriously Rob.
Rob Halligan
324 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:25:06
I don't, Thomas. I wouldn't waste me breathe on them.
David Greenwood
325 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:31:30
Great post, Paul. Couldn't agree more.

Mary Coleman
326 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:31:50
314 - Brent, we all know what experience Duncan has, he epitomes this football club, he will take us forward 100%.
Eddie Dunn
327 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:34:00
Si Cooper @305, Actually, on the Live Forum, one or two commented on Holgate's later tight turn, berating him for trying "a Cruyff turn in a dangerous place".

Since his injury problems, Mason has been a shadow of the tidy player of recent times. Incidentally, his gum-chewing might not be part of an arrogant hardman image, it could be nervousness, who knows? However, as Keane has been dropped with various "injury" issues, it seems that Holgate has had the benefit of the doubt.

Indeed, poor Tom Davies has been overlooked whilst Allan stinks the place out with the terrible pairing of Gomes and Sigurdsson. For me, the obvious position for Sigurdsson with James out, was in a No 10 role, even if it meant dragging Richarlison back to the left.

Was that a "Diamond" that they were trying to play? It was hard to tell.

Thomas Richards
328 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:34:53
He will learn by sitting next to Carlo, Mary. Partner that education with his undoubted passion for the club and who knows what may happen in 3 years time.
Kieran Kinsella
329 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:49:10
Mary

The experience of going to prison for head butting a player? The experience of not training as a player? The experience of missing more games that James due to niggling injuries? The experience of being part of three other failed management crews? Or the experience of being an animated cheerleader for two games last year?

Tony Abrahams
330 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:49:57
Paul is not only talking sense Rob, he's defined a plan, something Everton don't seem to have when the manager tries to open up, even a little bit.

The best thing I've read was Barkley, looked like he was in a training session, but wonder why? Newcastle, Fulham, Leeds, West Ham, and now Villa, have been afforded the freedom of Goodison Pk this season, whilst Burnley actually looked like Brazil, in the first half at Goodison, because of a dreadful system that leaves big gaps in the middle of the park, and is very easy to play against

Darren Hind
331 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:57:21
I think all the bravado and foolish "If we win our games in hand" nonsense has been exposed as nothing more than wishful thinking. We were never in the hunt for a Champions League place – last night's performance (among many others) prove that.

Noticeable that players like Davies and Keane, who Carlo has "improved beyond measure", can't get a game. Players who had improved before he got here, like Richarison and Holgate, are going backwards, probably because they are shunted here, there and everywhere.

Our football has been the worst in the Premier League. There has been no justification for the cowardly anti-football we have had to endure.

Watching the much derided Barkley lead our much vaunted "Brazilian Peter Reid" a merry dance merely underlined the fanboy mentality which has crept into this club.

The sooner the crowds get back, the sooner Carlo GetFoundOutio will be on his way.

Dave Abrahams
332 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:58:52
Tony (330), and that's why Ancelotti wants to buck his ideas up, if he's got any we haven't seen, same tactics ( whatever they are) with the same results, six points from twenty seven in the last nine home games, as long as they are allowed to perform like this by the manager, the more stick he will get and deserve, Carlo gets plenty of praise when we win, it's only right he gets told off when we don't, if he's partly culpable, and he is.
Brent Stephens
333 Posted 02/05/2021 at 15:59:28
"The sooner the crowds get back the sooner Carlo GetFoundOutio will be on his way."

Who would you replace him with, Darren?

Thomas Richards
334 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:03:55
He has put Eddie Howe and Unsworth on TW as his choice of manager, Brent. Not sure if he has mentioned any others.
Kieran Kinsella
335 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:10:29
Thomas 334

So he's going for Little and Large? I'd have thought he's more of a Chuckle Brothers man

Geoff Williams
336 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:10:41
Christy neither Godfrey nor Doucourè were Ancelloti signings as he's admitted knowing nothing about either. Allan and James are his picks. He was away from English football for several years and consequently knows very little about young upvand coming players. Unfortunately he is stuck in a time warp.
Paul Smith
337 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:13:30
Gutted about last night. At one point in the 1st half Gomes and Digne lost possession in a pitiful display of looking like they had never even met before never mind being on the same football team for years and Villa were able to maraud through our midfield unopposed. This happened time and time again; where was our midfield what were they doing ? Can someone with better strategic knowledge of tactics than me give me an idea please ?

Felt sorry for Allan - poor fucker trying to do the job of 3 men - he is not the problem btw.

should we be thankful that we had a chance of Europe with 5 games left, is that an improvement enough ? Only if we actually took it otherwise this season is a bit of a failure.

Ian Horan
338 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:18:02
Well DH couldn't miss an open goal offered him!!!, ALLAN was covering the whole midfield on his own. Holgate was shocking!!! DH also offers worst football in the league are Everton. I will raise you Sheff Utd... Darren offer an alternative to Ancelotti as opposed to rebel rousing and antagonistic argumentative comments... I guess DHs cavalry will come riding over the him, messers CaSho etc
Brian Murray
339 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:20:14
Time for the blue union to make themselves heard. Voice of the people and proven to be right all along with the nelly still in the room. Or is that classless and not the Everton way. Again,
Thomas Richards
340 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:20:31
Easy boys.

🎣🎣🎣🎣

Darren Hind
341 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:22:12
Thomas Richards

I put those names forward FIVE fucking years ago. They were an alternative to your chosen one. Big Sam - "Sams got this"

I was right too. Your boy was a fucking nightmare.

BTW; Thomas Richards didnt even post on TW back then. You didnt appear until John G Davies disappeared

Thomas Richards
342 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:22:52
Temper, temper
Geoff Williams
343 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:25:26
Removing Ancelotti is probably out of the question because of the financial implications but I do think his son, who is the main coach, should be removed immediately.
Give Anceĺotti another transfer window and he'll bring in some more 29+ year old players from Italy
Kieran Kinsella
344 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:28:24
Echo saying that Carlo is worried Coutinho coming in could upset James. I guess James wants first pick of beds in the physio room
Darren Hind
345 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:29:36
No temper from me. Just as there is no denials from you.

I`ll always stand by what I said.....

Thomas Richards
346 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:32:05
Denials of?
Tony Everan
347 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:34:43
We need three or four new, younger, hungry and dynamic quality players there's no doubt, but it's not all about that.

There's no continuity so the arse doesn't know what the elbow is doing. Players haven't gelled, and there's no positional understanding of teammates or instinctive awareness between each other.

I don't think he still knows what the best defensive line up is.
The midfield should be renamed the minefield. Nobody ever knows what the line up will be.

I know injuries are partly to blame but a lot of the time they're not.

All this chopping and changing is resulting in a team that is playing like a bunch of strangers that have just met in the park.

We need a core way of playing and players to know and be responsible or their roles within it. They can then more easily concentrate on improving.

That way the team and its identity can take root. Maybe then we can start making sustained progress based on a solid foundation.

Steve Carse
348 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:42:12
Geoff (336), a sound observation. I wouldn't trust CA with a bag of money to spend. Sarr, McNeil, Brooks, Cantwell, are the sort of players to provide the skill, energy and ambition. McNeil apart (after he tore us one at GP recently) I doubt Carlo knows anything about them. In any event they're too young.
Steve Carse
349 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:42:12
Geoff (336), a sound observation. I wouldn't trust CA with a bag of money to spend. Sarr, McNeil, Brooks, Cantwell, are the sort of players to provide the skill, energy and ambition. McNeil apart (after he tore us one at GP recently) I doubt Carlo knows anything about them. In any event they're too young.
Brian Murray
350 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:46:24
Got a feeling finch farm where we sort our plans and tactics is like Dorothy looking for the wizard of oz ! Doesn't really exist.Can't think of any other explanation why as soon as we get to kick off it's a meet and greet to strangers.
Ajay Gopal
351 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:47:48
My first comments on this game that I saw this morning on a replay (without knowing the score): What a waste of a Sunday morning! I watched parts of the Man City- Crystal Palace, Chelsea-Fulham and the Leeds-Brighton games, and honestly, hand on my heart, 5 of those 6 teams played better football than what we did yesterday - with the only exception being, possibly Crystal Palace. The difference between Everton and Man City is like night and day, makes me want to cry. The season that started so well is petering out into a dismal whimper.

Coming to the game, Aston Villa fully deserved to win, no question about it. They wanted it more, they were more skilful, and man-to-man, I would swap out their entire starting XI yesterday with ours - even Pickford who played brilliantly yesterday is matched by Martinez, who is an equally good keeper. We could have played for another 180 minutes, and I am sure we wouldn't have scored another goal. Yes, Holgate's mistake cost us a goal, but the game was definitely lost because Villa were better in every department.

Watkins vs Calvert-Lewin?
Traore vs Richarlison?
Douglas Luiz vs Allan?
Barkley vs Iwobi?
Scott McGinn vs Gomes?
El Mohammedy's sublime strike vs the lame efforts of Siggursdsson?

Need I go on?

I seriously don't know where we go from here? The more I think of it, the more I am convinced that it is a coaching problem. Even Sam Allardyce has got a tune of a West Brom team, which was looking hopeless before Christmas. I really, really do not want to see us change our manager, I desperately want Carlo Ancellotti to succeed. I like his pleasant personality and demeanour, but he has got to turn things around quickly.

Call it an over-reaction, but I have been idly thinking about next season, and who might get relegated - Norwich and Watford who have got promoted have good managers. Possibly the 3rd team that comes up may go back down. The other 2 ? Burnley, Brighton, Newcastle, maybe? Are Everton really that much better than these teams? At the moment, I don't think so! (Sorry for being so negative in this post!)

Brent Stephens
352 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:53:02
Thomas #334 Eddie Howe and Unsworth - not going to happen. Gone quiet on that, I see.
Thomas Richards
353 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:54:00
Im still waiting to see what I am in denial of Brent 😁
Darren Hind
354 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:57:39
Went quiet on that front five years ago. Your boy big Sam got the job instead.

99% of Evertonians already knew that. but I guess you miss a lot when you spend all the time apologising for what has happened since

Brent Stephens
355 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:59:23
I'm still waiting for a name as new manager.
Thomas Richards
356 Posted 02/05/2021 at 16:59:58
Anybody decipher that please?
Rob Halligan
357 Posted 02/05/2021 at 17:06:35
Brent, I'll nominate meself as the manager. Then again, it's like comparing me to Allardyce and Allardyce to Ancelotti!!
Jeff Armstrong
358 Posted 02/05/2021 at 17:10:52
I'll have a go Thomas,
Darren is saying you are John G Davies.

Yes or No ?


and your choice of manager 5 years ago was Sam Allardyce.

Thomas Richards
359 Posted 02/05/2021 at 17:11:47
Thanks Jeff.

No and no

At it again

🎣🎣

Brent Stephens
360 Posted 02/05/2021 at 17:18:53
Rob, love ya mate, but back to your Gwladys Street seat!

At least you offered a name.

Mary Coleman
361 Posted 02/05/2021 at 17:42:51
329 - Kieran, scraping the barrel, embarrassing comments, embarrassing. Last season the man saved our club, fact, we were heading for the abyss. You call yourself an Evertonian.

How can we expect to win games when there is so much negativity within this fan base. Call yourselves supporters, it's constant doom and gloom, a black cloud permanently hanging in the air over the football stadium, no wonder we are where we are... Supporters continuously complaining, if this poor support persists then we will be stuck mid table forever more..


Steavey Buckley
362 Posted 02/05/2021 at 17:47:27
Ancelotti blames Holgate and Godfrey for the defeat when everyone should realise that the manager picked the awful team leaving out his 2 best centre halves, Kean and Mina.

Another season of Ancelotti as manager will lead to more bizarre team selections.

Kieran Kinsella
363 Posted 02/05/2021 at 17:48:40
Mary

Are you trying to be funny? I'm doom and gloom for not wanting to sack our manager? The black cloud as you say is the one I'm arguing against. But somehow you're Mrs joy by wanting to sack the coach and replace him with an unproven man whose track record is littered with controversy?

Brent Stephens
364 Posted 02/05/2021 at 17:50:16
That's quite a contrary view, Mary!
Rob Halligan
365 Posted 02/05/2021 at 17:53:32
Brent, give over! 😁😁😁
Brian Williams
366 Posted 02/05/2021 at 17:55:22
"Call yourself an Evertonian?"

Bang out of order that by the way.

Brent Stephens
367 Posted 02/05/2021 at 17:57:48
Steavey #362 - as you want Carlo gone, who's on your short list as replacement?
Steavey Buckley
368 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:00:42
I have made my choice as the next Everton manager, but not welcomed by most fans even though he is a winner with Rangers.
Brent Stephens
369 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:03:53
Steavey, I think you mean Gerrard (?). Kudos for being willing to state your preferred replacement. Seriously, respect, mate.
Danny O’Neill
370 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:05:55
If there is one thing we need now, it's stability. Judge the season when it's over. Judge the manager when he's been given a fair crack of the whip.

As pissed off as I am with last night's result and recent home performances / results, the last time I looked, we weren't staring down a relegation abyss, we were looking at potential European qualification. We still are. Somehow.

Mary Coleman
371 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:09:26
Kieran, I'm not calling for anyone to be sacked, I don't believe I have ever said that?

I'm an Evertonian and will support the players and the manager through thick and thin, like the great Howard Kendall once wrote, it's a marriage isn't it, not a love affair.

