Marco Silva admitted that his side didn't play especially well at Villa Park but argued they didn't deserve to lose given the chances they created.
Everton went down 2-0 to newly-promoted Aston Villa, conceding their first goals of the season and suffering their first defeat in hugely disappointing fashion.
The Blues dominated possession but struggled to break Dean Smith's team down, especially once the hosts had a lead to defend afforded them by Wesley's 22nd-minute strike, which they did in determined fashion.
Nevertheless, Everton created three good chances to score but managed just one effort on target all evening, that a Dominic Calvert-Lewin effort that the striker fired at Bjorn Engels on the goal-line with a clear shot at goal from 11 yards out.
Substitute Alex Iwobi was unfortunate to see the best effort of the second half come back off the post Lucas Digne scooped a stoppage-time effort over the bar but Theo Walcott wasted a gilt-edged chance when he was picked out by Moise Kean but slashed a volley high over the crossbar.
"We didn't achieve what we deserved," Silva said. "We started the game well. When you play away and create three of four clear chances to score and don't score one... When you create the clear chance with Dominic.."
"After we changed to 4-4-2, we started to create more chances. [We] hit the post with Iwobi and [there was a] big chance for Theo but we couldn't take them.
"With all the chances we created we deserved something more."
Silva was asked whether he thought it was a good performance, he said: "I didn't say it was a good performance. We had possession and didn't score. It wasn't the best performance."
Reader Comments (98)
Note: the following content is not moderated or vetted by the site owners at the time of submission. Comments are the responsibility of the poster. Disclaimer
1 Posted 24/08/2019 at 08:04:12
2 Posted 24/08/2019 at 08:06:29
4 Posted 24/08/2019 at 08:32:43
5 Posted 24/08/2019 at 08:33:08
I don't worry or care about a lot of those players who came on the field last night and didn't earn their wages but I worry about where my club Everton are going with frauds like these on their books.
6 Posted 24/08/2019 at 09:04:48
7 Posted 24/08/2019 at 09:23:31
As for DCL, a Sunday league striker wouldve scored that. it's even more horrific from behind the goal, where t he whole of the left side (6 YARDS) is wide open.
Villa took their chances and deserved to win.
8 Posted 24/08/2019 at 09:23:41
9 Posted 24/08/2019 at 09:33:24
It's the simple things which are going wrong. A failure to put in a cross which our players can attack. An inability to play a decent through ball. An inability to play a simple pass forward to our own player. A failure to look around at where the opposition are running.Lack of desire in some players to grab control of the game.
I also think we still have a problem at No10- Siggy not Boris. Our midfield play is way too ponderous and Siggy and Morgan are too slow to play in this team. Ok Morgan was a second or third choice last night but Siggy does not contribute if he doesn't score and cannot survive just because he scored a few last year. Iwobi looked good and I would play him instead of Siggy, Gbamin to return when fit and Delph to challenge Gomes( dreadful from him last night).
I thought DCL was one of our better players last night but no doubt his “supportersâ€ will slag him off for the one chance he missed and ignore the fact that only one chance created for the CF in 95 minutes needs to be addressed first. KÃ¨an looks good and I thought Mina had a decent game too.
Silva has work to do- we still look a yard too slow and lacking fire. It's s### or bust for him this season and he has to find his best team quickly.
10 Posted 24/08/2019 at 09:38:33
How much confidence dies the rest of the side have in him I wonder. Hes not justified his in inclusion as a striker.
11 Posted 24/08/2019 at 09:39:10
12 Posted 24/08/2019 at 09:46:42
A woeful effort by most of the players (not all) and most especially by our manager.
His original team selection, tactics and then subsequent game management was shameful.
Schneiderlin doesn't care, doesn't try and just strolls around avoiding any responsibility. When he does decide to get involved it's almost always a sideways or backward pass that contributes nothing.
Walcott has spent his entire career flattering to deceive. He will never change.
DCL has a fantastic attitude, great work rate and I love him to bits but he just doesn't score goals.
Bernard,, siggy, Richie are all guys who could be described as enigmas. They had a good game once and we're all waiting on it happening again.
It's not their fault they keep getting picked. I fear Marco is just too stubborn and we're in Martinez territory of doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.
How Gomes lasted the entire game should be the subject of a lengthy conversation at the next board meeting. Taking him off would have been a mercy for his own sake. He deserved better management.
