10-man Blues steal the points in late drama

By Michael Kenrick 01/02/2020 278comments  |  Jump to last

Richarlison had a poor game until the end, breaking at pace to set up the winning goal for Theo Walcott
Watford 2 - 3 Everton

Everton returned to action in faltering style with a trip to Watford only to go behind by 2 goals before Yerry Mina scored a brace off corners minutes before the break. With Delph shown a second yellow card, 10-man Everton held out until stoppage time when Richarlison broke forward and Walcott finished in unrecognizable style to win a hotly contested game.

Carlo Ancelotti was buoyed by the return to fitness of Richarlison, Sigurdsson and Iwobi who all started at Vicarage Road. Moise Kean, Bernard and Morgan Schneiderlin, who played in Everton's draw with Newcastle United 11 days ago, were dropped to the subs bench with Coleman, Baines, Keane and Stekelenburg.

Watford kicked off and Denny came closest with a header, drifting wide. Watford then went ahead after good work by Deulofeu feeding Masina who scored with ease, Everton torn apart far too easily down their right side and Pickford beaten far too easily.

Everton were very poor in response, unable to put together anything approaching joined-up football, the game becoming very scrappy. Richarlison tried but failed to get past Chalobah, who barged him over. A better ball in from Sidibe was headed in that annoyingly neutral fashion by Calvert-Lewin, taking all the pace out of it for an easy catch by Foster.

Sidibe gave up a poor free-kick that was kicked straight out by Watford. Everton worked it out well from the back until Delph passed it straight to a defender as the shockingly inadequate football continued from the players in Blue.

With a quarter of the game gone, the Everton players started to control the play a little more without producing any end product, the final ball sailing over Calvert-Lewin. If anything, Everton we're now overplaying it, not shooting as the opportunities arose.

A high kick by Sigurdsson was too close to Deeny, and Watford twice came close to adding to their score from the ensuing free-kicks. Walcott put a decent cross in for Iwobi but Sigurdsson took it off his toe and played it backwards.

Digne went in with his studs showing, but it was never a red card, despite the unwarranted interrogative from VAR. Richarlison mishit a forward ball and got annoyed with himself, as he was struggling to get into the game. Another ridiculous red-card check by VAR was called on Digne's clearance where he inadvertently followed through onto a Watford player.

Amdist a sequence of poor defending in midfield, Delph shockingly gave the ball to Deeny and Pereyra skipped through to finish with consummate ease past a bewildered Jordan Pickford to put Watford firmly in control. Shameful stuff.

But from a corner, Yerry Mina scrambled the ball in after it appeared to hit him on the arm/shoulder before Holgate got a vital touch to play it back in his direction amidst the falling bodies... however, it was ultimately vindicated by VAR and Everton were hopefully back in the contest.

Another corner for Everton, this time from the other side, and a nice clean header from Yerry Mina at the far post off Sigurdsson's cross incredibly made it 2-2 on the stroke of half-time.

Everton resumed, with Deulofeu fouling and a fantastic ball in from Sigurdsson causing panic, hitting Calvert-Lewin on the head and deflecting just over the bar for a corner, with Mina threatening again. Good running from Walcott and a fine ball almost found Calvert-Lewin, for another Everton corner.

Holgate needed to defend strongly as Delph ran into trouble. The Blues attacked with gusto but the ball wouldn't run for them. Walcott had a great chance to play in Calvert-Lewin but overplayed it poorly. Mina and Deeny clashed as Chalobah was replaced by Welbeck.

Delph felt obligated to foul Pereyra, earning the first yellow card of the game as Watford got a chance to apply pressure, winning a corner that was cleared.

Everton built a decent attack, the ball screwing the wrong side of Calvert-Lewin's Head. At the other end, Deulofeu got a chance to run in on goal but it was defended well as Iwobi made way for Kean. Then Sigurdsson made way for Schneiderlin, with Ancelotti still concerned about Everton's vulnerability as two fouls on Delph, Sidibe then Richardson finally earned The Blues a free-kick, powered into the wall by Digne.

Delph then tackled Capoue near the touchline, catching his toe, and the Watford players and fans smelt blood, screaming for a ridiculous second yellow, duly granted by Pawson. Ancelotti then looked to shut up shop at 2-2 with Keane replacing Calvert-Lewin.

However, Everton continued to attack, spoilt only by that man Walcott, who again played an awful ball at a crucial point to terminate the attack prematurely.

With 10 minutes left, Pussetto replaced Deulofeu as Doucoure lashed a shot well wide from a corner. Yerry Mina then tussled with Success and stupidly picked the ball up, expecting the foul to have been called. It was... but on the Colombian for deliberate handball – utter madness!

Everton were then under self-imposed pressure, Holgate booked for a foul as Doucoure came close and the 10 men of Everton rocked back on their heels.

But Everton suddenly broke at pace, Richarlison breaking at pace, Kean missing his shot but Walcott, coming in wide right, slotted home from a narrow angle to finally earn his crust.

In a seething atmosphere, with the incredibly faithful travelling Blues in fine voice, 10-man Everton showed much better game management to play out the final minutes and take all three points back to Merseyside.

Scorers: Masina (10'), Pereyra (42'); Mina (45+1', 45+4'), Walcott (90')

Watford: Foster, Mariappa, Kabasele, Cathcart, Masina, Capoue, Chalobah (57' Welbeck), Pereyra (75' Success [Y:78']), Deulofeu (82' Pussetto), Doucoure, Deeley.
Subs not Used: Gomes, Holebas, Hughes, Gray.

Everton: Pickford, Sidibe, Mina, Holgate [Y:83], Digne, Walcott, Sigurdsson (67' Sigurdsson), Delph [Y:58'; YR:72'], Iwobi (65' Kean), Richarlison, Calvert-Lewin (73' Keane).
Subs not Used: Stekelenburg, Baines, Coleman, Bernard.

Referee: Craig Pawson
VAR: Jon Moss


Reader Comments (278)

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Derek Taylor
1 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:06:22
All the managers love Sigurdsson. Is that because he's Moshiri's pet player?
Alan J Thompson
2 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:13:01
Sorry, Iwobi starts and Bernard on the bench? Wither Davies?
Derek Knox
3 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:14:40
Surprised that Kean has been dropped to the bench, especially after getting his first goal and breaking his duck, however I trust Ancelotti.

Need the three points here to keep ground with the many teams around us on 30 points, still feel two points thrown away last week, but water under the bridge now, and hopefully lessons learnt by those who contributed to it.

Jerome Shields
4 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:22:23
Agree Dereck, they don't Moshiri to feel that he is a complete and utter idiot football wise. It's the Tony Cottee symdrome.
Tony Hill
5 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:23:04
Funny old team. Here's hoping.
Tom Bowers
6 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:25:06
Carlo still expecting big things from Walcott ???
Christy Ring
7 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:28:47
I cannot understand why Sigurdsson is captain, isn't a captain supposed to show leadership?
Kieran Kinsella
8 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:31:45

I don't understand this whole "captains" thing. I know Barca do it but I was always warned about "too many chiefs and not enough Indians." How can you have a group of 11 players and half of them are "captains." Is there some kind of ranking within the group of captains or is it a meaningless title to flatter egos like corporations that have hundreds of "vice presidents" in mid to lower levels?

Kieran Kinsella
9 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:34:22
I don't have any particular animosity to Watford but there's quite a bit of history between the clubs. The Steve Sherwood/Andy Gray "foul," today ironically their subs list reads "Gray, Success."Z-Cars, the Marco Silva tap up, presently we have Rich, they've got Del and Cleverly, and thankfully they've got Andre Gray who the great Steve Walsh wanted for Everton.
Tony Everan
10 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:36:15
Mason Holgate more of a captain personality than Siggy. Maybe a bit young and inexperienced yet but he will be captain at some point.
Jay Wood

11 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:39:23
Quite sweeping changes. And Tom Davies nowhere to be seen.

It looks like Carlo is gambling on out-footballing them because that midfield won't out-muscle them.

Bill Gienapp
12 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:43:44
Re: captains, Silva established the following pecking order in the pre-season --

1. Coleman
2. Baines
3. Sigurdsson
4. Digne

Whoever the highest ranking player on the pitch is gets the armband. With neither Coleman nor Baines starting, that means Sigurdsson. Ancelotti clearly had no interest in changing things upon arrival.