I believe in my heart we are the best Club in the world and will continue to manifest that great things will come, and yes I believe Duncan Ferguson will be and should be the next manager, and a great Everton manager he will be.


Thomas Richards
372 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:14:54
Get the manager of the liverpool Sunday League winners in Steavey.
Both leagues as difficult to win
Will Mabon
373 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:17:38
Brent,

why not share why you feel Ancelotti is the right choice rather than the "Who instead" angle. It's completely moot and serves as no endorsement of Ancelotti whatsoever, any more than it addresses the concerns of those unhappy with his performance.

Danny O’Neill
374 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:20:23
Until recently Steavey, I had my money on him going to he obvious.

But with the Germany and Bayern jobs recently going, I don't see Klopp going anywhere soon now.

The chances are diminishing, but we could still qualify for Europe. That's an improved position to where we were 12 months ago. Next season we expect further improvement on top of that. Ancelotti is here for 3 years or so. Some will never like that, but that's how I view it. I just hope / believe he leaves us in a better position than what he inherited.

Rob Halligan
375 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:23:42
Scottish football is garbage, Thomas. I think we've seen this when most of their European entrants are knocked out before the regular season even starts. Those that make it beyond the final qualifying round don't make it much further. Steven Gerrard managing Rangers is the same as Moise Kean playing for PSG.
Steavey Buckley
376 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:25:02
"Steavey, I think you mean Gerrard (?). Kudos for being willing to state your preferred replacement. Seriously, respect, mate.' Thanks Brent for accepting my honesty. All previous managers who were with Everton were losers, you could see it their faces as results went against them. Ancelotti looks like one of them.
Brent Stephens
377 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:25:43
Will, I'm on record as saying that a manager normally needs a couple of seasons before we can judge whether he's the right one for us. That's even more so when, as I'm also on record as saying, we have too many journeymen in our side and therefore need time to bring in sufficient new signings.

So mine isn't just the "who instead" angle.

What I do find bizarre is a view that says a manager should be replaced, without having any idea who should be on a shortlist as replacement (or be unwilling to say what that shortlist should be).

Kieran Kinsella
378 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:28:34
Steavey

I wouldn't get Gerard for several reasons one of which being that he is a hot head with an ill disciplined team. That apart, since Fergie Scotland hasn't proved to be a great testing ground for EPL managers. You can go back to Billy McNeil even, great at Celtic got two clubs relegated in one season in England. Then you have your Lennon's, Strachans, Smith, Souness, McKinley etc Unless Gerard wins something in Europe I'd say his next step is to prove himself in the championship.

Will Mabon
379 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:35:04
Brent, it just seems more like a deflector or silencer. Not easy to simply name someone as a replacement, nor is it a requirement to express dissatisfaction with a present manager. We anyway rarely know who is coming into a club until... we find out who is coming in!
Michael Boardman
380 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:39:07
Moshiri has history of reacting to fan opinion. When we are back in GP, and if this type of football is being served up, he may well react. I agree, not much in managerial gold standard we can attract, risks have to be taken, and a project backed, so if anything, Potter at Brighton knows how to play the game, Dyche gets results, Wilder got Sheff U high up the table last year, and Howe got Bournemouth in the Premier League, and kept them there (until he spunked all their money on RS reserves). But what do we want? If it's decoration, then Jose is available. There are young, winner, proven managers out there, but guess they're not coming here (unless in a pre-season friendly) plus, what had Klopp won prior to Dortmund etc.
Brent Stephens
381 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:40:37
Will, yes I agree it's not easy to name a replacement. I just think that if somebody says a manager is no good for us, then that is by implication a relative judgement - they are implying there are others who are better for us. In which case...
Jeff Armstrong
382 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:41:32
Brent, are you a tad disappointed with Ancellotti's performance these last 6 months?
Does he deserve ANY criticism?
Are you happy with his team selections?
his substitutions?
Maybe he could inspire us with a bit of experimenting with say, Nkounkou, or King even?
Are you happy with his lack of imagination? tactics? game plan ?
I agree he should be given time and transfer windows, but so far, with the hand he has been dealt,
he's been pretty poor tbh.
Alan J Thompson
383 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:43:43
Quite a lot of us have said that it is near impossible to second guess Mr Ancelotti when it comes to team selection but given the changes he makes is it possible, albeit less than the place most of us might choose so to do, he is experimenting not only with getting players used to various patterns of play but still assessing individuals and certain combinations such as central defenders, midfield as seen in an understanding that seems to be developing with Siggi and James and Siggi behind Richarlison and Calvert-Lewin so he and Mr Brands have a better idea of where funds might be raised and the budget spent.

Just a thought.

Thomas Richards
384 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:44:05
How many games have you watched Nkonkou play Jeff?
Brent Stephens
385 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:45:05
Jeff, Carlo is certainly not beyond criticism in my view.
Darren Hind
386 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:48:41
Mary

Everyone knows you didnt call for anybody to be sacked. Thats just the local crack pot doing what he does. Lying. I don't think he realises there is a scroll button..

He`s on another thread lying that I had been campaigning for Arteta to get the job instead of Carlo. Simply not true. Nothing against Arteta, but from day one I wanted Big Dunc to keep the gig until the end of the season. Said it often enough

Will Mahon

Nail on the head

Jeff Armstrong
387 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:49:15
Same as you Thomas, but why, when subs are required, does Ancellotti not mix it up a bit, move Digne further forward, put Richy down the middle, anything other than replace Gomes with Delph FFS.
Thomas Richards
388 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:51:00
No offence intended Jeff.
Posters regularly call for someone to start without having seen them.
Hes nowhere near ready imo
Brent Stephens
389 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:52:48
The man with the hammer and nail still can't name a replacement.
Kieran Kinsella
390 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:52:57
Darren

Eddie Howe

Jeff Armstrong
391 Posted 02/05/2021 at 18:52:58
Darren, playing into their hands there, name calling will be the focus, not your point, which is far more relevant.
Kieran Kinsella
392 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:01:39
Jeff

Not sure on Nkounkou but yesterday had the feel of the Burnley game from the get home so yes I'd have liked to see Carlo try something different be it King earlier, anyone but Delph. With that being said, he's in a better position than me to judge the players but being hopeful I'd have liked to see him mix it up

Brent Stephens
393 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:04:42
Jeff, Darren's point is clear - he didn't want Carlo before he was appointed and still doesn't want Carlo as manager. But he won't say who he'd want as replacement. He doesn't say if he'd still be happy with Howe or has now gone off him.
Paul Hewitt
394 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:05:52
Swap a serial winner for a guy who's won crap league in Scotland. I think not.
Brian Wilkinson
395 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:11:09
You are spot on Jeff and it is happening week after week, he has A certain 11 that will start, more often than not the same three subs will come on, the next match, those that come off the bench will start the next match, with the three taken off the previous game starting from the bench, then coming on, only on the odd occasion has different subs been used, normally towards the last 10 mins most.

Ok people might say the others are not ready, we will never know, unless they get some longer game time.

Can they be any worse than what we are seeing at the moment, why not mix it up a bit, try something different from the bench, try some different tactics like you say Jeff.

Other teams have sussed us out, go to the player with the ball and wait for the ball to be played backwards, they then regroup and apart from the hopeful punt upfield, Everton have no one to take players on, in the midfield.

Most of our attacks come from Richarlison, Digne overlaps, when was the last time we did not turn and go backwards, sometimes we have gone from just outside an opponents penalty area,all the way back to our goalkeeper, no one is prepared to even try to go past a player from our midfielders.

Fair enough do not try it in our own defence, but in midfield, they have defenders who can cover a mistake from the opponents half, too much safety first and not enough belief either from the players, or from the ones who are instructing the players to go safety first.

We need to try something different, mix it up a bit, try different tactics and at least try and mix it up from the bench.

Will Mabon
396 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:11:25
Alan,

that experimental angle is a possibility though a path rarely trodden that I'm aware. We aren't going down, we aren't winning anything, Europe is really not for us with our present squad (much as I love the idea), so our current position is probably the compromise option alas.

This said, I have to say I can't see any progress from such experimentation or otherwise. I was kind of expecting some eye opening tactical cameos, enlightened maximization of what we already have in terms of players. Change, improvement, tightening of the basics, professionalism etc. whatever the results. If something's happening unseen toward some esoteric plinth-building, it's beyond me.

I don't want to continue the manager merry-go-round, it's a road to nowhere (in the absence of unlimited funds). Another season and some more players - talk of eight, 10 or more, that isn't happening. If we're all honest though, I suspect most people were expecting more by this stage.

Jury's out - for now.

Soren Moyer
397 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:14:55
You are not an Evertonian if you:
-question players attitude,
-question manager's game management,
-question our home performances and results,
-question team's performances in general,
-question the geriatric football we are playing,
-call most of our away wins lucky,
-demand (way) better players,
-Call the board incompetent,
-demand more from our DoF,
-expect to win a cup or 2,
-show your dismay towards anything or anyone connected with the club!!!
Rob Halligan
398 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:16:11
Knocked out of the FA Cup by this season's league champions, league cup winners and soon to be champions league finalists. Knocked out of the league cup by this seasons soon to be league runners up and Europa league finalists. Away wins at spurs, leicester, Liverpool and Arsenal, plus ten other away wins. Still in with a shout of some sort of European football for next season, (God knows how?).

Granted Jeff, it could and probably should have been better, but the final part of your final paragraph sums it up, "The hand he was dealt with". Ancelotti didn't sign the likes of Delph, Iwobi, Sigurdsson, Bernard, Walcott, Tosun, Bolasie, players everyone has been screaming "Are shite, deadwood, need to get rid of ASAP" So yes, you're right, the "Hand he was dealt with". He's got no choice but to play some of them.

He's been in charge for sixteen months, most of which has been in very unusual circumstances, and for me, has had a major impact on not just us, but every club. I agree that some team selections, substitutions have been baffling. What's with the sudden love affair with Delph? Carlo needs time and a couple more summer transfer windows at least to sort things out, or else it will go on for ever more. Bring in new manager then two years later sack him and another new manager etc etc etc etc.

Serious question for everyone, if we had won ten home games and only five away games, even taking away some of the wins at our hoodoo grounds, would that change anyone's feelings towards Ancelotti, or is it totally irrelevant?

Brent Stephens
399 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:16:41
Will #396 " If we're all honest though, I suspect most people were expecting more by this stage."

Will, I think that's very fair comment. I don't think anybody would disagree with that.

Kim Vivian
400 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:23:38
I'm 100% with Brent - keep it going Brent, I've got your back!
Darren Hind
401 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:27:22
Never have I called for Eddie Howe to be given the job...That just another lie

When Howe's name cropped up during the debate when Allardyce came. I said I would take Him all day over Allardyce. I still would.
I made it very clear at the time that I wanted Unsworth to carry on guiding us to safety.

This is a different scenario. We have not just sacked the manager - unfortunately. We have no idea who will even be in the frame. Those wanting names just want a hypothetical argument. one which they cant lose - for once.

Wont happen. There are at least a dozen I could name who I would rather have than Ancelotti. But your still making shite up from five years ago. You'll get no encouragement from me.

Ancelotti out.!!!!!

Jeff Armstrong
402 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:28:17
Rob, I am forever grateful for those away wins at RS, Arsenal, Spurs etc, for them wins we have banished a great deal of shite talk from commentators especially ( we both watch a lot of TV games) and for me, Ancellotti has a fair bit of credit in the bank, but I need to see a lot more inspiration from him to have a bit of confidence going into next season, for me, he's just so uninspiring.
I think he might be past it.
Will Mabon
403 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:28:39
"Serious question for everyone, if we had won ten home games and only five away games, even taking away some of the wins at our hoodoo grounds, would that change anyone's feelings towards Ancelotti, or is it totally irrelevant? "


Truth is Rob, IMHO, it's been a hard one to read in some ways, this season. Flying start, early player improvements, some good away wins, terrible home games/form, frequent awful, non-descript "Style" of play, and some definite reverses.

Perm it any way - but what concerns me is the fire-fighting nature that's come more to the fore with time. I don't know what we're aiming at, but I was hoping for a professional, structured underpinning, is the best way I can describe it - a kind of chassis. Not seeing that at all.

Sit back and hold on tight for another season I guess...

Barry Hesketh
404 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:32:09
Rob @398
I think the fact that Carlo's Everton has broken those away day blues, is one of the main reason's that some of Carlo's critics are so up in arms, even a few more home draws instead of defeats would have helped to quieten some of his critics.

Results aside, the way that Carlo's team has played for most of his time in the hot-seat has left a lot to be desired.

Andy Crooks
405 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:45:47
Well done Steavey for suggesting Gerrard. In my view we do not need a new manager at present nor would I find Stevie G palatable if we did. However, it is nothing to do with the job he has done at Rangers, because what he has done is remarkable.
Managing Rangers or Celtic is testing challenge, a challenge like few others. The admirable Neill Lennon was once considered a possible manager at our club, Walter Smith was. Both achieved considerable success in Scotland but we're destroyed by it.
I have watched a lot of Scottish football for many years, in all divisions and the level of play does not deserve the derision it gets on here. Both Rangers and Celtic have, in recent years too, performed better in Europe than some Premier League clubs.
I support neither Celtic or Rangers in Scotland( Clydebank were my team when I lived there) but I would be surprised if they both do not perform with credit in Europe next season. Frankly, should we get there I will fear for us.
So no Stevie G for me(though how much would it hurt the RS!!) but not for football reasons. His winning of the toughest two horse race around was harder than you might think.