13 Posted 24/08/2019 at 09:48:11
Yes, he has the interests of the players to look after but he also has the interest of the support, especially the fans who went last night, to say it as we all saw it.
Only thing I saw last night was proof that "my boy" McGinn will be in great demand at the end of the season. He spent more energy himself than our lot did in total. Him and Grealish bossed it both with and without the ball. Embarrassing.
14 Posted 24/08/2019 at 09:49:40
15 Posted 24/08/2019 at 10:00:41
Many people will focus on him for the failure to score last night but the midfield was dreadful once Villa scored. I think Kean has to be given a start now and Iwobi and maybe even the French lad at right-back.
Calvert-Lewin may never be the finished article â€“ I hope he will be â€“ but us losing last night was not down to him.
16 Posted 24/08/2019 at 10:05:21
Dead ball specialist? He was more 'Dead Balls' last night. I would play Bernard in his role. He successfully played that position in Russia. I believe he would be ideal in a pivotal role, his quick thinking and footwork, bringing Kean and whichever wide men are picked into play.
Okay, Calvert Lewin should have scored, but the lad could not be faulted for effort. Gomes uncharacteristically stunk and Richarlison looks like a petulant sulking child when things don't go his way. In all three games so far we have started like world beaters for 20 minutes, then like an over-excited boxer we 'punch ourselves out', run out of steam and ideas and allow the opposition possession.
I don't profess to know the answer, that is your job, Mr Silva. But please, don't say we deserved more. We got exactly what we deserved last night. In fact, we were fortunate to hang on for three points against Watford. We now have a decent squad, when all are fit it is your job to make hard decisions even if it means dropping so-called costly 'stars' and find a winning formula.
It's early days yes, but my comments are aimed mainly at established players who are continuing to display the worst aspects of their respective games.
17 Posted 24/08/2019 at 10:17:20
Calvert-Lewin will always play as long as Silva is manager, he must have total faith in him â€“ otherwise, he would've bought a replacement in the summer.
18 Posted 24/08/2019 at 10:18:10
We have played away to 2 clubs who will probably be in the lower reaches of the league for most of the season, yet we could only draw with one and lost to the other. I can't think of to many easier away games than these 2, so we haven't made the most of an easy away start to the season.
I said last season this team doesn't look like scoring a lot of goals, and with practically the same starting line up in our first few games that trend is continuing, 3 games 1 goal.
Their first goal was a poor goal to give away, Wesley made a run in behind Mina and Keane didnt track him, when you are the last defender you must stay with your man. What was even more frustrating is we had totally controlled the game up to that point, without looking like scoring. We huffed and puffed but, apart from Calvert-Lewin's gilt edged chance going begging, didn't worry their goal keeper too much.
I thought Silva might make changes at half time, but he decided to give the starting line up a chance to turn things around, but on the hour his patience ran out and he began to make the changes. I wouldnt argue with his substitutions although maybe a couple who actually stayed on were very lucky to do so.
There is no doubt that Iwobi and Kean made an impact with Iwobi unluckily hitting a post and had another shot deflected that looped into the keepers hands. Kean looked lively and laid on a great chance for Walcott from 6 yards out but he blazed way over the bar.
I can't think to many top 6 sides looking at last nights game will think they have much to fear from us, let's hope that Iwobi and Kean start against Lincoln and Wolves. These boys need game time now not more training sessions.
Not the start we had hoped for and, while we did create chances in the last 15 minutes, I think Marco needs to select a side that has more momentum going forward and carries a greater threat than last night's starting line-up created.
19 Posted 24/08/2019 at 10:26:35
What villa did well, was getting two lines behind the ball when we were in possession and shutting off all the space for forward/through balls down the middle, they allowed us to have the ball in front of them, but we never had the guile to unlock them. Passes were going sideways & backwards, the only real space was out wide, but are delivery was very poor from wide positions, especially from Coleman and Richarlison.
Coleman can never whip an early ball in, always insisting on beating a man first & then delivering a nothing ball. Richarlison looks as if he can't make up his mind what to do with the ball when he gets hold of it and ends up holding onto it for too long and running into someone who takes the ball off him.
Having said all that, we created enough chances to get something from this game, but weren't clinical enough. This isn't the Villa of old, this is a team of second rate players. If we have ambitions of breaking the premier league elite, it is teams like this we should be taking all 3 points from.