Jay Harris
13 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:46:40
It doesnt matter who we play in MF we havent got anyone capable of outmuscling Watford except maybe Holgate if he was in there.

IMO MF has been our problem for years.

Drew O'Neall
14 Posted 01/02/2020 at 14:48:18

I wonder if that’s a 4-5-1. Terry Venables used to say ‘if you can’t beat them in midfield, you have to outnumber them’. I suspect that’s what he’s doing.

Other observations:

He likes Walcott.

He likes Sigurdsson.

He doesn’t like Davies.

To my mind, Davies is the only one of our currently available midfielders for whom the jury is still out, the rest definitely don’t have a long term future at Everton for one reason or another. Very strange.

Alan J Thompson
15 Posted 01/02/2020 at 15:29:19
Adelphi, Is he the bloke in all white?
Christy Ring
16 Posted 01/02/2020 at 15:32:38
Midfield totally out muscled, Capoue winning all the 50/50 duels, nothing surprising there, still cannot understand why Ancelotti didn't bring in a defensive midfielder.
Darren Murphy
18 Posted 01/02/2020 at 15:45:03
2-0 already and that idiot had time to bring people in, ?Wtf
Tony Abrahams
20 Posted 01/02/2020 at 15:45:36
Christy Ring
21 Posted 01/02/2020 at 15:48:52
Shocking from Delph, passing backwards as usual, a shocking first half.
Justin Harris
22 Posted 01/02/2020 at 15:49:04
Delph has been awful!!How you can play him and siggy together is beyond me!!So so lucky to be back in this game!
Christy Ring
23 Posted 01/02/2020 at 15:51:19
Maybe I was a bit premature, a bit like the Nwe castle comeback.
Jay Wood

24 Posted 01/02/2020 at 16:01:18
Ehrm...Newcastle, anybody?

Just goes to show. It can happen to anybody, at any time.

Two very contrasting teams. Watford combative and pressing when we are on the ball, and getting everybody behind the ball when we are in possession, waiting for us to cough up the ball to launch their counters.

We're looking to pass it through them. OK at times, but only to the edge of the area where it all broke down.

Watford's tactics looked to be working for them up to 42 minutes. Their first goal was very good. A great crossfield pass, superbly picked out of the air by Deulofeo. He doesn't do that, there is no goal.

Sidibe and Walcott needed to then be stronger against him, but weren't, and once he plays in Masina it was game over.

There is nothing you can say in defence of Delph for their second. He totally exposes the defence with a dreadful missed pass. Nobody else is culpable in that.

Then...whadya know? Two good corners. Good battling for the first. A clean as you like header for the second.

The two Mina goals completely changes the teams' respective half-time chats. It SHOULD deflate Watford and fill our sails.

Let's see what unfolds.

Bill Gienapp
25 Posted 01/02/2020 at 16:02:35
Lol - within the span of about three minutes, Mina goes from zero goals to being tied for our third-leading scorer this season.
Christy Ring
26 Posted 01/02/2020 at 16:35:28
Why didnt Ancelotti take Delph off, a ridiculous tackle, and he already on a yellow. I wouldn't have even started him. Backs to the wall now.
Darren Murphy
27 Posted 01/02/2020 at 16:51:54
Man Utd to bid £900 million for goal scorer Walcott.
Steve Ferns
28 Posted 01/02/2020 at 16:58:14
Dunno if we really deserved it. But I’ll take it! Finally the hoodoo is broken. Enjoy tonight blues.
Ken Kneale
29 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:00:09
I am sure we did not on play alone Steve, but good to see a bit more character gets a reward. I'll take it like you.
Steve Ferns
30 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:00:37
The fans deserve it Ken!
Simon Smith
31 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:01:56
That ALMOST makes up for the last game. Onwards and upwards!
Brian Wilkinson
32 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:04:52
It’s great reading reactions before a ball has been kicked and going a goal or two down.

I resisted temptation to post, before the game had ended, bet a few posters wish they had done the same.

Makes up for the Newcastle farce and a well earned 3 points.

Will do for me.

Jakub Kollar
33 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:04:54
Wow, we won an away match!
After the match against Newcastle and now at Watford I swear I will never stop hoping till the last second.
Kieran Kinsella
34 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:05:16
We deserved it. We fought back, took our chances. Job done.
Ken Kneale
35 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:05:49
I agree Steve - best in the league
Jay Wood

36 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:05:51
Well, that's nice to get THAT monkey off our back.

Anybody recall the last league game we won after conceding not just the first goal, but from going two down?

AND away from home.

Delph's foul for his 2nd yellow was stupid, but did it really merit a card AND expulsion given some of the tackles the ref let go in the game with no card?

Carlo clearly bunkered down to secure the minimum of a draw rather than a loss. Given what happened last time out v Newcastle it was doubly sweet to end both halves with the goals we did.

XI v XI I thought we looked good for a win in that 2nd half, but to snatch it playing with 10 men for the last 25 minutes of the game was sweet-sweet-sweet.

Great turnover by Digne deep in our own half. Great running and lay-off for Kean. Great support from both Kean and Walcott to be up there. Kean, scuffed shot or intended pass, who cares?

Walcott HAD to finish that or he would have been crucified. How many bad balls did he overhit or misplace in extremely promising positions?

The table continues to look better and better.

Andrew Hight
37 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:07:41
To win a game from 2-0 down away from home with ten men is the most un-Everton thing I’ve ever heard.
Jay Wood

38 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:09:58
To answer my own question, was the 3-2 away win at WBA in the early part of the 2015-16 season the last time we came back from 2-0 down to win?

It's been at least a couple of seasons since winning after conceding the first goal as we never achieved it on Silva's watch.

Tony Hill
39 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:10:23
Delighted. That does make up for Newcastle pretty much. Holgate should surely be selected for England. Richarlison did excellently for the winner and that was a good finish from Walcott. Well done Big Yerry, he showed guts to drag us back in to it.

It's about developing momentum, the scruffiness of the game doesn't matter. Fantastic, we can all enjoy the weekend.

Michael Lynch
40 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:10:54
I think the whole match should now be subject to VAR. Surely Everton can't possibly win a game from 2-0 down with a last minute smash and grab?

Funny old league this season. By my standards, we've been mediocre at very best, but then we're still in the mix for Europa League football. And the Shite - a very good team, but nothing remarkable compared to recent champions really - are 22 points clear.

Peter Neilson
41 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:16:43
Jay might have been West Brom. What a result. Good to see Holgate not just playing well but also ordering other players.
Brian Williams
42 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:16:57
Not feeling well today so had a kip. Dreamed we came back from two nil down to win three.......... wait, Oh FFS!
Ciarán McGlone
43 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:17:47
I'll buy that for a dollar..

Still baffled by some of the starters and the subs.. but who cares, some luck went our way for a change.

James Byrne
44 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:20:17
Ironically the worst player on the pitch scores the winner.

How Walcott get's paid to play football is beyond me.

Dave Williams
45 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:21:36
We are not going to suddenly play wonderful football overnight but Carlo has them trying harder, and looking more like a team. Winning scruffy is how most good teams start and and I will take that all day. The better stuff will follow in time and once Carlo adds a couple of class midfielders to the team.
Well done boys and shame on the live forum posters who seem to delight in chucking vile abuse at their own players- mindless!
Jay Harris
46 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:23:24
What a contrast Holgate leading by example and Delph berating other players while being totally shit.

Thought Pawson seemed determined to ruin our day. What is it with referees and us. When was the last time a RS player got booked for any of the tackles we put in today.

Any way great win hopefully our luck is turning now the belief is returning.

Jay Wood

47 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:25:48
Peter @ 41. Mason is really blossoming.

He has always had a swagger and a gob on him!

On one of those filler video things the club does now and then with a player answering fans' questions, recently Dominic was answering. One question was:

'Which player should go on Love Island?'

Dominic didn't hesitate. 'Mason Holgate. 100%. No question!'

That perhaps tells you Mason sees himself as a bit of a 'cock-of-the-north' (in the nicest possible sense).