Will Mabon
406 Posted 02/05/2021 at 19:54:53
Andy, some good points.

Gerrard here though, ever, in any universe – NEVER!

Jeff Armstrong
407 Posted 02/05/2021 at 20:02:03
Hell will freeze over before I watch an Everton team managed by the Whiston Wanker.
Brent Stephens
408 Posted 02/05/2021 at 20:12:32
Darren, "Never have I called for Eddie Howe to be given the job...That just another lie. When Howe's name cropped up during the debate when Allardyce came. I said I would take Him all day over Allardyce."

Darren, mate, you said after Sam had been left us that you would be happy with Howe.

Steve Guy
410 Posted 02/05/2021 at 20:18:48
Anybody thinking we should change manager after effectively one season, especially a manager of Ancellotti's pedigree, is quite frankly bonkers.
Ian Bennett
411 Posted 02/05/2021 at 20:34:52
I agree Steve, but in terms of a team they must be highest paid bunch of losers in world football.

The list of keeps is pretty limited, whereas the list of get rids is absolutely huge. Keane, Mina, Pickford, Coleman, Holgate, Gomes, Bernard, Sigurdsson, Delph, Davies, Iwobi, Kean, Kenny, Tosun, Walcott, Bolasie, Besic, Gbamin, and King. All a complete waste of money and all robbing a living on a routine basis.

We lack pace throughout the side, can't pass a sentence, don't score goals outside of the front two, have no heart, and gift away cheap goals for fun. In summary we are still fucking terrible after spending near £500m on transfer fees and paying these jokers over £100k per week or £5m a season for utter shite.

Sacking Carlo isn't the answer. It's clearing the decks of the utter shite we've squandered top dollar on.

This isn't Kendall mk3 when we are buying rubbish like Mitch Ward, we've paid top dollar for players that are clueless under multiple managers.

Ian Horan
412 Posted 02/05/2021 at 20:36:27
A couple of comments on Ancelotti's Team are somewhat amusing. Is this current Everton Team truely Ancelotti's Team?? For me, personally... no!!!

Ancelotti is trying to get a tune out of a mix of Koeman, Silva, and Allardyce misfits – only 2 Ancelotti signings were on the pitch on Saturday.

What has been proven is the current team are not intelligent enough to manage an expansive game plan – unless it is a defensive "don't move out of position" instruction.

Winning at Spurs, Arsenal and Liverpool in my opinion gives Ancelotti credit for another season at least.

David Thomas
413 Posted 02/05/2021 at 20:41:35
This is starting to get out of hand now. We need to get Carlo out as quick as possible. Then the best way forward is to give Unsworth the job full time on a 10-year deal.

Give Rhino 6 months and he'll have Holgate playing like Ratcliffe and Iwobi like Trevor Steven.

Dave Abrahams
414 Posted 02/05/2021 at 20:46:41
Steve (410), you have a point Steve, but equally anybody not questioning how Carlo is managing the squad and how he has got us playing, especially at home, is blind to his faults.
Jeff Armstrong
415 Posted 02/05/2021 at 20:50:56
Ahh, so every manager that comes into the club cannot be judged until he has cleared the decks of all the previous managers signings, even though he is being paid a massive salary to “ manage”.
He should then, defer his salary until all the players in the squad are signed under his stewardship, say 3 years.
Until then he should not be judged on team selections ( not his players)
Tactics( not his players)
Formation ( you get the drill)
Substitutions (FFS I never signed them!)

Dave Abrahams
416 Posted 02/05/2021 at 20:55:51
My post @ (414), Apologies to Geoff Williams who basically said the thing I said on another thread.
Jay Wood
[BRZ]

417 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:05:38
TW has many fine contributors. Many outstanding articles and insightful posts. But by ‘eck post-match threads can make for tedious reading.

The absolutism of some about the club in general, the manager, the players, the tactics. The petty name-calling towards TWers who don't share your views. The childish historical and long-running vendettas between individual posters in which actual football discussion is secondary at best, or completely ignored at worst. The schoolyard argument by gainsay: ‘Did too! Did not!

Soren @ 397, you are and can be an Evertonian if you check just one or all that you list. Equally, you can be an Evertonian if you legitimately challenge someone who expresses an opinion stating all that you list. To claim otherwise on either side of that divide is yet another example of individual absolutism that just stifles genuine debate.

People are different. Diverse. Because you hold a contrarian position to another does not automatically qualify you as right, insightful and wiser, and the other wrong, blinded and stupid.

My own personal starting position is: I support Everton.

As such I only ever want – as the NSNO motto states – the very best for my club. For decades now we have fallen well short of NSNO.

The club, its guardians, its employees, do not get a free pass from me because I support Everton.

I have criticised Bill Kenwright's stewardship. The lack of investment and proper planning to have Everton competing at the very top in the PL era. The proposed move to Kirkby. Moshiri's largesse in the transfer market. I have been both supportive and critical of different managerial and DoF appointments. Been bewildered and delighted by different (sometimes even the same!) Everton players. Questioned the tactics and in-game management of every appointed manager. Get as seriously frustrated as any Evertonian at this season's appalling home form, whilst delighting in and enjoying the best-ever away form in the PL era. I am heartily pissed, as a result of the previous, at the countless spurned opportunities this season to really cement not just a top six place, but a top four finish. Time and again it has been in our hands…and we have dropped the ball each time.

I will add that I am exceedingly proud of EiTC and how the club conducted themselves last October with the soiled six's ‘Big Project Reset' initiative and again more recently following the announcement of the ESL breakaway.

It is my belief that Carlo Ancelotti with the team sitting where it is in the league will not be going anywhere soon, so anyone calling for his dismissal be prepared to be disappointed. His position will only be questioned by Farhad Moshiri should next season or the subsequent one we find ourselves in a relegation fight.

It is my belief that given the difficult situation he inherited, that Marcel Brands is finally seeing clear water ahead in which he can shape the club going forward in the same positive way as he influenced his previous clubs. It is my belief that part of Brands' remit is already being implemented at the Academy in which all teams are fielding aggregately younger teams, with ‘older' youth players being sent out on loan or released.

It is my belief that Moshiri will see the construction of BMD to completion. How the deflection of monies towards that project impacts on our ability to recruit in the transfer market, I have no idea. But that's why he is a billionaire and why he has recruited some very capable people to achieve that, beyond those overseeing the actual football.

Now I could be totally wrong in my stated beliefs. It doesn't make me a happy clapper, a sycophant, someone easily misled and pleased. If you think otherwise, fine. But put up good rationale and reasoning as to why so genuine debate results.

Not every thread needs to rapidly degenerate into a Scouse Wedding and verbally poking someone in the chest all the time. It's so frigging tiresome.

Jeff Armstrong
418 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:14:07
“Not every thread needs to rapidly degenerate into a Scouse Wedding and verbally poking someone in the chest all the time. It's so frigging tiresome.”

Not seen that on this thread.

Tony Everan
419 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:28:00
Jay, are you speaking from personal experience of scouse weddings? I've been to a few that have ended in complete mayhem. One where the bride's 20-something brother was trying to cop off with the groom's 15-year-old sister.

The reception gaff in Bootle was like a war zone. Police involved, the full monty. Surprised E-Squadron weren't called!

What goes down on here is more like duelling handbags at 50 paces than a scouse wedding.

Jay Wood
[BRZ]

420 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:29:23
Then you're filtering out an awful lot, Jeff.
Kieran Kinsella
421 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:32:00
Jay Wood

Can't disagree with any of that and am culpable of tedious feuding. I really don't enjoy it and forthwith I shall try to abstain

Jay Wood
[BRZ]

422 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:34:31
Seen the same meself, Tony. And not only at actual 'Scouse Weddings', but city pubs with glasses and bottles thrown, chairs and tables turned to splinters and windows smashed. Indeed, seen a lad put his own brother through a window!

'Scouse Wedding' is a commonly used euphemism. Take it literally, if you want.

Jeff Armstrong
423 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:35:34
Jay, you're right, I do filter out a lot of your posts, I tend to read the first, and then the last sentence. 😁
Tony Everan
424 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:39:19
Jay, I didn't take it literally at all, sorry if you interpreted my post as such. I was trying to extract a bit of fun out of the subject. I agree with the thrust of your previous post.
Jay Wood
[BRZ]

425 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:39:25
Your choice, Jeff. Plenty of posters I scroll past myself and never engage with.
Brian Wilkinson
426 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:43:39
Ian @411, All a waste of money and robbing a living – how you can throw Coleman into that bracket is baffling. Okay, he is not getting any younger, but that guy gives nothing less than 100% every game, he has been one of the few consistent players this season.

No question we need a back-up right-back, with age catching up, but Coleman owes Everton absolutely nothing, he has given everything to our football club.

Kieran Kinsella
427 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:45:45
Andy Crooks,

The criticism of Scottish football on here is o=ver the top, although I suspect some is done in jest. But I think the SPL isn't a good pathway to the EPL due to the set-up.

In terms of the fan base, finances, appeal to players, and finances of the club, it's kind of like if you had a 10-team league featuring Everton, Spurs and 8 teams along the lines of Wycombe and Yeovil.

Managing Aberdeen or Hibs is a world away from managing the players/finances at even the likes of Crystal Palace. Managing one of the big two doesn't prepare you for a situation where you have about 8 similarly-sized rivals, some able to attract the best players in the world, plus 11 other not-as-big, but still strong clubs.

Smith came from having the biggest budget in a two-horse race to having a decent budget (for about 3 months) in a much wider field. Totally different dynamic. And I think that's why it would be a better path for an SPL manager to try his luck in the lower leagues in England, or a more competitive foreign league before coming straight into the EPL.

Oliver Molloy
428 Posted 02/05/2021 at 21:53:43
Gerrard at Everton – could never happen and rightly so. How any Evertonian could suggest him to manage our club is beyond me, no matter how fucking desperate we are!

I could never support Everton if that arsehole had anything to do with us, I fucking detest him.

Thomas Richards
429 Posted 02/05/2021 at 22:03:34
The anti-racist campaigner Oliver?

Jumped on the high horse when his Rangers player was racially abused, and rightly so.

Why he wore the tee-shirt supporting Suarez after he was proved to have racially abused Evra is another story...

Jeff Armstrong
431 Posted 02/05/2021 at 22:40:04
Loving the moral high ground taken by some Evertonians.
Go on, be honest.
Stephen Vincent
433 Posted 02/05/2021 at 23:16:31
Mary Coleman #361, Embarrassing comments, embarrassing. Kieran is as entitled to his opinion why DF should not be Everton manager as you are supporting him as Everton manager.

To call his loyalties as an Evertonian into question simply because he disagrees with you is deplorable and you should apologise.

The negativity on this and every other EFC web site I have been on today, stems from the negativity on the pitch which in turn comes from the negativity of the management.

NSNO is what we all want for OUR club, we have differing opinions as to how this utopian ideal is to be achieved, if you can't have a sensible debate without hurling unfounded insults, stay away.

Christy Ring
434 Posted 02/05/2021 at 23:37:30
Guys enjoyed all the different opinions, and we're all Evertonian's, but I'm finished here, too much of a click goodbye and won't be back
Don Alexander
435 Posted 02/05/2021 at 00:39:34
The more I study schizophrenia the more I feel it necessary to feel sorry for our Dazza (ad nauseam), and now Mary (#326), the other "big" Dunc fan.

In fairness Mary is quite right in pointing out that "big" Dunc now "epitomises" us as a club. He does indeed. After all, he's a player who ripped Everton (and every other one of his clubs) off throughout his entire "career" with an endless list of carefully, repetitively, and therefore eminently predictable timed "injuries", allied to a taste to achieve fully paid-up suspensions on a level that exceeds addiction (and that's apart from his criminal thuggery).

And yet Kenwright bought it, again and again and again. He still buys it. He still buys all the other ex-player (mostly unqualified) "coaches" that infest USMFF too.

I used to hope that Marcel Brands knew coaches who appreciated the importance of ball control, accurate passing, body positioning, accurate shooting and covering, and that such folk would be signed on.

Hopefully this summer will also see a raft of sackings and new signings in the disturbed world, provably for decades, on USMFF training pitches.

Graham Hammond
436 Posted 03/05/2021 at 00:46:49
Christy #434.

We may have had differing opinions on James McCarthy in the past but, that apart, I pretty much agreed with all that you posted and had to say; I wish you all the best.

And you were more than right on that waster, Fabian Delph. For the life of me, I do not see what Carlo Ancelotti sees in this player. If he continues to pick him, he is simply tightening the noose around his own neck at Everton. A garbage player.

Best wishes, Christy.

Brian Wilkinson
437 Posted 03/05/2021 at 00:50:53
We need you on here Christy, every viewpoint for me whether I agree or disagree, I will put my point across.

I am certainly not in any click, quite a few individuals here put some great posts on, I would certainly not challange anyone, unless I thought the need to do so.

I am not sure who the clique is, to be honest, but I have always enjoyed reading some of your posts, as I have with other posters.

I feel it really sad if anyone is driving you away from this forum and would ask you to reconsider, as I am sure other posters will as well.

If I need to get anything off my chest, whether it is a performance-related comment, or disagree with a viewpoint, it does not mean I am right, I just say it as it is.