Positive for me was Iwobi and Kean coming on definitely livened things up & made us more threatening. They need to be part of the starting 11 in my opinion, definitely good enough.
As for Silva, I don't think he can get away with too many of these results under Moshiri. He has to put things right and get us back on track fast.
20 Posted 24/08/2019 at 10:34:23
We didn't deserve to lose? Seriously? We were beaten by a side who at least managed to get a couple of efforts on target over 90 minutes, and whose players worked harder for their wages than ours did. We got EXACTLY what we deserved.
I'm fed up with listening to Silva's pathetic, inaccurate, feeble interviews. His players' performances are totally reflective of his own absurd efforts both during and after games. How does he expect players to accept responsibility and be embarrassed by performances like last night, when he isn't himself?
He's nowhere near good enough for the job he has and, if Brands & Moshiri can't see that, then we are in trouble.
Yet another long, infuriating season ahead for us Blues.
21 Posted 24/08/2019 at 11:06:42
I'm not saying he was great but, other than Digne, the back five had reasonably good games. It's what lies ahead of that that is clearly the problem.
I just had and still have a bad feeling about Gomes.
22 Posted 24/08/2019 at 11:43:25
So, no guile, no finishing and no leadership on the pitch, nobody who's willing to get in anyone's face. Please God, it's just got to get better!
23 Posted 24/08/2019 at 11:53:03
Coleman, Sigurdsson, Walcott â€” do I need to go on?
I've a daughter seriously ill in hospital at the moment and flicked to the Live Forum for a lift. I'm more depressed than ever about this club. Brands can spot the talent but he's handing them to a dope. Silva couldn't run a bath.
24 Posted 24/08/2019 at 12:05:32
Good managers show some animation in covering every inch of the technical area, demanding, praising and when needed, criticising their players.
Yourself, plus Walter Smith, Moyes, then Martinez, followed by Dubaii Sam, and Koeman, would make a small forest of fossilised trees.
25 Posted 24/08/2019 at 12:10:22
The trouble is, we only hit the target once, so we will not be winning many games while that continues. The whole midfield stunk last night, although at least Bernard was trying to create. The worry for me is that we don't seem to know how to attack â€“ the only threat we have comes from our full-backs.
It's clear that Sigurdsson playing just behind Calvert-Lewin isn't working. It wasn't working well enough for the majority of last season, let alone the 3 games this season. The system will have to be tweaked. I don't think Kean is ready to play up front on his own yet, so I would take him playing off Calvert-Lewin up front. Schneiderlin has no place here also â€“ he just shadows what the other midfielders are doing. Gomes had a bad night last night, but did Schneiderlin take on more responsibility to help his mate out? No, he went missing as usual.
I feel Delph is going to be a key player for us this season, if only to keep Schneiderlin out of the team!
26 Posted 24/08/2019 at 12:26:54
27 Posted 24/08/2019 at 12:27:08
I am wondering if, during these stringent medicals that are conducted ahead of transfers nowadays, whether the psychological health of a player is looked at?
The reason I ask is that Gomes apparently was suffering from depression when he first came to us.
If this was a clinical diagnosis, did it not occur to the management that he might relapse at any time?
Maybe this is the problem he is experiencing now and it would go some way to explaining the up-and-down consistency in his performances.
I'm no expert and am just wondering as I can't think of any other reason that might apply?
28 Posted 24/08/2019 at 12:28:32
29 Posted 24/08/2019 at 12:31:09
Dave Abrahams # 5 â€“ I'm feeling for you. If I lived on Merseyside still, I would take you out for a few pints of ale of your choice.
Marco â€“ we got what we deserved... nothing.
30 Posted 24/08/2019 at 12:44:57
To be honest, we were better when the two new lads came on, but we still had no real midfield to create chances.
If you ever get over here again, I'd love to have a couple of pints with you.
31 Posted 24/08/2019 at 12:50:45
If we are going to play like we do, which seems to be about controlling possession but creating very few chances, then we simply must have someone who is capable of putting the chances away on the rare occasion that they are created. Is Calvert-Lewin that man? On the evidence of this season so far, no. Is Kean that man? I don't know but it is surely time to give him a run of starts to find out.
32 Posted 24/08/2019 at 12:55:22
33 Posted 24/08/2019 at 12:57:36
Calvert-Lewin is a midfield player at League One level. He is a midfield player shoved up front because he has height and pace, but he is not a forward in any position.