He is one of the few real narks we have in the team. An England call-up must seriously be on the cards for not only the way he defends, but also how he carries it out of defence and passes through lines.

Does it always come off? No. But the frequency of when it does is certainly increasing.

A real gem of a player.

Kieran Kinsella
48 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:26:00
A truly unEvertonian act of sabotage on someone else
Bill Gienapp
49 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:26:04
Jay (38) - it was the Unsworth match (also against Watford), when we went down 2-0 in the second half (Richarlison scoring their first, ironically), then Niasse scored perhaps his dopiest goal ever for us, Calvert-Lewin equalized, then Baines converted a penalty in the 90th minute (followed by Tom Cleverly missing a corresponding penalty at the death).
Colin Glassar
50 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:27:48
Walcott can now leave in the summer with his head held high(ish).
Ajay Gopal
51 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:28:50
I object to the headline, Michael (or Lyndon)! That was a hard fought victory, but well deserved. We created the better chances in the 2nd half. And that was NEVER, NEVER a Red card on Delph. Even the 1st yellow is debatable - he got the ball in a 50-50, but the follow-through caught the Watford guy's foot. In both cases, it was very poor sportsmanship by Watford to get Delph sent off. All credit to the blues. Standout performers for me: Mina, Holgate, Digne, Sidibe, Siggy, Richy. The others were okay - did not do too well, not were they bad. Fantastic entertainment and goes a long way in erasing the memories of Newcastle. just shows what an incredibly competitive league this is, except, when it comes to the RS, apparently!
Pat Kelly
52 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:29:22
So we got no one in through the window. But Walcott ! It's like a new signing. Unfortunately for us.
Bill Fairfield
53 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:32:31
Few premature posts on here,it's never over till it's over well done lads,Delph yellows a joke
Derek Knox
54 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:34:26
Made up with the unexpected result, especially after we went down to ten men, didn't think it was worthy of a red or a yellow before that. However it seemed to galvanise us, and with an astute couple of subs it paid off.
Dermot O'Brien
55 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:35:16
In all the euphoria of such a win everyone has forgotten Kean's assist. What a pass!
I would love if he had scored but in the end at least someone did. What a comeback. It's great to be on the winning side of a comeback story.
Jay Wood

56 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:35:32
Good one Bill @ 49. Well remembered.

That must count as the last league game we came back to win after conceding the first goal, too.

We certainly didn't do it under Silva and I can't recall doing it under Allardyce. That was the late autumn of the 2017-18 season, nearly two and a half seasons ago.

Bill Gall
57 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:37:13
What is it 1 loss from the last ten games, sometimes it is not very pretty but compared to the start of the season to Ancelotti's hiring, it shows we must have improved. We throw away games ugly, so winning ugly is ok for me. The players are slowly getting comfortable with the new managers tactics. Happy we never signed anyone this January it shows the players are going to have to perform if they want to be at the club next season.
Jim Bennings
58 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:37:28
Well I didn’t see that coming after an initial woeful first half showing.

I applaud the character to bounce back there today away from home and with ten men, the in-game management I so often talk about was impressive and I think the players maybe just maybe showed today that Ancelotti is having the impact?

A great great win, it’s been a right tough fixture for this team in recent years so to win from two down, great credit.

Let’s build some momentum next week and really put the pressure on though.

Steve Shave
59 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:37:38
Mason Holgate...I needn't say anymore.
Derek Taylor
60 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:40:25
A vision came to me of Pickford scoring the winning goal direct from a clearance in the 90+6th minute of the forthcoming derby.

Off to the bookies in the morning !

Bill Gienapp
61 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:41:42
Jay (56) - I *think*... if I'm not mistaken... that under Allardyce, Swansea City scored first at Goodison and we went on to win comfortably, 3-1. If so, I'm pretty sure that was our last come-from-behind win, because we all know it never happened under Silva.
Jay Tee
62 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:43:01
Can't believe it won away, came back from a losing position, Walcott scored the winner and 3 points off 5th.
Michael Lynch
63 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:43:32
Well, according to the match report on the OS, that was a pass from Kean to Theo for the winner rather than a scuffed shot! Hmmm... okay I’ll buy it
Peter Warren
64 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:44:40
Fab fab win. We were good second half, I don’t remember Watford even having a half a chance. I don’t even think Delph’s second yellow was even a foul yet alone a foul resulting in a red card. Terrible referee and linesmen throughout.

Great subs today / credit were it’s due as I have been very critical of Ancelotti’s subs against Brighton and Newcastle. Kean ran and ran, Keane won everything when he came in and even Schnedierlin was competent. We looked a real threat even with ten men.

Made up, still points, money and most importantly Europe to play for. By way of side note, don’t understand any Evertonian not being desperate for us to get into Europa League, I would be made up.

Tony Abrahams
65 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:44:51
Brian@32 I called Everton a team of shithouses because I hate watching
5 passes go backwards 4 go sideways and then every now and again we hit a forward pass. Mina was getting bullied but at least he became a presence in the Watford box, but our midfield was absolutely non-existent.

The saving grace was Delph getting sent off because it kept the second biggest coward out on the pitch, with only Iwobi looking more interested in staying out of trouble than Walcott?

I’m delighted for the travelling blue army and I’m delighted for Holgate, Digne, Richarlison because these three have got a bit of fight, and I’m delighted with the tactical response once Delph went, because although it might have seemed straightforward, it was definitely more of a managers decision rather than that of a coach?

Also well done to Michael Keane because he played on the front foot and looked like he wanted to defend and well done to Moise Kean for that terrific little assist at the end!

George Cumiskey
66 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:44:59
Funny old game the worst player on the pitch scores the winner ! Anyway apart from that I thought Sidibe and Holgate were joint mom, and Michael Keane was was great when he came on, also Kean played pretty well.
Tony Twist
67 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:47:45
Get in! That's the way to do it. Playing poorly and scrambling all three points! Well played blues.
Kim Vivian
68 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:48:31
I like to see it that way as well, Michael. Has he been credited with the assist?
Michael Barrett
69 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:50:59
Derick 60..how did you get your arms free from the straight jacket
Drew O'Neall
70 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:52:08
What a day to go for a Jamie Oliver Cookery Experience
Jay Wood

71 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:53:29
Bill @ 61. You're on a hot streak!

Just checked. Swansea did score first in that one before we came back to win 3-1. December 18, 2017 - more than two years ago then.

Moise Kean: shot or pass?

Many an angle it appears like an intended pass, but one from behind the goal appears it was scuffed. Hard to say whether it was a scuffed shot or a scuffed pass.

The end result is all that matters, anyway!

Pity we lost Delph shortly after Moise came on. He showed glimpses that with a full XI he could have posed them some problems.

Good strong hold-up play in their corner at the death. Also liked how he threw the ball for our throw-in into the stands to eat up a bit more time! That's what savvy professionals do.

Bill Gienapp
72 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:55:01
It would be extremely churlish to criticize that performance. Did we play great? Not particularly. But for the past two years, people have been screaming for this squad to show some mental fortitude, and that's exactly what we got today. To come back from 2-0 down, on the road, and go on to win it with 10-men (against a Watford side whose current form is far better than their league position would suggest) is really impressive.

Holgate was absolutely outstanding. Arguably our best centreback AND defensive midfielder at the moment. It's also worth noting that Watford, in spite of looking dangerous at times, barely had a chance of note after their second goal.

Jay Wood

73 Posted 01/02/2020 at 17:57:01
No bluster from Carlo. His post-match comments are very honest.

"Football is so unpredictable. We were looking to go home with a draw because we had 10 men but we did a fantastic counter-attack.

"Honestly, we didn't deserve to equalise in the first half but I think with what happened last week and this week we deserved to win.

"The spirit is really good. We had fantastic support from our fans. We are really happy for them because to win these away games is really good for our confidence."

On Fabian Delph's red card: "I think it was the wrong decision by the referee. I think we were lucky to score at the end. We have to stay focused, improve and be confident because this squad has good quality."

Christine Foster
74 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:00:44
I'll look forward to watching tonight on Match of the Day, as all I could do was listen to Everton FC radio whilst flat on m back recovering from an op a couple of weeks back..