That is the beauty of this forum, we all see things differently, but we are all one big family of Evertonians.

Hope you keep posting, Christy.

Graham Hammond
438 Posted 03/05/2021 at 00:57:02
I wholeheartedly endorse what Brian #437 is saying and putting to Christy, hopefully, he will reconsider his 'retirement'.
Kieran Kinsella
439 Posted 03/05/2021 at 01:09:35
Christy,

You're a gentleman and a scholar. I'm going to bid farewell for a while too.

Derek Thomas
440 Posted 03/05/2021 at 01:25:03
Rob@ 98; ..."Serious question for everyone, if we had won ten home games and only five away games, even taking away some of the wins at our hoodoo grounds, would that change anyone's feelings towards Ancelotti, or is it totally irrelevant"

Your point above is (nearly) the whole key question.

What irks people is, in general, Home games are supposed to be 'easier' than Away games. This is where you pick up points, though in reality not championships - these are won...sometimes drawn, but not so much now, on cold wet Tuesday's at Stoke or Saturdays (as was...remember them?) at Leicester or some such.

Imagine if the news outlets were going on about Evertons 'recent poor home form'...'only' one win and 5 draws from the last six!

What irks people is the fact they can see that with a usually very poor Home Game gain of 1 win and 5 draws from all of these losses, we're up there with the bigger boys and there will probably be a confidence boost to go with it too.

We're not winning at all, so let's drop down to the next default setting - Not Losing...go back to the 4 Amigos across the back - KITAP1...and I'm not too arsed on the P1 bit either, if it means not losing.
No crowd to get in the Players, Managers, Owners, backs...just a load of internet based top balcony cushion throwers.

But what do I know?
I know I don't like losing, I prefer winning...even with OGs...at a pinch though, I'll take draws over losses.

But as has been said, you can't go repeatedly sacking managers.

But the other side is - just how long do you go.

Buggered if I know, that Moshiri's job...his job, but our worry.
*Throws Internet Cushion in frustrstion*.

Darryl Ritchie
441 Posted 03/05/2021 at 02:42:54
I guess I'm naive. I enjoy watching Everton play football. Win or lose. If the team wins, I'm happy. If the team loses, not so much.

I understand that the squad are professionals, and prefer winning to losing. This ongoing narrative of “Fire the coach” or “Bench so-and-so because he's a bum” is useless. I have to believe that, as much as we the fans want success on the field, everyone employed by the club want it more.

A win is not the best thing that ever happened. A loss is not the end of the world.

I enjoy watching the Blues play... win or lose.

John Boon
442 Posted 03/05/2021 at 04:23:51
Darryl, not entirely how I feel, but now that my initial annoyance, bordering on anger, has subsided I do like your more sensible approach. Unfortunately I am rarely sensible when Everton lose. I still live in hope that we will rise again next season. Unfortunately I have been saying that for far too many years.
Jay Harris
443 Posted 03/05/2021 at 05:05:47
I have held off posting to calm down after the game and look at things rationally.

I think we are all feeling frustration at the number of opportunities given to us and then spurned.

We have for a few years now had a very poor quality MF with no goals to contribute, Ineffective passing and vision and a general lack of energy.

I believe Carlo recognized this and with a limited budget brought in Allan, Doucoure and Rodriguez which while helping the problem has never totally solved it due to injuries and loss of form by the likes of Richy.

I believe if we had retained Gana and not brought Gbamin in we would be much better off and more consistent because other teams have learned we have a soft center.

In terms of overall squad quality we are light years away from the RS, Chelsea, Spurs and even Arsenal who have had a worse season than us.

Personally I don't see any improvement until 3 or 4 quality additions are made that can play football and score goals.

This current squad has a few decent players but lacks mental toughness and application in key areas and when we have injuries the imbalance in the team shows through.

Put Pep, Tuchel or Klopp in charge of this lot and IMO they would do no better.

Andy Finigan
444 Posted 03/05/2021 at 07:51:41
Good post Jay 443
Ian Bennett
445 Posted 03/05/2021 at 10:23:26
Brian 426 - Coleman has been a loyal servant, and a brilliant player for us.

He has been a rare constant glimmer of class going back to the Moyes days. I don't put him in a robbing a living class like many of his team mates, but it is clear he's coming to the end of playing at a top level. Can he play a back up role? Absolutely. But the rest can go as far as I am concerned.

For all those that slag off Anchelotti, I don't think there is any manager in the world that would get a tune out of that lot. We can keep changing the managers, but it ain't going to make Sigurdsson more visible, Keane any quicker, or Iwobi more productive etc. We have assembled a poor squad, and largely wasted big money that we've raised on Lukuku, Stones, Gana. Things need to change.

Dave Abrahams
446 Posted 03/05/2021 at 10:59:59
Christy and Kieran two very good posters, have a good think about leaving ToffeeWeb; you will be missed.

Hopefully you will miss ToffeeWeb as well, best wishes to both of you.

Danny O’Neill
447 Posted 03/05/2021 at 11:10:21
Don't go!

The variety and diversity of views and opinions on here are what makes it.

If everyone agreed on everything all of the time life would be mundane.

We all agree on one thing, we just differ on our opinions on the thing that binds us together.

Keep posting.

Tony Everan
448 Posted 03/05/2021 at 11:21:36
Christy, Kieran, this site would be poorer without you both.

We've all got one thing in common: we all love Everton... and, because of that, all fair-minded opinions should be respected, whether you agree or disagree with them. Snide, personal comments say a million times more about those posting them than the recipient – brush them off.

Take a day or two and come back when the dust settles.

Justin Doone
449 Posted 03/05/2021 at 11:25:22
I'm certainly not calling for Carlo to be sacked for 2 reasons.

The first being that he is a proven multiple winner including in England, that act's with real class and dignity. He doesn't lose his cool when all around him have lose the plot.

Secondly, I can't think of anyone else I would trust more to improve the results and performances.
We all start with, "it will take 2 or 3 seasons to clear the under performing player's and bring in suitable replacements." Lets give our world class manager some more time.

I understand there comes a time to act but this was not a risky appointment in the mould of Martinez, Koeman or Silva. No more punts on unproven managers. I certainly wouldn't want Mourinho or his type either.

I would like to see action in demanding only the best. I think Holgate could develop into a very good defender, but his mistake should be highlighted as unacceptable and be dropped. We need to set higher standards.

Likewise Ric has underperformed for months. King to replace him.

Pickford, Keane, Siggy have all been 'rested' at some point recently. Siggy came back improved. Keane didn't and Pickford.. jury is still out.

Brian Harrison
450 Posted 03/05/2021 at 11:26:56
Christy and Kieran, I hope you will reconsider leaving, I do sometimes think that some posters attack others personally which really doesn't promote this site in the way it should be. I would just say vehemently disagree with others opinions but let's leave the name calling at the school gates.

You only have to look at after each match people praise and critisize different players, so it just shows how diverse opinion is but that's what makes this site so good. And Christy, as you rightfully say, we are all Evertonians who all want the club to succeed – just differ how best to achieve that, and having watched your uncle wear the blue of Everton, I am sure his advice would be: stay and express your opinions – and the same for Kieran.

Derek Knox
451 Posted 03/05/2021 at 12:38:41
Christy & Kieran and any others who feel a bit down, I can only endorse what Brian@450 has said and please reconsider, we all get a bit agitated when our team have let us down again, especially at home.

Also there are some wind up merchants who take things too far at times, and I totally disagree with any comments that denigrate to personal abuse and name calling. Can I just remind the guilty, and you know who you are, we are all supporting the same side here Everton FC.

Like I said before, because the team are underperforming, or letting us down in any way, it is not the fault of anyone on TW, because they have suggested a different starting line -up or different substitutions, and in most cases it is justified.

We are not expected to agree on every single issue, and having differing opinions is healthy, otherwise we would all be robots, but please can we act like comrades and not enemies?

Alan J Thompson
452 Posted 03/05/2021 at 13:05:07
I've not checked this but is it possible that we trust Mr Ancelotti as he is part of the cycle that says every fourth full time managerial appointment won't have us beating off the prospect of relegation?

Oh, and man up, Ring...sorry, I'll rephrase that...stop hanging around Christy...No, that's not it either. In true Everton tradition, suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune, 1914, 1939,1985 and get on with it!

David Hallwood
453 Posted 03/05/2021 at 13:12:44
It's difficult to say if we're improving or it's just another false dawn. On one hand we've amassed more points than last season, so good; on the other the football has been terrible, so not so good.

I'm wondering how much confidence and momentum is playing in our fragile performances. Take Richarlison. (No, please have 'im!) What's happened to him? He's obviously not become a bad player overnight, so is he drained of confidence or motivation, or both?

Then there's Digne, last season arguably the best left-back in the Premier League; this season just about (and only just) the best left-back at the club.

And then there's momentum; let's play Football Manager, what would be your best XI with the squad available, assuming they're all bang in form (I'm excluding Gbamin). I'll give two: 4-3-3 and 3-5-2.

Pickford; Coleman, Mina, Godfrey, Digne; Davies, Doucouré, Allan, Rodriguez, Calvert-Lewin, Richarlison.

Or 3-5-2: Pickford; Holgate, Mina, Godfrey; Coleman, Allan, Doucouré, Rodriguez, Digne; Calvert-Lewin, Richarlison.

If your side(s) looks anything like that, the 4-3-3 side have never played together, and I don't think the 3-5-2 have either. Now injuries are never an excuse, but they can be a reason for not being able to have any consistency in play or results; you only have to look across Stanley Park to see a world-beating team look like a team devoid of confidence not knowing know where the next win's coming from.

To state the bleedin' obvious, the squad just isn't good enough, and there needs to be both a clear out of the usual suspects and a more balanced approach to recruitment – one or two of them who can run would be nice. But I think the major surgery should be in pruning the squad rather than a "5 out, 5 in" approach, we did that a few years ago and the team played like strangers.

I would be delighted if we sorted out the RB problem, and added a pacy winger, my preference would be Leon Bailey and a striker, even Aquero would be a great backup option or to bring on with 20 mins to go.

But once again we come to the end of a season that I can't wait for it to end, we've been saying big transfer window is needed, this time it's real.

Colin Malone
455 Posted 03/05/2021 at 13:39:38
I said it before and I will say it again, Michael Keane took the flack from the mistakes and bad performances of the arrogant Mason Holgate.
Danny O’Neill
456 Posted 03/05/2021 at 13:51:07
I've been calling for weeks that we need a top-drawer centre-back, Colin. It doesn't seem obvious, but it is a problem area for us.

With the centre-backs we have, we have to sit deep. And, those you mention have mistakes in them. As I suppose every footballer does but, at this level, you expect better.

If it is me (and it isn't), I see us selling Mina and replacing with better quality. That is because we stand more chance of there being interest in Mina.

Keane and Holgate become our backup next season.

Raymond Fox
457 Posted 03/05/2021 at 13:51:40
Well, we are back in the same situation that we end up in most seasons. It's the same old problem of the players are good in the main, but not quite good enough.

When we do buy players, they are not wanted by the best four or five clubs; if they were, they wouldn't be signing for us!

We have to break that cycle somehow; the only way I can see that happening is to offer silly money to the very best players. It would cost a mountain of cash but how else are we going to bridge the gap?

We keep hoping for the best but, as someone said previously rather crudely, you can't polish a turd.

Danny O’Neill
458 Posted 03/05/2021 at 13:57:50
Depth and quality of squad, Raymond.

We have a good team but, once we're missing a few, we replace with less quality.

The importance is to build the squad, not just the first 11.

Thomas Richards
459 Posted 03/05/2021 at 14:01:12
Danny @456,

Me too. We have one centre-half in the squad who could play for a Top 4 side.

I would look to get rid of Keane and Holgate at the earliest opportunity. Holgate will never be capable of playing for a top team.

Michael Kenrick
Editorial Team
460 Posted 03/05/2021 at 14:21:49
The only 'click' on here (I think it might be 'clique' you were trying for there, Christy) are Evertonians with the temerity to post their opinions. If you don't like that... well, tough.

Kieran might have more of an issue as it was the sharp-tongued Mary Coleman who seems to have poked him in the chest. I have absolutely no truck with anyone who uses that "Call yourself an Evertonian" crap or comes out with the utterly self-righteous "Call yourselves supporters" – so belittling anyone who dares question anything. Then hides behind the "Let's all get behind the team and the manager" call.

No, sorry, not having that.

Darren Hind
461 Posted 03/05/2021 at 14:28:27
Carlo Ancelotti – "Mason Holgate is an important part of the future of Everton football club. There is no possibility he can go to another club. Like my friend Mourinho says, "zero" possibility."

Looks like Mason will still be here when Carlo goes...

Danny O’Neill
463 Posted 03/05/2021 at 14:39:08
Agree, the future and beyond Ancelotti's tenure. But then at 24, he's got a lot of learning to do and won't potentially peak until 28 - 30 years old as centre backs generally tend to. Hopefully that's with us and a club on a better platform than where we are now.

But rather than wait for that, I think we need something ready made, here and now alongside Godfrey, who despite being younger than Mason looks great and will be ready younger.

I'll be honest, my fear is keeping hold of Godfrey, just like we failed to do so with Stones.