34 Posted 24/08/2019 at 12:59:47
So what now from this one-trick pony?
35 Posted 24/08/2019 at 13:01:44
This thread has been a good insight into how we played so many thanks to all.
36 Posted 24/08/2019 at 13:02:14
37 Posted 24/08/2019 at 13:15:37
38 Posted 24/08/2019 at 13:29:15
Easy fixtures so far and poor results. We should have beaten Palace and Villa if we have aims of top 6 let alone top 4. We have less points than this stage last year and the same points as 2 years ago after 3 games and we all know what happened then. We had terrible fixtures that year if I remember.
Enough of this 4-2-3-1 crap. We have seen this negated too many times. The front 4 get cut off from the rest far too easily.
Richarlison and Sigurdsson need dropping as well. 3 games into a new season this speaks volumes of the attitude of these players.
39 Posted 24/08/2019 at 13:31:04
Every team we've played has let us do that because when we cross it, we don't do so with any accuracy, there are no bodies flooding the box. This style completely ignores the Number 10 and as such any player there would find it hard.
We never play into the centre forward or have midfielders breaking beyond the back line as a third man running. We are one dimensional and once the tactics are rebuffed we are blunted.
An amateur can figure it out, we are woeful against poor sides and that has not changed under Silva. For him to defend that performance last night was just an exercise in defiance.
40 Posted 24/08/2019 at 13:47:18
Left the pub in a shit mood now trying to salvage some bank holiday spirit. Such a bad game. Mina played well that's all. Plus the Wesley lad for Villa is a beast.
41 Posted 24/08/2019 at 14:42:13
42 Posted 24/08/2019 at 14:51:17
43 Posted 24/08/2019 at 15:09:36
I don't even think it is a lack of tactical nous. He has shown some tactical flexibility in his career. I think it is arrogance. It's like "this was the best team so if they don't perform it is on them, not me, I am never wrong." Very much in the mold of Mourinho.
Problem is that it's kind of an old school attitude that harkens back to the days when players genuinely feared managers throwing tea cups at them. These days, players have little respect for the managers. Half are happy to just pick up a paycheck, the rest just get on the phone with Raiola and orchestrate a move.
44 Posted 24/08/2019 at 15:11:49
Glaring issues in random order:
Right wing. Exciting 㿞M record signing played out of position. Richarlison's skillset is completely negated from the right. He is only playing there because Walcott is so useless. Play him in his best position on the left cutting in.
Striker: Calvert-Lewin, just no more please, it's embarrassing. Not good enough and never will be.
Midfield: a lot of players signed yet we still have Szzchneiderlin starting games. Gomes also seems to have dramatically lost form. The two of them were dire and far too slow at Villa. Delph and Gbamin can't get fit quick enough. Watching Gomes's and Scneiderlin's crablike build-up while we were 1-0 down was excruciating.
45 Posted 24/08/2019 at 15:13:31
I wouldn't be surprised to see Gordon before too long. He has been training with the first team, couple of goals for U23s this week.
46 Posted 24/08/2019 at 15:30:15
Same old same old Everton, never have 1 or 2 playing bad it becomes contagious disease and most play bad. When are we going to have a captain with some balls?
No pride, no commitment, and a manager who changes players on the “standardâ€ 60-minute mark. Talk about original, inspirational, I don't think so.
As has been said, if Sigurdsson doesn't score, he's invisible. Calvert-Lewin couldn't score in a brothel and he's loaded.
An abject utterly boring and spineless display.
47 Posted 24/08/2019 at 15:33:44
Bernard (No 10)
Front line needs a shake up, and fast!!!
48 Posted 24/08/2019 at 15:48:44
We had more shots, corners, chances etc but again lacked the finishing touch. For the first 20 minutes and last 30 minutes we looked the better team.
Obviously none of that really matters compared to zero points but I don't think anything Silva says is totally without reason. We played better than Fulham away last season but need to start putting chances away.
49 Posted 24/08/2019 at 15:52:42
There is nothing to suggest this will change, and plenty of evidence it won't. Schneiderlin, Sigurdsson and Bernard are not going to improve, no matter how often they play. Gomes is unreliable. Playing Calvert-Lewin is an insult at this stage. Richarlison does nothing useful and increasingly looks a mistake. Gbamin and Delph are out of action. Why did we sign Delph with his injury record? He won't last a couple of games.