Funny thing was despite what sounded like an awful first half, with messers Delph, Walcot, Richarlison coping the displeasure of the commentators repeatedly, I felt we would win it. As often is the way sometimes, its the players who frankly were poor that ended up winning the game.

Pleased for the team, still a long way short of being good, but we all have to start somewhere! COYB

Steve Shave
75 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:12:39
I don't want to get carried away but let's look at the situation, we are picking up points whilst not playing particularly well (apart from the first 92 mins vs Newcastle). We have a first rate manager who seems to be gelling well with the players and big Dunc. Gomes is coming back, in the summer we will hit 2-3 targets and lose some of the dross. I've been wrong many times about our beloved team but I feel we are turning a tide. In many ways our restraint in this transfer window just gone show's to me some actual thinking of the bigger picture, not defaulting to instant gratification which has invariably bitten us on the arse to date under Mosh's tenure. COYB.
Ajay Gopal
76 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:15:10
I thought Delph had a very good game (watch the game again if you don't believe me), his sending off was a joke. He WAS at fault for their 2nd goal, but otherwise he did some fantastic running, one particularly standout moment before we scored our 1st was a mazy box-to-box run, which unfortunately did not have a great end product. I think Delph has been let down by not having other good footballers around him. Hopefully, Gomes will replace Iwobi when he gets fit, and we will get an upgrade on Walcott in the summer. Ideally, our midfield 4 should be: Bernard, Delph, Gomes, Siggy, with the players we have presently.
Robert Tressell
77 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:15:47
Kean definitely made a clever pass to walcott - not a scuffed shot. Just moves the ball on having drawn defender and keeper.
George Cumiskey
78 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:18:12
Two good things to come out of todays match.
1. 3 points.
2. Delf getting sent off which will result in a ban.
George Cumiskey
79 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:23:35
Ajay stop drinking and put the weed away !
Peter Mills
80 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:23:42
Our final pass was dreadful almost all day, some really embarrassing football.

But it is about time we started scoring scratty goals, I will take all 3 of ours any time.

Yellow card or not, Delph’s tackle to give away a free kick was yet another brainless moment by him. He’s being shown up, not having great players alongside him.

But overall, congratulations to the 10-men, showing great resilience to get the 3 points. Absolutely made up for those who travelled.

Simon Smith
81 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:32:12
Currently 3rd in the form table behind City and Scum.
3 wins 2 draws and a loss in our last 6, not bad considering some of the dross that has played in those games.
The media bang on about how brilliant wolves are, but we’re only 2 points behind (as it stands at 0-0 with Manure) and we’re having a terrible season!
Mike Powell
82 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:33:33
About time we done that to someone else, instead off it happening to us take that all day. we need to brush up on our passing some of it is dreadful, only real bad point is Delph he is a liability sooner Gomes is back the better,at least he misses the next game 👍COYB
Allan Board
83 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:36:50
Any away win is good, so well done blues! I look at it this way, the player's Ancelloti has for now are probably not the ones, wjth some exceptions, to get us in the top 6. He will know this, but also knows that they are good enough to be in the top half or so.
The fella is not a mug and will change a lot of players when the time is right and with the right player's he chooses.
I told my lad today that it will take time, and we need to be patient and trust the manager will get it right - which he will. We already look and are difficult to beat after looking defeated before a ball was kicked just 10 weeks ago. Have a look through the results since Silva was sacked and the improvements are there to see.
It's not perfect, but give Ancelloti 12 months and we will all be smiling and fear hardly any teams in this league.
Positivity and patience, we have a proper coaching team now.
Kim Vivian
84 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:41:32
As I said on the forum, Delph was unfortunate to get sent off, but fortunately he was.

Spend the afternoon cussing Walcott and then he pops up to slot away a beaut of a winner.

Still ruing the 2 points dropped against Newcastle which would have put us 5th briefly today.

Enjoying being an Evertonian, and enjoying the evening now with a bottle of Bordeaux.

Funny ol' game isn't it.

Jim Bennings
85 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:53:08
Why were Delph’s yellow cards not checked over by VAR?

He won the ball TWICE!

Again another clear example that this is used against rather than for Everton Football Club.

Anyway we won so VAR can kiss my feckin’ v-arse!

Joe McMahon
86 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:58:54
Great to not only come from 2 goals behind but to win a game late, away!
In contrast WHU fans are bemused by David Moyes words" winning is 'what I do"
Tony Hill
87 Posted 01/02/2020 at 18:59:30
As others have said, encouraging signs from Digne today. Nothing spectacular but he looked fully engaged and was important for us.

Quite right, Jim @85. Pawson was dreadful. I think that the standard of refereeing is falling quite rapidly in the Premier League.

Jamie Evans
88 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:01:40
Ha ha Joe, I’m hoping West Ham go down, Moyes could never live that statement down. Can remember hearing him say it and though it was a daft thing say at the time
Nicholas Ryan
89 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:03:36
What goes around, comes around!!
Brent Stephens
90 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:05:27
Tony Marsh
01/02/2020 : 15:12:19
Ancelloti football genius anyone??
George Cumiskey
91 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:06:12
When we do make some signings in the summer one has got to be a strong captain, I'm sorry to say someone in the mould of Henderson.
As the ones we have are weak, Siggy for godsake !
Simon Smith
92 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:07:33
I’d love to see West Ham and Gollum go down.
Can’t stand West Ham
Mike Gaynes
93 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:14:52
Jim #85, VAR is not used to review yellows, only straight reds.

Robert #77, I love your rose-colored fantasy, but that's all it is. Kean ran 70 yards never looking over his shoulder -- he had no idea Theo was there. And he clearly swung his foot at the ball, just as any striker would do in that situation. It was a shot, a scuffed shot, and nothing but a shot.

Peter #80, spot on. Whether or not Pawson got it wrong, Delph was an absolute idiot to put in a pointless challenge on a player facing the sideline -- even if he got the ball, he was just going to send it into touch for a throw-in. No reason in the world for that.

But then again, I don't think we win this game with 11.

Kieran Kinsella
94 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:19:06
Love how after scoring Mina grabbed the ball and ran back to the halfway line. He was determined to tie it up before halftime
Jay Wood

95 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:28:14
I don't think it is any exaggeration to say that we have had a poor season to date. The likes of Sheffield United and Wolves are (rightly) being praised for their good seasons.

And yet for all that, we are just 3 points off 5th placed Blades and 2 points adrift of United and Wolves in 6th and 7th, having played an equal amount of games.

Again, I think it is fair to say that too many players have not played up to scratch and that eventually, they will be replaced with more fit-for-purpose players Carlo wants.

And yet, even given all that, the Italian is getting a tune out of these underperforming players and putting points on the board.

Indeed, even though it is a very narrow database to draw on, with 14 points from 7 league games he is averaging 2 points a game.

To put that into perspective, in the entire history of the PL era, Roberto Martinez in his record-breaking 1st season when we won the most points in a PL campaign averaged 1.89 points a game.

By further comparison, our average points-per-game ratio in the 28 seasons of the PL is 1.37.

In their whole term as Everton managers, this is the average points return per game of full-time managers dating back to Moyes:

Moyes 1.5 points per game exactly
Martinez 1.44
Koeman 1.47
Allardyce 1.42
Silva (worst of the lot) 1.28
Carlo 2.0 - a full half a point per game better than the next best. Over a full season, that adds up to 19 extra points.

Early days, but good signs.

Chad Schofield
96 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:35:22
For me Kean makes that pass, not a scuffed shot... it was the right call too with an out rushing keeper and defender onto of him. Watched it back a few times, but thought that when I first saw it.

Mina though!!!!

Schneiderlin only deserves a mention as the most useless player again.

Tony Hill
97 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:41:44
Mike @93, it might be a wise change if VAR was used to review yellow cards leading to red. Pawson's decision was ludicrous, though I agree with you that Delph was foolish to make the tackle.
Paul Tran
98 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:48:27
We never score from corners.
We never win after going behind.
We're not fit and can't last 90 mins.
We've got no character.

A few myths busted today.

Take a look at the current form table. The 'fraud' has us 3rd, behind Them & City.

Far from perfect. Inarguably promising.