Darren Hind
464 Posted 03/05/2021 at 14:40:01
A bit harsh.... He did used to win things before he came here.
Paul Smith
466 Posted 03/05/2021 at 14:47:59
Holgate is shite. I'd rather put Iwobi there. Carlo must be smoking Scouse Leb if he wants us to believe that.
Thomas Richards
467 Posted 03/05/2021 at 15:05:36
Paul.

He could have told the truth and been stuck with him. Not many managers around who would say "He is hopeless, no concentration, no awareness of players making runs off him. Gets caught in possession too often." But that wouldn't be the sales pitch required.

Ancelotti said a similar thing about Tom Davies recently. I would have a fair-sized wager that neither of them will start the first game of next season

Danny O’Neill
468 Posted 03/05/2021 at 15:10:21
Back up Thomas. If Everton are serious, then next season (not the future and 2025, Mason Holgate is backup).

Tom Davies I see as being more around the first team as he has improved with better players around him and benefited from more stability in the management set up. But, I think there is unanimous agreement we need / want improvement in that department too.

Darren Hind
469 Posted 03/05/2021 at 15:12:10
The truth is. He was responding to reports that Pep Guardiola was about to make a bid to bring him to City.

Keep digging

Steve Brown
470 Posted 03/05/2021 at 15:12:38
Didn't someone mentioned Steve Cooper as a replacement for Ancelotti... or was it Tommy Cooper?

So many laughable candidates mentioned by the critics of Ancelotti, but who knows? We have so many absurd and stupid decisions for 25 years, it is within the realms of possibility that we will sack one of the most successful managers in history after 16 months.

No wonder fans from other clubs laugh at us.

Steve Brown
471 Posted 03/05/2021 at 15:17:00
I like Mason Holgate, but moving to Manchester City? Maybe if it's the ladies team.
Danny O’Neill
472 Posted 03/05/2021 at 15:20:46
To be honest ,Steve, not beyond the realms of possibility.

City have a habit of making those kind of moves. A young Delph? Rodwell? Players they didn't need but make up the "home grown" quota?

I agree with you, but it wouldn't surprise me.

Darren Hind
473 Posted 03/05/2021 at 15:25:26
reported by every single news outlet in the country.

Pep wanted Mason. Carlo told him hands off. Carlo may be a game spoiler, but he knows a player when he see's one - He's inherited enough of them. And Pep been known to sign the odd decent player . Perhaps they should have consulted Brown and Richards.

Law of averages n all that

Rob Halligan
474 Posted 03/05/2021 at 15:26:35
I was really surprised when man city signed Nathan Ake from Bournemouth. Even more surprised at the fee, £41M FFS.
Danny O’Neill
475 Posted 03/05/2021 at 15:31:56
Okay, never one to admit I have been wrong and earlier in the season I debated over playing Holgate in a holding midfield role.

But, the more you look at him, is he more of a traditional sweeper who sits in front of the centre backs than a centre back himself?

Is that what Pep sees in him given his like for footballing defenders?

Harry Williams
476 Posted 03/05/2021 at 15:52:32
#435- Don, you cannot help yourself.

You have slandered Duncan Ferguson on many occasions, bringing up incidents from over 20 years ago, what about the past 10 years, what he's done for the club and community, the people in Liverpool. He's an Evertonian more than any of us, like Kenwright he loves this club and city, win, lose or draw, he proved this in December 2019 those of you present in the stadium all witnessed, what he did was just short of a miracle. Surely Mr Moshri is pulling the strings at the club and I'm sure Duncan is a favourite of his, don't think the owner will have experienced what Goodison Park has to offer until the 7th December 2019.

We all have opinions and it's great we can use these forums to express our frustrations but to claim #326 Mary has schizophrenia is a little below the belt, not good!

#460 Michael son, you don't and won't stand for flippant comments, “supporting the club and standing by the manager”, but it's allowed for others to claim people have mental health issues, something seriously wrong here!!

Can't and won't stand for that, disgusting.


Scott Robinson
478 Posted 03/05/2021 at 15:59:08
I agree Danny @475.

I've always been surprised to see Holgate as a central defender. He's hardly a towering, commanding presence. A deep holding midfielder/sweeper seems more logical for me. But what do I know?

Danny O’Neill
479 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:00:50
**never one to admit I haven't been wrong.

For factual correctness!

Thomas Richards
480 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:14:31
Darren.

Can you put a quote up from Guardiola showing his comments about Holgate?

Or are you relying on gossip columns for tour info?

Barry Hesketh
481 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:20:14
Thomas @480
It's not hard to find mate, just type in a few details on the internet, and hey presto the thing you're looking for magically appears.

BTW Marco Silva also said that Mason wouldn't be sold when he was in charge.

As for quotes from Pep, since when has any manager gone public in trying to sign an opponents player - they use the gossip columns and rumour mills for that sort of thing.

Everton manager Carlo Ancelotti also dismissed speculation defender Mason Holgate could be on his way to Manchester City.

The young defender was linked with City in the morning's papers with the Daily Mirror saying Pep Guardiola was preparing a summer move for Holgate.

Ancelotti though shut down the talk at his press conference on Friday.

“I think it's a rumour, but if it's not a rumour I can say Mason Holgate is an important part of the future of Everton” he said.

“There is no possibility he can go to another club. Zero possibility, like my friend (Jose) Mourinho says: ‘Zero'.

Thomas Richards
482 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:38:01
So it is gossip then, Barry.

Darren Hind
483 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:39:22
Reported in every newspaper and from sources close enough to Man City for Carlo to issue a hands off...

Keep digging.

Barry Hesketh
484 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:42:20
Thomas @482
I never said it wasn't based on 'gossip' but I did add the caveat:-
As for quotes from Pep, since when has any manager gone public in trying to sign an opponents player - they use the gossip columns and rumour mills for that sort of thing.
David Thomas
485 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:47:21
I imagine Pep is still kicking himself now. He could have got Holgate but ended up getting second best in Rueban Dias.
David Thomas
486 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:53:59
It's probably going to be one of those transfers that runs all summer. More than likely end up on deadline day with Pep offering us Laporte and £50 million for Holgate and Everton will have to do that deal against their will.
Darren Hind
487 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:54:24
I think Holgate is kicking himself that he allowed Carlo to talk him into signing a ٢.5M deal to quell City's interest.

He's gone from being one of the most promising central defenders in the country to being a classic Carlo "spare peg, round hole" right-back

Another player ruined by Mr Cautious wanting to play 9 centre-halves, a centre-forward... and a goalie (plus two more on the bench).

Dale Self
488 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:56:18
Kieran, Christy and whoever else may be fading a bit as the team finds new depths. It is a drag when we get pulled into or accidentally instigate some kind of shitshow back and forth. Sometimes you can find some dark humor to keep you going but it is indeed a weight that is hard to shake. Please remember that we all dig the effort that you put into caring for the club that may end up with a regrettable post or two. Take a break if you need to but please come on back as soon as you feel comfortable.
Thomas Richards
489 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:56:35
"Another player ruined by Mr Cautious wanting to play 9 centre-halves, a centre-forward... and a goalie."

😂😂😂😂

Posters who have on many occasions ridiculed other posters for taking the gossip columns seriously are now taking the gossip columns seriously.

You could not make it up.

Jay Wood
[BRZ]

490 Posted 03/05/2021 at 16:58:20
Mason Holgate has had a poor season, but so many people have extremely short memories.

Due to an injury crisis on Sam Allardyce's watch he became a fixture in a much-maligned Everton back four of Jonjo Kenny, Ashley Williams, Mason Holgate (aged 21) and Cuco Martina. It proved to be the most resilient of Everton's defensive line-ups in that dogsbody of a season.

In came Marco Silva who never fancied nor trusted Mason and packed him off on loan to WBA. On his return to Everton Silva again overlooked him. Carlo Ancelotti came in and almost immediately made him a fixture of his defence, ahead of the likes of Michael Keane and Yerry Mina.

Such was his form and especially his edge and vocal cajolling of his team mates MANY wanted him installed as Everton captain this season.

Richarlison pipped him to the club's official Player of the Season award - voted for by supporters, of course - but the same supporters voted Mason as the club's Young Player of the Season. His fellow pros voted him as THEIR Players' Player of the Season.

Rumours or not, Mason's name was linked with a move to City. The MEN canvassed City fans who responded favourably to the rumour.

Last summer, Carlo appreciating what he saw in both Mason and DCL, tied them down with new contracts, laughing off the idea that Holgate could leave. The Italian described Mason as 'a complete defender who has all the necessary attributes to reach the pinnacle of his profession.'

Mason missed the end of the stop-start season last time out, injuring himself away to Spurs. He missed the start of this season for similar reasons - injurying himself in a pre-season friendly v PNE.

In spite of Everton's fine start to the season without him, Carlo tried to integrate Mason back into the fold as quickly as possible, pairing him with Michael Keane home to United. It didn't go well. Mason was not ready for that step up and he dropped out of the squad for the following games.

He has not had a great season, but he has certainly shown he is a PL quality CB, as acknowledged just last season by supporters and his fellow pros.

The challenge for him and the club is that he gets back to the standards for which he received much praise and awards less than 12 months ago.

Criticism comes with the territory, unfortunately. Patience and tolerance are more demanding virtues which quickly evaporate when the team, the manager, individual players, hit some bad form.

If we demand instant replacements whenever that happens, then we will never have stability or a chance for growth.

David Thomas
491 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:01:41
I think the top managers will see past Carlo's bad management Darren and be looking at making huge bids for Holgate this summer.

He's most likely going to have his pick of the top European teams and I think Everton will be forced to sell if the offers get over the £100 million mark.

Dale Self
492 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:10:29
Given Pickford's return to form I'd say there is still hope for Holgate. Not quite slim and none with slim waiting for the bus out of town but he certainly didn't help himself with that shower after a decent previous performance. Evaluate again as he fights for a place next season.
Danny O’Neill
493 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:10:39
Mason is still young enough to develop, but hasn't had the best of seasons.

That season always reminds me of being sat directly behind the bench at the Emirates Jay (BRZ).

Allardyce screaming at Kenny to "go forward". Kenny looked bemused as nothing was on. But, he followed the instruction.

Only to be bollocked and asked "what the fuck was that" as the ball rolled out for an Arsenal goal kick. The poor lad done what the coach told him even though he seemed to question it prior to following the instruction. Don't always think a forward ball for the sake of it is the best option. Players need options in front of them to play forward with intent.

4-0 down at half time. I've seen some poor Everton performances in my time but that is up there with the worst of them.

Paul A Smith
494 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:12:18
Heard it all now. Everton finally told a top club hands off, over Holgate.

Wow. Shit gets deeper weekly. When City want him, hes gone. And if you don't know that even after the manager states in the rumour rags, I think its a rumour, you need to open your mind a bit.

Darren Hind
495 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:20:23
A 4½-year contract, to ensure he was going nowhere when Man City showed interest It's funny watching people struggle to get their heads around that.

St Carlo's words suddenly don't seem to register when it doesnt suit the argument. Wonderful matadorial skill on display here.

So is the sort of poor judgement which condemned Calvert-Lewin to the Championship.

Bobby Mallon
496 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:21:18
Darren 473. You wrote
Pep wanted Mason. Carlo told him hands off. Carlo may be a game spoiler, but he knows a player when he see's one - He's inherited enough of them.
He inherited those players and got a tune out of them no other manager could get. So stop your moaning
Thomas Richards
497 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:24:43
I thought you said you didn't trust Carlo's judgement, Darren?

David Thomas
498 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:24:51
They weren't going to sell Holgate, Darren, the fans would have been in uproar.

It would have been up there with Ball going to Arsenal.

Jay Harris
499 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:25:31
I seem to remember not so long ago we were all raving about Mason Holgate as the future of the club.

He has not been the same player since his "toe" injury early in the season.

Another who has seemingly lost form is Richy. He is currently a shadow of the player we know he can be.

Maybe he is sulking about not being able to join the national team AND go to the olympics. Who knows.

Danny O’Neill
501 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:28:23
That's actually astute business by the club.

4½-year contract. Within that time he could develop into the player we hope he can be as he's still young.

It secures a decent sell on value if he doesn't and we decide to sell.

But in the interim, we need to bring in better and keep him as back up.

I still, despite my earlier doubts, fancy him to play in the sweeper role.

Barry Rathbone
502 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:30:31
Regarding 2 posters announcing a sabbatical with one doing a full on flounce why is it that people feel the need to broadcast such stuff?

When I decided to stop posting about the time Martinez oversaw the nailing of Man Utd at Old Trafford I couldn't imagine anyone being in the least bit interested and rightly so. I just went off and did something else.

I like to think of myself as a mild mannered non-reactionary type but surely people engaging in this sort of attention seeking should be horse-whipped in front of the Liver Building under the banner "HOW DO YOU LIKE THIS FOR ATTENTION?"

Brian Williams
503 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:31:08
Just got my email invite to the home game against Wolves. Anyone else lined up for punishment?

Barry@502. Now that sentiment was fine, right up until you told us about it. ;-)

Danny O’Neill
504 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:33:44
With you and others in the crowd, you get us into Europe Brian. No pressure!
Brian Williams
505 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:36:15
Danny. I was asking so that I could maybe meet up with a few TW'ers 9lucky enough to be attending) and get so pished before the game it wouldn't be so painful. :-))
Danny O’Neill
506 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:41:03
Agree Barry. We come here to talk all things Everton just as we would in the pub or next to the person we happen to be sat next to in the ground.