It's all down to Kean and Iwobi to offer some hope. It's going to be a long, painful season sliding to a bottom half finish. The Brands and Silva era has hit the skids.
50 Posted 24/08/2019 at 17:50:58
51 Posted 24/08/2019 at 18:15:01
Stand by for a phenomenal moment...
52 Posted 24/08/2019 at 18:21:52
53 Posted 24/08/2019 at 18:32:12
Never worry about the football, I hope your daughter gets well soon.
I don't agree with Silva, the team didn't get anything because they were not good enough to beat a very ordinary side. It's only the third game, but the teams we have played are quite ordinary.
It's not to bad luck we have failed to achieve what I believe was reasonable- 9 pts, it's down to the fucking management and players. The last 3 games are showing how much Gana brought to the team.
54 Posted 24/08/2019 at 18:58:57
Everton have to hit the ground running from the get go, because we all know the overall quality is not there to sustain it! Fuck a duck, can we get some staff who actually take this club seriously!!
Here is an idea for you next time, sweetheart: get all the players you have available from July 1st, get them fit, and actually coach them and use them from the start until your 'tired' ones and new transfers are ready to start. Sounds like Martinez Mk 2 to me.
55 Posted 24/08/2019 at 19:06:04
56 Posted 24/08/2019 at 20:48:57
Still we have 4 points. Three games in. Panic, no. Are we top-four potential? No. Top six? Yes. It's too early to press the alarm button.
57 Posted 24/08/2019 at 21:04:14
58 Posted 24/08/2019 at 21:53:35
The margins of success are very slim now. Silva must take the cup competitions seriously.
59 Posted 24/08/2019 at 22:31:17
“Our identity is our intensity.â€
“I saw a brilliant game from my team at this early in the season. It was outstanding. A performance full of power, full of energy and full of passion. That's what you need against such a good team.â€
60 Posted 25/08/2019 at 00:45:35
But you're right â€“ it's still crap!
61 Posted 24/08/2019 at 00:48:17
Friday's match against Villa would have been three pencilled in points at the start of the season. They got zero, so now they have to find three points in another fixture to keep on track with their goal, or change their goal. In other words, Friday's match was a waste of time.
62 Posted 25/08/2019 at 02:15:24
I remember bemoaning the fact of the rs Intensity...and our lack, in 2013, so it isn't just a thing Klopp invented.
Everybody is more or less affected by the same summer player commitments.
The rs reported back for training on 6th July, we reported back on the 1st July...who seems fitter??
Possible conclusion - our training methods and trainers are shite. All the players we signed must have started their own pre-season around the same time.
Another possible conclusion - all our players are lazy bastards.
Possible joint conclusion - The Training Staff and their methods are rubbish and the players don't give a shit...well thats how it seems.
By the time the injured and generally unfit get fit and back up to speed, It'll be fucking Christmas and the season could be long gone. 50pts...(if we're lucky) beckons and one day there won't be 3 or more teams worse than us.
Now I'm sure many will give me chapter and verse...burnout etc. on how I'm too harsh and vastly mistaken. But honestly, I'm sick of excuses, other teams can motivate themselves. Other teams can get fit. Why not us.
63 Posted 25/08/2019 at 07:44:16
64 Posted 25/08/2019 at 10:13:13
One goal scored in three games continues the issues from last season. Not sure why Kean still isn't starting.
4 points from 3 games isn't a crisis but worrying we haven't played any of the top teams.
65 Posted 25/08/2019 at 10:16:50
66 Posted 25/08/2019 at 10:30:49
How many times have we been here?
This is "us" to a tee, I've become so apathetic toward this club and trust me apathy is not something I usually do.
Bottom line is that when it matters to us the fans, the players do not respond. It would have been lovely to be top, if only for a few hours but heyho lads along come Everton... You know the rest.
67 Posted 25/08/2019 at 10:34:01
68 Posted 25/08/2019 at 11:23:14
It's no good mentioning the shite on here. They are an international brand. We aren't. No doubt in a couple of years given the vision of the club, we might see blue shirts in the Amazon instead of ones with Crown paint on.
69 Posted 25/08/2019 at 12:22:12
I don't know why we hear a foreign name of a manager and gravitate to them. If Silva can't get something out of these overpaid drama queens that we call players, then someone else will have to. It's not all Silva's fault. We need players who want to fight for the shirt, not just play for it.