Dave Abrahams
99 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:49:07
Just saw the goals and little snippets of the match, great feeling at the end of the game, winning three more points, the general feeling isvwe played poorly but won, not a good performance, but for me I’ll leave any criticism for another day, we’ve won away after coming from behind, a rare occurrence for the Toffees, the despair from 2-0 down to the sheer delight on going to 3-2 and staying there is enough to keep me going over the weekend, I’m one happy Blue tonight.
Stuart Sharp
100 Posted 01/02/2020 at 19:49:55
The official EFC report claims it was a pass. The BBC and Guardian reports call it a scuffed shot. I thought it was a poor shot in real time and after a replay - that's what his body shape suggests to me - but can't be that obvious if there's so much disagreement. Fortunately, we can all agree that we don't give a toss because we scored an unlikely late winner. Amen.
Danny O'Neill
101 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:00:38
What a totally bizarre season. Liverpool are miles better than anyone else. Man City are miles better than everyone except Liverpool. Leicester are better than the rest & Chelsea marginally behind them.

The rest are complete average bordering on arse. It says it all that a loss today would have seen us dragged closer to a relegation fight yet we end up being 3 points off 5th & Europa.

The self-proclaimed best league in the world is indeed not.

Paul Birmingham
102 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:06:46
Great to win away today and it brought back memories of by gone times, when, we’d always have a shoot out with Watford, and they signalled how good the spirit was then, under HK, 4-5, win to us.

For me this result is massive and should install belief and resilience in the squad.

Who knows, if Delph,, had stayed on what would have happened. For me we were better without him, and more cohesive and direct as a unit.

Let’s not get carried away, but a very rare Saturday night treat, to celebrate an away win, and against the odds.

Now to beat Palace.

John Pierce
103 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:17:35
After a mental come down, it’s worth noting this game was a total paradox.

We won and played terribly, I mean we were woeful.
In a microcosm was Mina, Deeney ruined him in the first half yet big Yerry scores twice?! His attempt to head the ball for the first goal was clownesque. He’s better than Keane but he cannot judge the flight of a ball to save his skin.

The basics evaded Sigurdsson, Walcott, Schneiderlin and special outrage is reserved for Delph. I’ll tell you now, Walcott’s goal was an attempted cross! 😆

The highlights were Holgate, Kean, and Richarlison. Holgate is improving fast and standing out in an average squad. He could open his body out more and be deeper playing LCB, atm it stops him getting the ball left to Digne. Ultimately we buy a left side centre back. It took him until the 45th min to slide a sweet pass inside to Digne. Richarlison was nowhere and yet decided the game, just like Newcastle away, Kean’s hassling to start it all off was a sign of massive encouragement.

Superb to erase the pain of the Newcastle game and see it out. Rarely have I seen us play that poorly and win in such euphoric circumstances.

I word on Ancelotti, never too high in victory nor too low in defeat. I’ve drunk a whole case of cool aid and totally onboard.

Up the spawny toffees.

Mike Gaynes
104 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:22:19
Danny #101, sure is interesting.

If anybody had told us in August that on 1 February we'd be three points ahead of Arsenal, we'd have figured on being in the top 4.

If anybody had told us in August that on 1 February we'd be 16 points behind Leicester and even 3 back of Sheffield, we'd have figured on being in the relegation zone.

Strange season indeed.

Raymond Fox
105 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:22:35
Strange there's always twice as many posts when we lose!
We did well to score 3 away from Goodison but are still conceeding goals.
We shaded it in the end for me and the stats tend to comfirm that.
John Reynolds
106 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:23:41
I’m happy to give Moise the benefit of the doubt and call it a clever pass. Only got to dip in and out of the game but managed to see all 5 goals live. Great result, that for me absolves the Newcastle ballsup. Was surprised to see Bernard on the bench and disappointed that Tom was axed.

The big takeaway from this is that even at 0-2, there was no sign of the heads going down as they always seemed to under Silva. We’re on an upward curve. There are signs that between Carlo and Duncan, they’re finally instilling some self-belief in this bunch.

On the downside, Delph hoofs the ball back to Newcastle last week and stupidly dives into a challenge today when on a yellow. So much for being our experienced level-headed leader.

Roll on Palace.

John Keating
107 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:25:05
Great to get the come from behind win and another small forward step.
No doubt we will have a few reversals before the end of the season but we have to keep moving forward.

When you think where we were and how we were playing before Ferguson stepped up the transformation with the same group of players has been excellent.

Ancelotti might not be everyone's favourite and it is obvious there are a number of people just desperate for him to slip up and fail, however, credit where it is due, he picks his team, sets it up and will change things calmly when needed.

I think he is going to give everyone a bit of a chance before the season ends. Try different things and see how the players react. At the end of the season he will do his thing and get rid of those who he thinks can't or won't play his way.

Mike Gaynes
108 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:28:09
John #103, echoing Tony's comment, for me the highlights were the significant return to form of Digne -- he had some fine tackles and elegant touches, looking like last season -- and the team's confident focus overall. We attacked nonstop in first half injury time, and we attacked nonstop in the 10-12 minutes after Delph's dismissal. I have not seen us respond like that to going a man down in a very long time.
George Cumiskey
109 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:28:39
I can't understand why more posts aren't saying how well Sidibe played !.
Simon Smith
110 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:35:09
Mike 104,

Great post... that’s probably why we think the premier league is the best in the world. Completely unpredictable... well this year anyway. At 2-0 down I was already looking at the relegation zone, then an hour later hoping wolves and manure draw as we battle them for Europe!

Christy Ring
111 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:36:50
Ajax @76 The best thing for us, was Sigurdsson being substituted, and Delph being sent off, how you can praise both, and say they should be together for our next match, is beyond belief.
John Pierce
112 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:45:31
Mike, a fair point that, it’s a shame that as I noted we attack to the right more frequently. Digne was very solid and is much more effective with the ball that the right side. He keeps it better, far more accurately to my eye.

I’d swap Mina & Holgate around, Mina is better than Holgate at transferring to Digne.
One of the many reasons Delph was shite was he often was getting the ball back to goal from Holgate, sadly it became very predictable and he got pressed. If Holgate had more variety he’d help him out a lot.

However I’m actually very excited if we can ever get a midfield worth it’s salt because we have forwards who look like they will score.

Justin Doone
113 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:52:53
Appalled and delighted.

I wanted a top class team manager but to have one that's also lucky could be the difference between us being good and very good, winning plaudits or winning trophies.

Happy for Mina. Walcotts best contribution. He didn't have to think. Just run fast and hit the target. Still lots of work to do.

Mike Gaynes
114 Posted 01/02/2020 at 20:57:55
John #112, passing has always been the weakest link in Holgate's game, and I thought it was the biggest reason Silva blew him out of the club completely last season. But in his time out on loan he really improved his passing accuracy.

Now, all he has to do is widen his tunnel vision. It was even noted on the Forum this morning that every pass he made for quite a while was going to the right -- you're correct, he wasn't even looking at Digne, let alone connecting with him. But despite that, and a couple of mistakes today, he really has improved his distribution a whole lot.

Danny Baily
115 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:00:59
Great result! Such a shame we couldn't hang on against Newcastle.

Pickford has saved one of the last five on target. His overall record in the Premier League is similarly poor. You can't challenge for honours with a keeper like him.

John Pierce
116 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:10:06
Mike, he looks calm and collected. He is very assured, occasionally stepping out with the ball. Favor more measured than many of his senior pros.

If we could buy an established left side center back, I think he’d improve quickly. Improve his anticipation he’s going to get the ball and widen out his position to face the attacking right hand corner flag will give the team options.

But then again he and Luca might have beef!!!

Robert Tressell
117 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:12:18
We are 3 points off fifth. Carlo knows what he is doing.
Brent Stephens
118 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:14:42
Dave Abraham’s on Live Forum “Tony Marsh, player manager of the moaners”!

That’s the best of the season far.