Me and my Dad used to argue like a cat and dog about the club we both loved. If we can't do that, without agreeing to disagree on certain things, we might as well just all agree with each other all of the time.

Nothing should be taken personally, but then again, maybe we should all be careful about getting personal.

I've stepped out of line on occasion. Very easy to do when caught in the emotion of football and Everton. But, I was always brought up to recognise and apologise when you do so. I like to think I have when I've gone too far.

Move on but keep talking, especially about Everton!!

Barry Rathbone
507 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:45:51
Dan 506

I agree entirely

Paul A Smith
508 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:48:39
Darren, it's even funnier reading shite like we told Man City no. Must have made Holgate's day there... no wonder he's been shite all season — we just ruined his career.
Derek Knox
509 Posted 03/05/2021 at 17:55:06
Brian @ 505, Spoken like the words of a Real Desperado ! Oh wait a minute. :-)
Rob Halligan
510 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:00:17
Brian # 503. Got mine this afternoon. Can even get to pick your own seat, unlike last time when you were allocated a seat.
Darren Hind
511 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:02:38
Paul @

WE didnt tell City no...Carlo did. Read his comments.

That said. I think you have raised a very fair point - even if it was for the wrong reason.

Mason was Soooooo promising, but since the City interest he seems to have got it into his head that he is better than he is.

We could have a top class Central defender...But if he is going to realise his potential, he has to stop thinking he is Ruud Krol - Ask your arl fella

Thomas Richards
512 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:08:02
Good point Darren.

And nIce to see you are listening to Carlo and backing his judgement.

Brian Williams
513 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:15:59
Rob#510. Nice one. The Saddle will be open too mate!

Derek#509. You know me so well lol.

Mike Doyle
514 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:16:12
Rob 510,

In addition to picking your own seat, are you being provided with a cushion to throw – or do you have to bring your own?

Off topic, but referring back to last week's discussion about the nicest places to live in Liverpool, I noticed an item on today's red Echo website citing Calderstones as being the city's most unaffordable (ergo the nicest) suburb. I imagine you would concur?

Alan J Thompson
515 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:35:56
We have four senior central defenders and at least one promising junior and we are being linked with central defenders like Koulibaly(?) and we don't think we'll sell one to City? Probably won't sell Mina to Italy either but one thing is for sure, if you admit you want to sell a player you won't get the best price.
Darren Hind
516 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:35:59
I have never questioned Carlo's judgement of a player. he's been there and done that. He may not have signed many, but he has played with and inherited plenty

Its his spirit of adventure I question.

Total Frankie...Funtime Frankie

Danny O’Neill
517 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:38:02
Woolton and Calderstones are the nicest areas of our city Mike in my opinion. That said being a South Liverpool boy, I don't know Crosby too well, which I understand is another very nice area.

And I view Liverpool as a city region, so Crosby to me is very much part of our city region.

Nicholas Ryan
518 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:38:19
I have said before, on other threads, that I think the reason so many Evertonians get so angry, is the WAY that we lose matches.

We are hardly ever outclassed these days [only really Manchester City] but we seem to lose, because at a vital moment, a simple pass goes astray, or a half-hearted tackle goes in, or a simple scoring chance is 'fluffed', or there is a momentary lapse of concentration.

It is the 'self-inflicted' nature of losing through these basic mistakes, that makes it all so galling and madly frustrating.

Rob Halligan
519 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:43:02
Mike, # 514. Definitely. There are some very expensive properties in the area. One on the corner of our road was on the market for well over a million quid, can't remember the exact price, but eventually went for around £800K. Got it's own indoor swimming pool as well. And no, ours is nowhere near that valuation!! 😁😁
Nicholas Ryan
521 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:44:00
If I'm allowed to pick my own seat, then, on the strength of the Villa performance, can I have one in the car park, with my back to the footie!!
Bill Gall
523 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:46:43
Holgate is bringing out the usual comments, a player from another club has an outstanding season and we should buy him, one of our own has a bad season and we should sell him. He is 24 years old and has a lot to learn as a central defender so let him except the criticism and see if he improves. The last game he was just a bad player in a bad team, with a couple of other players we expect to sell. If we get into Europe, and that is a big if, we will need young experienced players in the "squad" to help in the extra games.

The manager has to prove that he was the correct person to become manager of Everton and like the players, he has to earn the contract he has been given.
I am not going to comment on the last game as you can just copy and paste all the comments from the Fullham, Newcastle, Burnley, Crystal Palace and a few other clubs to get the same reaction.

As far as the manager goes he will have to prove himself from the next game to the transfer window in January 2022 to see if he does have a ambitious plan for the future of the club, or is he just thinking of his retirement.

One way or the other someone has to show some backbone and effort on the pitch, as the number of opportunities to improve our league position has been wasted, by the poor home games this season, that the supporters are beginning to except.

Mike Doyle
525 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:50:13
Rob # 520 ] time to get that swimming pool installed!
Rob Halligan
526 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:54:02
You got me there Thomas?

Kiddies paddling pool would be about our limit, Mike.

Thomas Richards
527 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:56:10
Kevin Nolan's and Kuyt's houses were on Quarry Street, Rob.

Kuyt's gone now but not sure if Nolan is still there.

Barry Hesketh
528 Posted 03/05/2021 at 18:58:31
I take it that Rob lives at the posh end of his street where the going rate is around £4-5m
Rob Halligan
529 Posted 03/05/2021 at 19:03:05
Gotcha. Didn't know either of them lived in Quarry Street. I heard that's where Virgil van Dijk lives, but never seen him. Pienaar was just round from us at the top of Woolton Hill Road, as was ratboy Suarez. Seamus Coleman is not too far away either, and I've met him a couple of times in Caldies Park.
Jamie Crowley
531 Posted 03/05/2021 at 19:56:38
I've not read a single comment. I will, just haven't yet.

After the game I shut down the computer and just went and worked on a deck I'm building in the backyard. And I made a decision.

I'm – kind of – done. It's the same thing every season. Hope stirs, Everton fucks you in the end.

This capitulation was terrible. We played awful. It was ugly, and it was League 1 quality.

This happens every single year it seems. We look like a team worthy of Top 4 / Europe. When we get close, it's like a switch is flipped and complacency and "know your station" takes over instead of "seize the opportunity and walk through hell in a gasoline suit to get it".

The lack of belief, will, and fight, I just can't cope with any longer.

Lately I've not been posting as much. I will read. I'll watch. I'll bleed blue in my 'Merican way. I want this Club to win so, so badly it's an obsession.

But the return on my time investment is poor. I'll never tune out, but by God I need a break.

Everton is a woman, and Everton has broken me. I love her so much I'll come back for more. But I need a time out because I'm about to beat the bitch – and not only is that wholly unacceptable, and wickedly non-pc, it serves no purpose.

Time out, Everton. Get your shit together and let's talk in the future. I'm about to kill ya, so let's take it easy for a while.

Billy Bradshaw
532 Posted 03/05/2021 at 19:56:50
Must be more to life than walking around looking for footballers.
Darren Hind
533 Posted 03/05/2021 at 20:07:18
Ah Jamie,

Have you never seen The Godfather?

"Just when I thought I was out... They pulled me back in."

Derek Taylor
534 Posted 03/05/2021 at 20:11:18
Were we to finish this season in the bottom half of the table, there is no possibility of Carlo losing his stipend in the immediate future.

Whilst we can imagine there are those amongst Everton's high and mighty who may be beginning to have doubts about the great man, they will never look to sack him until Moshiri, Kenwright and Usmanov all agree that relegation is nigh. And we are a very long way from that scenario at present!

Will Mabon
536 Posted 03/05/2021 at 20:44:15
Bit of a theme developing. That's three Blue Victims now, threatening to "Leave" since last night - but you know you'll be back, you know it. If you ever even leave. It's a curse, it's in you, and it will never let you go - NEVER...
Raymond Fox
537 Posted 03/05/2021 at 21:05:00
Nic @518, if you're making basic mistakes, you're not a class team.
Brendan McLaughlin
538 Posted 03/05/2021 at 21:12:06
Yes Will, #536,

We are hooked and Everton are like a drug... just one that never gives us a high!

Will Mabon
539 Posted 03/05/2021 at 21:13:44
Brendan - masochism.
Don Alexander
541 Posted 03/05/2021 at 22:05:45
Harry (#476), "mea culpa" re Mary, and I apologise to her.

That said, my opinion of Ferguson is not slanderous as far as I'm concerned. Towards the end of his "career" a national broadsheet newspaper published a two-page demolition of his character, identifying sources at all his clubs who all denigrated him, without complaint from him.

As a player with God-given talent he decided to be a shyster throughout his career.

I've mentioned it before, but a pal of mine was a linesman in a League Cup semi at Goodison against Sunderland that went to pens. Ferguson was in the centre-circle audibly refusing to take a pen whilst deriding Bakayoko who did have the balls to take one (which he missed, and we lost). What really shocked my mate was Ferguson saying to another Scottish player that he was happy to have lost, and that sickens me from a so-called professional.

Once he bankrupted himself he might well have needed to find "love" for us, and a nice little earner from the Teary One to go with it.

To me the adage "leopards and spots" fit him to a Tee.


Bill Gall
542 Posted 03/05/2021 at 22:14:27
See West Ham never had any problem with Burnley looks like we will be fighting with Liverpool and Tottenham for 7/8th place. So much for them often used games in hand comments, that Everton seemed to avoid.
Barry Hesketh
543 Posted 03/05/2021 at 22:19:18
Don @ 541
I remember the game with Sunderland but it was a 4th round Worthington Cup game which Everton lost 4-5 on penalties. I was annoyed with Ferguson at the time when he failed to step up to take a penalty.

As for your reference to him being pleased about being knocked out, I can't comment as I've no idea if that's a fact or not.

Andy Crooks
544 Posted 03/05/2021 at 22:26:30
Jamie @531, you can't do that. You can no more walk away than you can take a vow of silence. You will sceam fuck!!! at the top of your voice. There is no cure for what we have got. Abstinence doesn't help. The only hope for you is group therapy.
It is available here on ToffeeWeb. Come Jamie, just say it.
" My name is Jamie Crowley and I am an Evertonian"
John Skelly
545 Posted 03/05/2021 at 23:30:44
Jamie @531,

I concur wholeheartedly. If only I had something or someone to strike out at but, being a sort of nice person, I can't find one. God give me a garden to take my anxiety out on.

Stephen Vincent
546 Posted 03/05/2021 at 23:39:23
Rob #529,

How times have changed. I remember Colin Harvey lived in a semi-detached bungalow in Cherry Vale opposite the old Gateacre Hall Hotel. Jimmy Husband was in a semi on Linkstor Road. I used to clean his windows!!!

Rob Halligan
547 Posted 03/05/2021 at 23:46:48
Remember them well, Stephen. Always very accommodating when young kids knocked on their doors for autographs. Did Jimmy Husband pay you extra for cleaning his E Type Jaguar? 😁😁
John Boon
548 Posted 03/05/2021 at 00:33:45
Andy (544),

Your advice regarding shared miseries and long-term disappointments is so right on. Jamie(531), like most of us Evertonians, has an incurable disease, and like all diseases, it controls you. Jamie, I empathise and sypathise with and for you. But a dose of reality.

Read with caution. Sometimes this dreadful illness goes into a minor remission (eg, Arsenal 1-0) but it will dictate for itself and return with a vengeance. There is no known cure and, like most fatal conditions, it can affect those around you.

Fortunately, with a world population of nearly 8,000,000,000, it only affects about 60,000. In fact, some experts on the disease feel it only affects 52,000. Personally, I think it is many many more than both numbers. I caught the disease in my chidhood along with 78,000 weak-minded folks just like myself.

At that time the disease was mainly centered in the Liverpool area. Since then, it has spread around the world to many, usually to those who are delusional and easily influenced, and sometimes from close relatives because it has proved to be very contagious.

Again there is no known cure. You will also get no sympathy from those around you. Many of your friends and relatives consider that you have significant mental problems. In my case, my very closest of relatives, my dear wife.

Symptoms include:

(1) Intense anxiety that always last for 90 minutes and usually more.
(2) Usually includes irrational screaming at TV or those who are with you.
(3) At its worst, a hatred for anyone in a blue shirt.
(4) At its best, an intense hatred for anyone in a red shirt.
(5) A delusional belief that you alone know just how to fix the problems, because everyone connected with your team when they lose should be banned from everything for life.
(6) Intense mood swings (eg Liverpool 2-0) when euphoria takes over and you love everyone in the world and even hug the cat which you are getting rid of the next day.
(7) Regular threats to never have anything to do with your team Everton because you have had a toxic love affair for most of your life.
(8) One more delusional activity is to write to a site known as ToffeeWeb. It is always therapeutic to know of many others who have the same disease. I know because I use it when I need to, particularly when the disease is at a very high point. Some people use it 10 times every day. They need help far more than most and must have the most extreme form of the disease.

No Cure!! You may walk away, you may say you are finally cured but you will come back. You just do not have any choice. It is an obsession, a compulsion, and of course a disease. I know because I have it.

Simon Dalzell
549 Posted 04/05/2021 at 01:57:46
'No manager on earth could get a tune out of these players', and similar comments, miss the point completely. We all know we have too many crap players but, as always, the question has to be: Is the manager getting the best out of what he has got? The answer is a resounding No with Carlo.