70 Posted 25/08/2019 at 13:11:11
71 Posted 25/08/2019 at 13:45:39
One breakaway and they score, the games changes completely, 2-0 flattered as we were chasing.
We will come good we have too much talent not too, it's just early season hiccup, relax and keep calm as they say.
72 Posted 25/08/2019 at 14:19:20
73 Posted 25/08/2019 at 14:53:32
What about pushing Gomes further up the pitch in Sigurdsson's place? He's a bit too dangerous for us playing deep and he can pick a pass.
74 Posted 25/08/2019 at 15:01:12
75 Posted 25/08/2019 at 15:04:24
79 Posted 25/08/2019 at 15:07:56
80 Posted 25/08/2019 at 15:10:34
81 Posted 25/08/2019 at 15:42:26
Good job he didn't play for us.
82 Posted 25/08/2019 at 15:52:15
83 Posted 25/08/2019 at 16:38:45
84 Posted 25/08/2019 at 16:49:36
86 Posted 25/08/2019 at 17:39:35
87 Posted 25/08/2019 at 18:16:52
The reality is without their goals we become a bottom half of the table club, unless Kean and Iwobi can make up the short fall. Sometimes I think the discontent gets through to the players and they lose confidence, that maybe a contributory factor anyway, neither player look like they have a goal in them at the moment.
88 Posted 25/08/2019 at 18:50:24
Similar arguments to yours were put forward in the past with respect to Lukaku's goals, and were similarly invalid.
89 Posted 25/08/2019 at 18:54:03
90 Posted 25/08/2019 at 19:12:29
91 Posted 25/08/2019 at 19:24:21
92 Posted 25/08/2019 at 19:34:16
Three games, one goal, and very few chances created. All matches against teams we should expect to be beating given the money we've spent.
We don't want to hear how unlucky you thought we were Mr Silva. We need to hear what you plan to do to put things right because, bar a half-decent run at the back end of last season, you've shown nothing to suggest you've got anything to offer Everton Football Club.
93 Posted 25/08/2019 at 19:46:20
94 Posted 25/08/2019 at 22:11:38
95 Posted 26/08/2019 at 01:34:37
In a Nutshell Mate!! Absolutely agree with every word you saiod I was cringing to be honest at some of the Play it was pathetic.
Had we beaten Villa we would be 3rd and only 2 point behind you know who!!
I cannot remember the last time Everton took any chance to do anything let alone go Top of the Table!!!
Let's buy Iwobi and Kean and only play them if we're losing, because we put inferior players on to start the match!!
I've said it before and I will say it again to the delight of some people and the despair of others Silva is clueless!! FACT.
98 Posted 26/08/2019 at 07:20:52
99 Posted 26/08/2019 at 08:12:40
Our players, when shooting, lean back and stab almost like they want to shoot but at the same time avoid all contact. Walcott's was a miss classic example: shin-high volley, he tries to side foot it and avoided any contact. If he had really wanted it, he would have met it with his momentum going forward, giving it the full laces and head over ball and probably would have been hit by a defender on his follow-through.
100 Posted 26/08/2019 at 17:49:50
Once things were lost last season, we regained composure; we are heading in the same way again. Where is the evidence of a successful pre-season with players not fit enough and playing like amateurs?
101 Posted 26/08/2019 at 18:09:06
102 Posted 26/08/2019 at 18:54:40
Anytime there's anything to play for, we fail to deliver.
Yes, we went on a great run towards the end of the season when it didn't matter a jot.
103 Posted 26/08/2019 at 21:02:59
104 Posted 27/08/2019 at 01:35:37
Play Iwobi from the start!! Simple! Drop Coleman!! Never been the same player since the leg break! Fact, not fiction.
There are three basic and very simple adjustments that will improve Everton!! Am I wrong???
What is going on?? We were humiliated by Aston Villa they are shite!
105 Posted 27/08/2019 at 13:04:03
To me it's still slow and predictable and fucking boring to listen to never mind watch... club going nowhere.
Add Your Comments
In order to post a comment, you need to be logged in as a registered user of the site.
Or Sign up as a ToffeeWeb Member — it's free, takes just a few minutes and will allow you to post your comments on articles and Talking Points submissions across the site.