Jeff Armstrong
119 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:31:08
Holgate’s biggest issue at the moment is playing on the left side, he struggles passing with his left foot, he is managing that well though, however,on the right and more comfortable, I think we have a potential world class centre back.
Paul Smith
120 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:33:53
Totally shocked by those on here saying we were terrible. Yes the loose passes were there at times but we gave it a real go. Even in the first half the build up play was decent. Delph is a strange one looked good at times but wants to do everything instead of trusting those around him. At least he's fiery. Someone above reckons this league is shit I disagree, It's close apart from the runaway winners.
Dave Ganley
121 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:41:49
Great win today especially after going 2 down. Makes a pleasant change to smile on a saturday night. Only one league loss since Silva left is pretty good going in the grand scheme of things given how rudderless we were while he was here. Theres a lot of work for Ancelotti to do, not least finding a working midfield and at least a couple of leaders, but we have to be pleased with how it's gone so far. We have every reason to feel better now and even possibly still looking at european places given how poor the league is this season. Baby steps and all that but there is optimism there at last for us all to cling on to.
Looking forward to Palace now.
Tony Hill
122 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:43:19
Holgate looked the part from early on, a natural defender with instinctive positional sense, quick and stylish. He's had significant setbacks in form because of his lack of experience (a torrid time against Arnautovic comes to mind as a trigger) and there are still, of course, areas to develop.

He's starting, crucially, to become self-possessed. That's the step he needed to take. If he has luck and keeps his concentration, I think he will be a great defender.

Tony Hill
123 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:50:11
PS Without getting too carried away (though I am) the timing and precision of a couple of Holgate's tackles today, and the lovely way he's getting his head up coming out of defence, reminded me of Bobby Moore.
Oliver Molloy
124 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:52:16
Is the Ancelotti influence, experience and coaching beginning to take effect - brilliant 3 points and the best answer to the disappointment of Newcastle.
Massive confidence booster for the team.
Eric Paul
125 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:54:24
Football aside, I hope your wife is ok and she got home safe and well.
Peter Warren
126 Posted 01/02/2020 at 21:57:06
Mike Gaynes - can’t see how Delph can be criticised, yet alone called an idiot for staying on his feet, not diving in and winning the ball for a throw in. Alternatively, he could have not put a tackle in at a risk of Watford player crossing it in or perhaps blocking it winning a corner. The linesman was an idiot and the referee.

Also, your comment on VAR I’m not sure you’re right. Whilst video assistant can only check for possible red, handball and penalty, I believe the referee has ability to go look at the pitch side monitor for assistance if he chooses. Happy to be corrected but my view is again referee made an error, let Watford players get in his ear, was obvious Watford player faking it to get the player booked and sent off.

All in all both the Referee and linemen let their emotions get the better of them and I think they should be called out when they are highly paid professionals in our league. Disgraceful in my view.

James Lauwervine
127 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:01:58
I just landed from a flight and saw the result. On first glance looks like the last game has been counteracted.
Philip Bunting
128 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:02:20
Looking forward. With Palace we need to claim the 3 points and I think we will. However with the 4 matches directly after I.e Arsenal, Man U, shite and Chelsea. If we come out of that strong we have a really decent shout of getting Europe as our run in is very favourable. Hopefully everyone can remain focused over these next 5 games.
James Lauwervine
129 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:05:30
Fuckin chuffed by the way. Never liked those Z-Car stealing titheads. Pleased for Walcott.
Jeff Armstrong
130 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:07:52
I’ve been a bit disappointed with Mina in the opposition’s penalty box since he arrived, given the World Cup etc, but today he finally delivered, let’s hope he can become the new Degsy!
Jerome Shields
131 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:12:20
I was glad of the result, but it was stark how poor Walcott, Sigurdsson, Schneiderlin when in came on and Delph to a slightly lesser extent, actually are.

When it came to retaining possession in midfield and providing the correct weighted pass going forward, they repeatedly failed to deliver. When Everton where showing signs of initiative it was these players who consistently caused the loss on momentum, by plain poor play and poor technical ablity. They consistently failed to develop any forward pass for forwards to run on to.

The one area that Everton have improved on is the quality of the ball delivered into the penalty area, as a result I suspect of practise at Finch Farm during the break.

Probably because of Delph stupid red card, both himself and Walcott avoided substitution. Lucky enough Walcott got a goal, and I blatantly say, ' with Keans assist'.

Christopher Marston
132 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:13:26
Really hope Gomes isn’t being rushed back. No need to what with the season now being a dead rubber in pretty much every game.
Peter Neilson
133 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:14:07
Just back from the game and agree with the praise of Holgate. He’s also developing into a leader. Today he was constantly telling the others about their positioning. He’s hit excellent form and played himself into the first team, great to see.
Simon Smith
134 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:21:06
We’re on second after the scum on MOTD if anyone’s interested:
Eric Paul
135 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:21:20
Christopher we’re 3 points off 5th hardly dead rubbers
Joe McMahon
136 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:24:22
Christopher even after some sherberts in the local tap bar, this season may not be a dead rubber yet!
Dave Lynch
137 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:25:58
Watched the last goal numerous times, defo a pass from Kean
Jeff Armstrong
138 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:28:14
Dave #137,
it’s a scuffed shot for me,
the eyes have it !
Paul Birmingham
139 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:41:45
Hopefully, Mina will now start bagging up, as he’s shown, how good he is at set pieces, many times.

How’s he got the taste, hopefully, plenty more to come.

Phil Sammon
140 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:45:31
Can someone please explain to me how the linesman can give a free kick against Moise Kean by the corner flag just before the final whistle? If we’d have gone on to concede there that would have been absolutely scandalous.

The Delph second yellow was disgraceful too. Nothing about that challenge warranted anything more than a free kick.

Simon Smith
141 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:49:25
Carlos’s eyebrow really does have a mind of its own!!
John Pierce
142 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:52:41
Phil, Delph’s second yellow was a god send. Deffo better with 10.

For me he’s propelled himself as top shithouse above Walcott & Schneiderlin.

Jerome Shields
143 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:57:50
Holgate the right back that it was thought Everton after the Summer Transfer as a poor back up, and Brands had failed.

Holgate was first played against Lincoln City in the League Cup, where he put a performance on distribution that Mina and Keane could never produce. He then performed in the next rounds of the League Cup, scoring in the 72 min against Watford. He continued against Leicester putting in a equally consistent performance.

I was so glad when injuries allowed him into the first team in the Premership and he started to come to everybody's attention for the great player he was. His cameo in midfield against Man United, a injury fill in, really showed his all round ability.

He is better than Mina / Kean and will leave Stones in his shadows in the not too distant future.

MOTM and will be in more games than not.

Eric Paul
144 Posted 01/02/2020 at 22:58:17
Dave @137
My initial thoughts were airshot but after watching it numerous times I think you are right, an assist by any other name
Ciarán McGlone
145 Posted 01/02/2020 at 23:05:39
Kean opened up his foot.. it was an attempted shot. Not sure how it's even up for debate.

As for Delph's second yellow..harsh, but it was a tackle from behind and reckless. Idiotic.

Eric Paul
146 Posted 01/02/2020 at 23:13:58
If he’s opened his foot up his intention was to put it where it went
John Boon
147 Posted 01/02/2020 at 23:25:31
George (109) Simple answer...Because he didn't. Nothing against the lad but I would still prefer Coleman. Mind you I would also prefer Keane to Mina, despite his goals.

To each his own. I am just delighted that we won and I am not in the mood to be critical of any Evertonian whether they agree with me or not. We are by no means THERE but there are more silver linings than there are clouds.

Jerome Shields
148 Posted 01/02/2020 at 23:42:53
What???? The winter break next week.
Phil Sammon
149 Posted 01/02/2020 at 23:50:25
John 147

Nah, Sidebe was good. He actually defended well for a change. Deulofeu causes most teams problems. Sidebe kept him quiet and put some good balls into the box.

Brent Stephens
150 Posted 01/02/2020 at 00:02:00
Phil #140. Absolutely. The away end went ballistic at that free kick against Kean. It was a clear foul on him.

Bob Parrington
151 Posted 01/02/2020 at 00:07:31
John@142 - Yup, I was thinking just that because Delph was making too many mistakes in defensive play. His play was not all bad as he regularly looked well in control going forward.

I was wondering why Carlo hadn't subbed him but the bad refereeing decision got him out of the picture. The other players pulled together well to record a well earned 3 points!