Poor selection and non-existent game management, week on end. Antonio from West Ham said tonight how hard Moyes had got them working. Showing them that they stood 19th in the 'mileage' table when he arrived... now 5th. Do I think our manager is up to date with such stats?

We are desperate to watch, seem to have no plan or pattern, and a clueless manager who stands with a blank, dazed expression, changing nothing. There have been many games where early subs. or tactical changes have been urgently needed when we inevitably go behind.

We fans can see this, but he sits on his hands and waits. Far too late, and usually does the wrong anyway. I have been astonished by Ancelotti's incompetence.

Stephen Vincent
550 Posted 04/05/2021 at 02:14:37
Rob, I never saw his car, but he did give me a ticket for the '68 cup final.

I also remember Colin Harvey opening the St Mary's monthly disco at the church hall in Quarry St.

Perhaps if the current players had the same connection with the fans they would understand the frustration that we feel. Not going to happen.

Jay Harris
551 Posted 04/05/2021 at 02:41:00
Simon,

You're making me wonder how Carlo became the most successful manager in football even winning more than Pep. Maybe he was just lucky.

Bobby Mallon
552 Posted 04/05/2021 at 07:10:22
John Boon, the best post I have read. Take a bow 🙇‍♂️, brilliant.
Bobby Mallon
553 Posted 04/05/2021 at 07:15:13
I had a meltdown after the game – the Vila game for me was the one we needed to win. But, after beer and shouting, I still know that Carlo is the manager to get us into Europe – and he will... if not this season, it will be next.
Tony Everan
554 Posted 04/05/2021 at 07:22:42
John 548, a priceless early morning laugh ! Thank you.

In incurable disease that we will all be showing severe symptoms of . The trouble is that the joke and reality of this illness don't keep themselves separated!

David Thomas
555 Posted 04/05/2021 at 07:28:33
I would encourage people to read Michael Ball's assessment of Holgate in today's Echo, sums it up well in my opinion.
Tony Everan
556 Posted 04/05/2021 at 07:47:16
David, just read Michael's column. His appraisal will hit home as it is from a really good ex-player who loves Everton like we do. His comments are in line with what many on here are thinking.
David Thomas
557 Posted 04/05/2021 at 07:56:38
Tony,

Exactly it's not about making players scapegoats it's just peoples honest assessments of what they are seeing each week.

If we are going to make that step forward I'm afraid it's not going to be with players of the calibre of Holgate. Unfortunately it's not only him though it's most of our current squad.

Derek Knox
558 Posted 04/05/2021 at 08:28:31
Tony and David, I totally agree with Michael Ball's assessment and have done for a long time now, I think if any decent offer were to come in, Snatch/Hand/Off!

Those feelings extend to Andre Gomes, Alex Iwobi, Fabian Delph and a few others who appear from time to time from the Treatment Room. I will no doubt 'ruffle a few feathers' and I am not a regular 'feather ruffler', (an arrestable offence depending on which way it is executed) but I am prepared to take any flak should it arrive.

I am all for building the team comprising of hard working, no-nonsense players with a turn of speed and skill combined, as is displayed fairly consistently by Ben Godfrey who could be well on his way to being 'Player of the Season'. That is my opinion, but I don't think too many would disagree regarding Ben.

Tony Abrahams
559 Posted 04/05/2021 at 08:34:36
I genuinely feel that you do love Everton, Jamie C, because I can feel it jumping off your post.

I could go all high and mighty and say us legacy fans, don't have a choice, but that would be wrong because you're an Evertonian mate, and this is exactly what Everton do to us on a regular fucking basis.

I've missed games, but only twice have I felt like you do now, I remember buying everyone a ticket for Blackburn, and not buying myself one because I'd had enough of Walter Smith, (actually went to work and made a fortune, but money doesn't compare to the travelling blue army) and again I never stepped inside Goodison, with Moyes in charge, once we capitulated against Wigan in the cup.

I still went the away games though, which was a contradiction (I'd decided I wasn't giving Everton another penny whilst Moyes was in bed with Kenwright) and after a little rest, I'm sure you will be back Jamie, singing “we shall not be moved”!

I've got a new route into town nowadays Jamie, I drive the long way so I can go past Bramley Moore, and next time I go past I'll think of the crazy Yank, running round his car screaming at a kids football tournament because his team had just beaten Liverpool, because that's exactly what it means to be blue kid🙏

Robert Tressell
560 Posted 04/05/2021 at 08:45:28
Derek, the signing of Ben Godfrey is a good reminder of just what a wholehearted player with some pace and guts can bring to the side. I'll hold my hand up and admit that when people suggested Matty Cash as our new right back last summer I thought we could do much better. But he's cut from the same sort of cloth as Ben Godfrey and even if some of these players lack polish (Holgate may well be more talented / skilful than Godfrey) they give you such a lot.

Brent Stephens
561 Posted 04/05/2021 at 09:02:47
John #552 - cracker! you're a cracker! we're all crackers on here!
Tony Everan
562 Posted 04/05/2021 at 09:11:47
Robert, we must have considered Matty Cash, I followed his progress at Forest and he stood out as a consistently influential part of their team. I think he will improve too, an excellent signing for Villa. Sam H a year ago was regularly positive about him being a good option.

Makes me think either we are inept or we have someone already lined up, an agreement for Aarons maybe.

What do you think of Ivan Toney at Brentford, he is looking the real deal and that he will make the step up. He is banging the goals in for fun like a natural goalscorer. At just turned 25 a good age and looks physically strong too. We need a team with more goals in it and this player looks like he could help provide them.

I think he will have a few options this summer , and will be hot property.

Joe McMahon
563 Posted 04/05/2021 at 09:16:04
Jamie, I know exactly how you feel. I'm trying to find other interests in my life, and spend more time with my wife and its half working, but I still keep checking my phone and this site! It's hard to pull away (as you can see)

I've come to my own conclusion that we won't dine at the top table again, the rot since the late 80s followed by misty eyes, 11 years of Moyes, the Koeman and Walsh duo and living in past glories decades ago. I always felt the stadium needed to be sooner ( such as Kings Dock)

However it would be nice to see attacking football, goals, a cup and European (CL) football and a squad good enough to deliver this, and above all a team and manager that want this.


Bobby Mallon
564 Posted 04/05/2021 at 09:35:23
Derek Knox I agree. A team of
Pickford
Arron's
Godfrey
Conor Cody
Digne
Doucourér
Allan
Raphina
Kelvin Philips
DCL
Ivan Tony (Brentford). Now that would be a proper talented hard working team ( IMO )
Steve Brown
565 Posted 04/05/2021 at 09:40:54
Pep might have expressed an interest in Holgate and Carlo might have said no - who knows and who cares? Simple fact is that Mason has been gash all season and that is why he has been played at right back.

He has shown he can manage on the right side of a back three, but as a centre-back in any pairing with Keane/Godrey/Mina he has been weak.

I still like him though so let's see what next season brings.

Dave Abrahams
566 Posted 04/05/2021 at 09:41:48
John (548), John, absolutely brilliant post and spot on, it ‘s the worst drug known to mankind and again you're correct there is only one cure for it, as they say, from the cradle to the grave, that's when it ends.

John, you didn't get rid of the cat did you? Was it black, you know like did it bring you luck, obviously not with the Blues!!

Liam Heffernan
567 Posted 04/05/2021 at 10:00:40
I love the idea of Carlo as our manager but why does he persist week in, week out with Ritchie, except for short period during the season he offers absolutely nothing. I think he gave the ball nearly every time he got possession. Even his freak goal against Arsenal his pass to DCL was misplaced. Surely King should start and see if he makes a difference, couldn't be much worse.
Brian Harrison
568 Posted 04/05/2021 at 10:03:59
Just to rub even more salt into the wounds it looks like Moyes may get West Ham into the Champions league. They have 4 winnable games left us then Brighton, West Brom and Southampton, while Chelsea are 3 points ahead of them they have a much tougher run in. They play City, Arsenal, Leicester and Villa.
Tony Everan
569 Posted 04/05/2021 at 10:10:24
Liam, I think too that Carlo has to be a bit braver and drop Richarlison for a game. A) King deserves to be given a fighting chance to prove himself. and B) It may serve as a wake up call to Richarlison to get his act together.

No player should have his position by right, it should be earned.

Steve Shave
570 Posted 04/05/2021 at 10:42:03
Jamie 531 I feel EXACTLY the same at the moment - just so frustrated. I know the answer isn't to turn away but I'm so tired of hoping, getting close to that hope then being let down by our blues. I'll be back but I'm definitely taking a break from footie.
Kevin Molloy
571 Posted 04/05/2021 at 11:37:56
In pondering what the hell has gone wrong with this season, a horrible thought did occur. And as I couldn't remember I went back to check the date when Carlo got burgled. The 12 February, just after the best game of the season in many people's eyes, the win against Spurs in the Cup. We started February like a train after a so so January and an excellent December. Results since Spurs would see us relegated if extrapolated over a season.
Liam Heffernan
572 Posted 04/05/2021 at 11:39:53
Tony, totally agree, don't get me wrong, Ritchie is great talent, but something is really off with him this season and there are times that players need benching.
Christopher Timmins
573 Posted 04/05/2021 at 12:51:49
Unfortunately, performances have been of a consistently low level for months now. Last Saturday was just another one to add to the list.

It's hard to see us finishing much higher than where we currently stand with away games against Villa, West Ham and City to come, all teams who have beaten us at home.

Sunday is the last, last chance saloon for us!

The summer recruitment will be very important and if the targets include a current Barcelona ex Liverpool player then I fear for us going forward. At best he will keep James company in the treatment room at worst another one who is looking a final pension pot.

We need young hungry players with potential, the ones that Brands was hired to find for us.


Danny O’Neill
574 Posted 04/05/2021 at 13:54:58
Everton being Everton, they'll beat West Ham at the weekend and do what they always do to me. Give me hope. They say you can only hate those you love. But then that's an emotional reaction as you can't really. So apt.
Ian Edwards
575 Posted 04/05/2021 at 16:35:22
It seems some of our fans have fallen into the same negative mindset as our Manager. Why should it be King OR Richarlison. Why not put Richie on the flank and play King with DCL.

Richie is not a striker. He would be better being used deeper and running at Defences and creating chances and arriving in the box.

It's time our Kenny Rogers lookalike Manager became "The Gambler" instead of his usual "Coward of the County".

Brian Wilkinson
576 Posted 04/05/2021 at 16:37:20
It will be good to have supporters in for the final home game, get a bit of atmosphere in the ground again.

What is everyone's thoughts on the City away game, where there is a possibility of a few hundred away fans allowed, me personally, I would prefer Everton to turn down the allocation.

If like we have seen over the weekend, I fully expect some small token from those clubs involved in the dirty dozen, to either pitch invade, or come up with some protest.

I would prefer our supporters to be well away from anything they could get drawn into, by the Premier league.

Let them do whatever they seem fit to do, as long as the Everton supporters are not allocated tickets, then that is one thing they will not be able to use against Everton.

Let the six have their protests, let them try and dig themselves out of the hole, they have dug themselves in.

Why should Evertonians reunite to help their causes.

Like I have said in previous posts, over 25 clubs have been docked points for their owners going into Administration, no fault of the fans, players, or Managers, let them fight this protest on their own, with Everton fans well away from the protests, and then in due course, face the same punishment as the other 20 odd clubs.

Thomas Richards
577 Posted 04/05/2021 at 16:40:23
Tactical awareness of Dolly.
Dale Self
578 Posted 04/05/2021 at 16:45:51
Parton?
Danny O’Neill
579 Posted 04/05/2021 at 16:46:41
I trust our fans to not get drawn into anything Brian. Go the match and support Everton. Maintain the morale high ground. In the midst of the 80s as our cousins rioted in Brussels and other English supporters shamed our game, we showed our class in Rotterdam. German cities like Nurnberg have an affiliation because our our behaviour.

Ian, I'm just not a fan of 4-4-2 in the modern game. It leaves you exposed and overrun in midfield. No point having 2 up top if you're not supplying them. Just my view, I appreciate yours.

Derek Knox
580 Posted 04/05/2021 at 16:52:09
Thomas @ 577, That nearly went Tits Up! :-)
Brent Stephens
581 Posted 04/05/2021 at 16:54:11
No more bust ups, guys.
Brian Wilkinson
582 Posted 04/05/2021 at 17:06:26
I trust our fans as well Danny, as in the past it did not matter one jot.

For me if fans come together, the more sympathy those clubs will get, the less they will will face rightful punishment, me personally I would let our fans sit this one out, then press reset for away fans, in the new season.

Derek Moore
583 Posted 04/05/2021 at 17:10:29
Some of these puns are on a Parton with our home form. Wonder if these tits can somehow get the booby prize of a European finish. Even playing their breast, I doubt it.

Carlo has his knockers, and probably deservedly so.

Brian Wilkinson
584 Posted 04/05/2021 at 17:27:47
Certainly missing Doucoure in that team.
Danny O’Neill
585 Posted 04/05/2021 at 17:31:38
I see where you're coming from Brian. Easy to unintentionally get dragged into sympathising.

Doucoure a huge miss. I'm probably foolishly not giving up on this season just yet, but Doucoure's injury looks increasingly significant to our fate. As does the time we lost Allan. Having those 2 out has exposed the thinness of the squad.