Rob Dolby
152 Posted 02/02/2020 at 00:16:09
Made up for the lads who travelled down. It's about time they had something to cheer about.

I didn't think there was any way back after a bit of Gerry magic and the Delph mistake.

Walcott who I thought was hopeless all afternoon turned out to be the hero.

Mina was my MOTM. 2 goals and kept Deeney reasonably quiet.

Ed Prytherch
153 Posted 02/02/2020 at 00:23:48
I'm late to the thread, John Keating 107 already posted my thoughts. Carletto is experimenting so that he can decide who is worth keeping and how best to use them. He does not get too excited about the crazy stuff because he sees the big picture.

Holgate and Maguire should anchor England's defence.

Dave Lynch
154 Posted 02/02/2020 at 00:52:58
Look at his foot, he rolls it across the ball, great pass🤣🤣
He also looks for Theo in his initial run.
Well chuffed with that result I am.
John Reynolds
155 Posted 02/02/2020 at 00:54:22
John #106, having watched and replayed MOTD several times, I must withdraw my complaint about Delph’s second yellow. It was barely a foul, never mind a card. And he stayed on his feet. Very poor decision.
Don Alexander
156 Posted 02/02/2020 at 01:07:14
Despite his otherwise ineffectual performance it was pleasing to see Theo running box to box in extra time to clinch the winning goal.

That said, it was only Watford, miles off a team close to our Kenwright delusional 'istory.

And it wouldn't be me, would it, if I didn't slate the pernicious hand of that self-serving charlatan Kenwright in being, still, any part of our great club.

Not that Moshiri now fills me with hope though, sadly.

Mike Gaynes
157 Posted 02/02/2020 at 01:13:50
Dave, I love your creative imagination, but that's all it is... imagination. Kean was head down and balls to the wall, and didn't have a clue Theo was anywhere in the same county. There is nothing else that could have been but a shot. Any striker passing up a shot at goal from that close in would be unworthy of the title -- and skinned alive by his manager.

Peter Warren, the ref was definitely wrong and the Watford players were definitely acting/lobbying. But that's still no excuse for a veteran player to even put himself in that position. Watch Delph immediately hold his head when the whistle first blows, even before the card. He KNEW he'd screwed up. (Not that I'm sorry, however -- as others have said, I don't think we would have won if it weren't for that red.)

Eric, thanks again for the good wishes.

Denny Kerr
158 Posted 02/02/2020 at 01:15:02
Good win, really pleased for the away supporters, they deserved that, and more.

You can see progress on the field, but we really do have some poor players, with Walcott near the top of the list.

How can a Premier League player be so pathetic in producing an end product ?
Yes, he got the goal, but he is so poor, I don't care.
He should never play for the first team again he's absolute rubbish.

Mike Gaynes
159 Posted 02/02/2020 at 01:51:32
Denny #158... "How can a Premier League player be so pathetic in producing an end product ?"

Seen Christian Benteke recently?

Eric Myles
160 Posted 02/02/2020 at 01:54:21
John #103, regarding Mina's inability to judge the flight of a ball to save his skin. I've posted this on a few threads, you'll be surprised to learn that more than 50% of his goals for the national team come from headers. I guess then must have just bounced off him when he was looking the other way.

Phil Sammon
161 Posted 02/02/2020 at 02:04:21
Mike 157

‘ the ref was definitely wrong and the Watford players were definitely acting/lobbying. But that's still no excuse for a veteran player to even put himself in that position.’

I’ve got to disagree with you there, Mike. He hasn’t done anything silly that warranted even a suggestion of a second yellow card. If getting a yellow card means you can have no further physical contact with anyone then players will have to be withdrawn immediately after going in the book.

We all know that a poor tackle in the first 5 minutes is much less likely to be met with a booking than one made later in the game. There are clearly factors other than the direct incident that go through the referee’s head before he makes a decision. When the card you are about to dish out is going to result in the player being sent off, you had better be damn sure that it is warranted. It clearly wasn’t and I don’t think Delph should be blamed on the slightest.

Phil Sammon
162 Posted 02/02/2020 at 02:10:25
Yerry Mina is more donkey than footballer. I’m grateful for his two goals and I actually find him a very likeable chap, but he has a staggering lack of footballing ability. Watching him try to sprint, it’s sometimes hard to believe he’s a professional athlete at all. He makes Michael Keane look graceful. I can’t believe the guy played for Barcelona.
John Pierce
163 Posted 02/02/2020 at 02:10:42
Eric, Thats a poor argument, 50% of how many, 4 maybe 6? Its not like he’s prolific is he? That’s the point though. He gets loads of chances but barely gets any on target.

Until today most headed attempts at goal in the premier league this season 18, without scoring.

Not in the top 40 defenders this season for winning aerial balls.
Dead easy to say he wins 4 or 5 headers, but they are often only a fraction of the duels he’s faced. All to often they are not good headers too.

I will cede he has improved this season, however Keane’s demise has exaggerated his performances.

He simply cannot time a header, he’s gotten free in the box numerous times this season under little duress and blazed over or wide.

At least one of your centre backs should be excellent in the air. For his size and leap, he’s extremely disappointing. When his partner is the guy who cleans up behind him he should be dominating his centre forward. Deeney has him on toast today, too tight and unable to win the ball without going over his man. He conceded several unnecessary free kicks.

Not my cup of tea

Dave Lynch
164 Posted 02/02/2020 at 02:30:12
Mike. It was telepathy.

Carlo has got them playing on a spiritual level.

Roman Sidey
165 Posted 02/02/2020 at 02:34:29
Bloody stoked with the win. Few moments of dread in the first half and even in the second, especially after we'd scored.

I was doing laps with my thoughts on Delph. He made some good runs through the middle but some seriously bad passes and possession losses.

What I really want to know though are more interest based.

Firstly, I'd love to know which club is at the top of the "if you're on a scoring drought you can break it against us" table, because if it isn't Everton I'd be very surprised.

Secondly, how many times has it transpired that a team has had two matches in a row that contained a centre-half scoring an injury time brace? Even more interesting, how many times has that occurred to make a scoreline 2-2?

David Donnellan
166 Posted 02/02/2020 at 02:49:23
Mina did have problems at times with Deeney today, true! However it is difficult to head the ball cleanly when the forward is backing in & has no intention of contesting a header.
I wouldn’t agree that Deeney had Mina on toast, what did Deeney actually do today? How many attempts did he have on goal?
Deeney is a limited bang average lump. Championship quality forward. His main attributes appear to be throwing his considerable weight about & their “leader” on the field.
I think our defence coped with him ok today.
Bill Gall
167 Posted 02/02/2020 at 02:50:33
Who cares about Kean's shot being a pass or a scuffed shot, I couldn't, he could have tripped over his own feet, fell over and the ball hit him on his arse going to Walcott who scored, the only thing that matters is we scored to win.
Rich broke away and as fast as he is, Kean caught up to him to make the play. It is not often we get lucky breaks go our way, so congratulations to all 3 players involved you have made my weekend enjoyable.
Jamie Crowley
168 Posted 02/02/2020 at 03:01:03
I just watched the goal about 10 consecutive times on Youtube.

The away supporters are just priceless. Makes me thank God I'm alive to see such unbridled joy and passion.



Laurie Hartley
169 Posted 02/02/2020 at 03:35:14
For me this is a very, very significant result:
We came from 2 nil down to equalise in first half extra time.
We score the winner in the 90th minute even though we had been down to 10 men for nearly 20 minutes
We did this away from home.

This is the sort of thing I have become used to over the past 5 years - except it has always been the opposition doing it to US.

Why did Ancelloti take DCL off instead of Walcott? Even the commentators were saying how poor he had been. Perhaps it is because Walcott is as fit as a fiddle, has pace, and can last 90 minutes.

I have been asking myself for several season now how come other teams could “find a way to win” when for us it was we could “find a way to loose.”

Ancelloti in his Pre match presser - “the easiest way to score is on a counter attack.”

Perhaps times really are changing.

Up the Blues!!!