Martin Mason
586 Posted 04/05/2021 at 17:37:50
Just read that Tottenham are after Aarons from Norwich. Isn't that unusual?
Phil (Kelsall) Roberts
587 Posted 04/05/2021 at 17:44:26
West Ham Away - David Moyes.

Knife to a gun fight?

Do I ever want Everton to lose - no, never. But West Ham have a chance of 12 points in the last 4 games which would mean No Liverpool, Spurs, Arsenal and maybe no Chelsea (still to play Leicester and City) in the Champions League next year. I am going to agonise over this for the next few days.

Answer will be - hope we win, but not too upset if we lose - Just don't draw as it is useless for both teams.

Rob Halligan
588 Posted 04/05/2021 at 18:05:06
Phil, give your head a little bit of a wobble. There is nothing to agonise over.
Brian Murray
589 Posted 04/05/2021 at 18:26:14
Ian Post 575. I'm sick of us always ending like Becky after the Gatlin boys got what they wanted ! Usually well and truly rodgered !
Brian Murray
590 Posted 04/05/2021 at 18:31:10
I wonder if those about to perish on the titanic spoke about a game in hand ! Get real blues
See us for what we are and think about the summer on and off the pitch. Enjoy.
Colin Glassar
591 Posted 04/05/2021 at 18:36:53
Our season is over so, like PKR, I wouldn't mind if WHU made the top 4 at the expense of the ESL traitors.

I'm no fan of Moyes but his team deserve their shot at the CL and who knows, he might just get beyond the last 16.

Tony Abrahams
592 Posted 04/05/2021 at 18:41:38
Danny @479,

I agree about 4-4-2, and think this formation has killed Everton, every time they've played it. I can't believe Josh King, has been used so sparingly though, especially because he could play on the left of a three, Richarlison, on the right of a three, and Calvert-Lewin, could play down the middle.

He could then play Allan, Davies, and another in the middle of the park (I'd personally try Iwobi there). And suddenly, the team should have width, balance, and no big fuck-off holes in the middle of the park, which have been exploited by nearly every team below us in the table. This must surely tell the manager something; I find impossible to believe he doesn't already know?

Danny O’Neill
593 Posted 04/05/2021 at 19:07:35
We've been talking about that hole in the middle since October Tony, so how the manager doesn't know it is there is beyond me.

The lack of use of King is equally odd. I mean, don't get me wrong, I wasn't a big advocate of bringing him in, but having done so and then not to use him is strange.

Darren Hind
594 Posted 04/05/2021 at 19:17:45
Players have learned not to engage Allan, but to simply step into the space he repeatedly abandons when he goes ball hunting. Barkley thought it was Chrimbo.

When we build that golden statue of the Brazilian Peter Reid, we need to put a big fuck off hole behind it.

Ray Roche
595 Posted 04/05/2021 at 19:24:50
Ellis Simms scores for Blackpool
Thomas Richards
596 Posted 04/05/2021 at 19:29:57
11 v 11 Darren.

Nobody in the Premier League has made more ball-winning tackles than Allan this season.
He is very effective.

Should another of our players cover the space?

Brian Wilkinson
597 Posted 04/05/2021 at 19:35:04
While we are on the subject of the protests, I know Man Utd have a huge debt. If the fans got their wish and the owners walked away, am I right in assuming the debt would remain with the football club and not the owners?

If that is the case and a lot of the big clubs' owners walked away, would any owners look to invest in a club with so much debt, that is not a rich overseas investor?

If the fans drove towards the 51% ownership, how would these clubs maintain paying huge transfer fees and wages?

Any knowledgeable football fan out there, know the ins and outs and how the clubs would be affected, if the owners left???

Ian Edwards
598 Posted 04/05/2021 at 19:39:50
I disagree about 4-4-2. It's the best formation. The two wide men join up with the forwards and make a 4 when attacking and can drop back to make two banks of 4 when defending.

We won the league twice in the 80s playing 4-4-2 and before you all shout that the game is different now, I would point out that Leicester City won the Premier League playing 4-4-2.

Kevin Molloy
599 Posted 04/05/2021 at 19:42:33
Brian
it seems to me that the Glazers treated buying United like buying a house. Only they didn't have a deposit, and they found a tenant who would give them rent 10 times what the mortgage repayments are. Truly the deal of the century. NOt a penny have they put in, but they have rinsed the club up and down. In my view, their purchase is the best thing to happen to the league in 20 years, took a behemoth out of the game in one stroke. Gave the rest of us a chance for once. Ditto Arsenal. Ditto Liverpool only they actually wanted to win on the pitch too (sadly)
Colin Glassar
600 Posted 04/05/2021 at 19:56:19
Thomas 596, now don't go upsetting our resident erudite with facts.
Danny O’Neill
601 Posted 04/05/2021 at 19:58:48
Pushed for choice Ian, my preferred formation is 4-2-3-1 as I think it is the most complete in terms of always ensuring you have the right balance of attacking and defending players.

But then with the right players, I feel 3-5-2 is the most attacking (but can leave you exposed on the flanks).

The key point is the right players. Play a formation that suits and gets the most out of the players you have. Don't make the players you have for the system you want.

With what we have now, if it's 2 up top, I'm more inclined to go 3-5-2.

Colin Glassar
603 Posted 04/05/2021 at 20:26:45
Or FAKHTS, as the FSW would say.
Tony Abrahams
604 Posted 04/05/2021 at 20:30:19
The best system is one that suits the players imo Ian, and my point is that every time Everton try to play an open game with a 4-4-2 formation, they've came unstuck, but when they've been tight playing ugly football, they have usually got better results.

Robert Tressell
605 Posted 04/05/2021 at 20:30:36
Ian @ 598, I very much enjoyed watching Capello's AC Milan destroy Barcelona playing 442. Or perhaps 4411. Leicester did something similar with Okazaki playing off Vardy. Although I preferred watching Dejan Savicevic in that position for AC.

So it can most certainly be done as you say. The days of classic Newcastle and Blackburn sides with their more traditional 442 (two centre forwards + two wingers + two box to box) is too easily found out now though, albeit I'm sure those teams would still be a handful today.

But there are also awful flawed versions of 352 or 4321 or 433 - as we've all been unlucky enough to bear witness to.

The formation isn't really the issue (as Bilic recently said sometimes we're really only talking about a 10 yard difference in starting position). The key is just to have a few absolutely excellent players and others who allow those players to play to their strengths.

Currently it's easiest to do that with a central midfield trio but it's not essential if the other players work the midfield spaces too.

Danny O’Neill
606 Posted 04/05/2021 at 20:43:03
I loved watching the Everton side that picked itself in 1984-85, which was a steady 4-4-2, even though we didn't have the most natural or pacey wingers; certainly not in Sheedy's case.

I fluffed my final sentence earlier. Should have ended don't make the players you have FIT the system you want to play. I think we're in agreement, you play a system / formation that suits that players you have. Or you bring in players to suit the system you want to play.

The reality of the modern game however is that you need to be flexible. Formations don't just change game to game now, they change during the game. We're not quite NFL, but you can see shape and formation change depending on whether a team has possession or is defending.

Brian Wilkinson
607 Posted 04/05/2021 at 21:38:39
Good points them Danny, I also remember Peter Reid more defensive midfielder at the start and impacted on his overall play, once we gave Peter Reid a more advanced freedom, he was like a Jack Russell in midfield.

4-4-2 seems a decent formation, but now you get all sorts of permutations, even a bloody xmas tree formation.

Was it Brian Clough, or another manager, who once said, football is a simple game, made complicated by tacticians.

Danny O’Neill
608 Posted 04/05/2021 at 21:44:47
Last paragraph says it all Brian!

Christmas Trees, Diamonds (please don't play the diamond!!).

Going back to the 80s team, in the modern game, how good a so called number 10 would Kevin Sheedy have been?

Tony Abrahams
609 Posted 04/05/2021 at 22:13:28
Danny @606, I remember playing central midfield against an Everton youth team around this time, and it always felt like they had an extra man because one wide player would come and squeeze the pitch depending on which side the play was on, and it was very difficult to play against.

Did Bilic say that Robert? Ten yards difference in a player's starting position is incredible given how fast the game is now, especially because it's the most important position for every single player including the goalkeeper imo mate.

David Thomas
610 Posted 04/05/2021 at 22:25:58
Carlo needs to prioritise improving the midfield. Holgate should play in Allans role because he's shown time and time again that he's one of those players who can play in any position and make it look effortless.

Carlo won't change it though because he is yesterday's man and Holgate will not be utilised correctly as he's clearly a stand out player in our squad who would fit comfortably into Man City's team.

It's time to get rid of Carlo and Brands and get Duncan and Rhino in.

Barry Rathbone
611 Posted 04/05/2021 at 22:31:41
Brian 607

The greatest manager of all time, Bill Shankly, said

"football is a simple game made complicated by people who should know better"

Thomas Richards
612 Posted 04/05/2021 at 22:34:11
🎣🎣
Danny O’Neill
613 Posted 04/05/2021 at 22:39:49
I think what you're saying Tony is what sometimes us (the fans) don't realise what is happening on the pitch. You often see a full back or a wide player leave an opposing player free on the flank, but see them squeeze play closer to the where the ball is. To a supporter it looks like we're leaving someone in space. But you only go an squeeze that space if the ball goes there. Otherwise you stretch yourself and leave gaps worrying about a player who is nowhere near the ball. You have to impact the ball to impact the play, whether in possession or not.
Barry Hesketh
614 Posted 04/05/2021 at 22:40:50

I don't suppose there are many if any football-related quotes that aren't attributed to the Scottish guru, I wonder where he found the time to actually manage his club.
Terry White
615 Posted 04/05/2021 at 22:41:53
David (#610), you are delusional.
Brian Wilkinson
616 Posted 04/05/2021 at 22:58:31
Cheers Barry, never was a a manager so right about people complicating the game.
Robert Tressell
617 Posted 04/05/2021 at 23:00:04
Tony @609. I may have got the precise quote of Bilic wrong but that was the sentiment.

So your example of a wide player tucked in might actually have been a hair's breadth from a 433 or 4231 as opposed to a 442, say. I think that's Bilic's point.

And then you can play the same formations in different ways. In a 442, Tony Hibbert used to occupy a very different space on the pitch compared with, say, Salgado or Zanetti or Zambrotta. They all secretly envied Hibbo's ability to close down a cross, mind you.

Sean Kelly
618 Posted 04/05/2021 at 23:20:43
Christy and Kieran I salute you both. The clique here has stunk this place for the past few years. I have occasionally chosen to refrain from posting but sometimes get drawn in to contradict those on the high morale ground.
This forum doesn't allow adult conversation but has given control to a right wing group that stamps out reasonable debate. The mods allow people to be vilified by a few for holding alternative views. My crime in the past was my grammar and spelling mistakes. I'm off too for good.
Dale Self
619 Posted 04/05/2021 at 23:36:10
Sean, not trying to pick one here but the mods are probably managing this as best they can without getting jackboot about it. And you shouldn't concede control to anyone, you're tacitly encouraging the behavior you oppose.
On the bad days think of it as being trash talked by your opponent, although no blue is really your opponent. On the good days I consider it similar to a party of smartasses with a nitrous oxide tank. Short of people doing the fish, you get that multichannel chat thing going and it can be a gas.
Sean Kelly
620 Posted 04/05/2021 at 23:44:49
Dale I get what you are saying but I got it in the past. Standards my friend is what its about. This forum no longer represents the Everton I have supported for the past 60 years. Maybe its the new way but I prefer to uphold standards and apply the equally.
Dale Self
621 Posted 04/05/2021 at 23:58:35
I get that Sean, no problem at all with the standard as I think I understand it. Sometimes spaces fade from what they were. From my perspective, I've followed the club for 27 but have only been contributing to the site for less than one so I'm trying to make it work. Stay blue and come back when you can make sense of it.
Don Alexander
622 Posted 04/05/2021 at 00:04:37
The debate on formations is interesting but the fact is that any formation for a team so devoid of pace and mental energy as we are in midfield (and defence to a lesser but important extent) is beside the point.

(DCL earlier this season identified himself, Richi, Godfrey and Branthwaite as the paciest in the squad - no mention of a midfielder).

Reidy was devoid of pace but often said that Bracewell did his running for him, and he was right. Reidy was the one slow-coach in the entire team though. One is allowed providing they provide exceptional ability, three or four are unsustainable to any success at all.

Why Moshiri has authorised such massive expenditure without realising this is bizarre.

Just now Carlo has started to openly criticise the team for lassitude, and to me the lack of pace and vigour is his chief gripe. So, this summer, will Moshiri have the balls to grasp the nettles he's embedded at USMFF with his erratic signings (and they are his, ultimately, as the owner), uproot them and replace them with specimens with a chance to start making his failed three-year project (stated five very long years ago) reality?

Tony Abrahams
623 Posted 05/05/2021 at 19:14:28
Sorry Danny@613, I have only just read your post mate. You make sense in what you're saying Danny, but what I was actually meaning, is that football is about making it as hard as possible for your opponent, and that is not something I see Everton doing, whenever they move away from keeping it tight.

I think we can count our good results, coming by the way of playing an open game on one hand, and the only two that spring to mind since Liverpool at home, (October) are Leeds away, and Spurs at home in the cup, and we most certainly haven't made it hard for anyone at Goodison Pk for a long time.


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