Steve Brown
170 Posted 02/02/2020 at 03:45:12
Jay @ 95, you are spot on. It has been a poor season with a squad that was built with no clear recruitment strategy. Watching the game, I marvelled that we had replaced Delofeu with Walcott (regardless of the winner). But then we also replaced Barkley with Sigurddson and Stones with Keane. Take a bow Ronald Koeman.

The quality of play was as poor as it was away to West Ham in the first half, but Ancelotti (and Duncan) have show the ability to get results from a poorly performing and unbalanced team and squad. If we hadn't blown away two points so comically against Newcastle we would be in 6th place. This summer is again going to be about wholesale clearing house - there are so many players who we need to move on - Niasse, Sandro, Martina, Bolasie, Besic, Sigurddson, Schneiderlin, Walcott, maybe Keane and Delph. But I actually think we finally have the right DoF and manager to do it.

David Currie
171 Posted 02/02/2020 at 04:13:25
Great comeback, Holgate man of match and I would make him captain. He has that fight in him and I can see a bit of Kevin Ratcliffe in him. Rats was a young captain and a leader, Mason has a big future ahead of him. Silva was not a fan as he liked 2 big Centre backs but he is a much better footballer than the other two and can play centre midfield if needed.
Jerome Shields
172 Posted 02/02/2020 at 04:38:31
Having persistently attack Finch Farm as a holiday camp during breaks, I do think Ancelotti did work in four areas to help win this game.

Firstly in the quality of the ball into the penalty area at set pieces.

Secondly clearing Ever tons in the later stages of the game.

Thirdly forward positioning on a counter attack.

Last, but not lest Pickfords composure in goal.

Ancelotti can't be happy with the play and effort of the midfield trio of Sigurdsson, Walcott and Delph. Schneiderlin did himself no favours with his cameo performance, which was in the same vein as the others.

Adam Gilfillan
173 Posted 02/02/2020 at 05:24:37
I havent had time to read the comments above but is anyone else starting to get excited by Mason Holgate?
Jamie Crowley
174 Posted 02/02/2020 at 06:53:35
So watching back, a few more tidbits.

Yerry Mina, after his first goal around 45:50. I love this man. He pokes it home, down 2-1 after his goal, and what does he do?

He picks the ball up out of the net and races back for the kickoff. His mindset is a winner's mindset - we need another goal before half, we have to equalize.

God knows we need more of that!

The next thing I notice? A team.

The second goal when they miraculously equalize before half, almost every single outfield player goes into the proverbial sports group hug.

These guys get along. There's no prima donnas, no Johny Big Britches, they just all pull for one another.

I don't know about anyone out there in TW-land, but I'm beginning to love this squad under Carlo. The good, and the ugly Delph / Sidibe axis. They're all on board. The young kids, the veterans at the ready, the ugly wart players, the motley crew.

And speaking of Sidibe, I don't rate him at all. But here's a guy who clapped the fans after the shite reserve nightmare extravaganza. And he celebrated like it was 1999 after our goals today. He's exhibiting Blue class. I think Blue has touched him, so if we sign him, I think I should stop being so hard on the guy.

Note to self...

Still think he's an overrated footballer, but it might be time to get behind him?

Mike Gaynes
175 Posted 02/02/2020 at 06:53:57
Phil #162, I think you are 100% off target. Mina may run like a dump truck with the back gate down -- with that crouching gallop he reminds me of one of those nature shows about hyenas -- but he has more pace than you realize. Furthermore, for all his lack of grace he is an excellent footballer. He has a soft first touch, never loses the ball on the dribble, and is easily the best passer of our three CBs. He picks the right pass forward and delivers it with precision where it's easy for the recipient to control, never making the target stretch (Holgate) or try to cushion a driven ball (Keane). And he can chip or loft a long ball with touch and even occasional elegance. Holgate, who looks so much better on the ball than Mina, can't remotely compare to his passing ability.

Mina's fundamental weakness, ironically enough, is heading -- he wins everything in the air but often has no idea where it's going.

Look past the awkwardness. Mina is a footballer.

Jamie Crowley
176 Posted 02/02/2020 at 07:05:18
Often times on TW, people rip the stink out of the "plastic" fans.

The Seppos.

The Yanks.

The 'Mericans.

I'll say this. We can spot an athlete.

When Mike Gaynes and I agree on players, usually we're on to something.

Mina is a great footballer at his position. Not good. Great.

Derek Knox
177 Posted 02/02/2020 at 07:12:08
David Currie @171, good shouts there for both MoM and possible future Captaincy with Holgate. Although by virtue of his two goals Mina will no doubt take the MoM slot.

He (Holgate) is certainly benefitting from an extended run in the first team, and up to now has rarely put a foot wrong, rather showing maturity beyond his age and making cool-headed clearances and interceptions that his senior team mates are slower to react to.

Annika Herbert
178 Posted 02/02/2020 at 07:13:20
As Mike Gaynes will happily confirm, he and I have had the odd disagreement during the season!! However, I fully agree with him on his assessment of Mina.
I too believe he is a good player and I further believe he will only improve the longer thee run he gets in the team. With reinforcements to arrive in the summer, I believe he will become a key component in that defence.
I believe Mike and Jamie are spot on with their Mina comments
Mike Gaynes
179 Posted 02/02/2020 at 07:20:23
Jamie #174, might be a good idea, because Sidibe is going to be with this club a long time.

He leads us in tackles by a wide margin over Richarlison and Digne despite playing only 2/3 as many minutes. After today, Sidibe has 63 tackles in just 1245 minutes over 16 appearances. His tackles-per-minute rate is one of the best in the Prem. (Both Rich and Digne have played almost 2000 minutes, and have 54 and 51 tackles respectively.)

Furthermore, Sidibe is our best passer and crosser of the ball. He has four assists, second on the club to Digne, and his crossing accuracy rate of 32% is the best in the Prem.

Yeah, he has some major issues to sort out, but this guy is a talent, and he's staying. Get on the bandwagon.

Darren Hind
180 Posted 02/02/2020 at 07:24:02
Mike G

"I don't think we win this game with 11"

What an utterly ridiculous thing to say... but I coudn't agree more.

I've been telling you for a long time that Holgate is the best footballer at this club. His passing is not his weakness. His weakness is his team mates inability to take a pass facing their own goal.
He could lump it, but he's doing what Ancelotti wants him to do and play through midfield.
If he gives it to Digne. he reverts to crab football. I can tell you now, that even if he switches to the right. He aint going to do it unless its the only ball on.
Take a look at how we got the corner for Mina's second goal. A surging run out of defence, little shimmy and exquisite forward pass - Guess who to ? He had no problem passing to Digne in and advanced role

You're still showing resistance and doubt, but Holgate will eventually drag you on board

Jamie Crowley
181 Posted 02/02/2020 at 07:32:31
I don't like him as a footballer, Mike. Like the guy a lot as a Blue human being. He's just crap at defending.

I'll try. His attitude deserves a chance, I'll grant him that. You couldn't ask for more with his effort, attitude and approach.

And Christ knows that's 90% of the battle.

I will say you're fixated with his tackles stats. He's no Gana Gueye (we both loved Gana from the outset).

Those tackle stats for Sidibe deceive thy eyes, Sir Gaynes.

But I scream for all the traits Sidibe exhibits with his effort and attitude, so I'll back off the kid.

Annika Herbert
182 Posted 02/02/2020 at 07:49:18
Ajay@76, I have no idea whatsoever how you can claim Sigurdsson and Delph should be part of our midfield given their recent performances!
Everyone to their own opinion of course but I have to disagree with you on that point
Tony Abrahams
183 Posted 02/02/2020 at 07:50:49
Jamie C, take no notice of that plastic fan shite, which looks like it might have just got under your skin a little bit because you are just as much a toffee, as every other Evertonian, mate, and the only thing stopping you from going to Goodison Pk every other week is geography!

Mike G, has made the pilgrimage twice, and the time, and effort you both put into Everton on this website alone, shows me and countless others no doubt, what Everton FC means to you both, and I hope to one day share a pint, and a laugh, and a bit of a piss-take, because I’m not drinking my pint out of plastic!

Mike G, I’m glad your wife is okay, but if you think that Mina, is a better footballer than Holgate, then maybe you need to go and see someone yourself!

I like Mina, I thought he was improving every week, but since Ancelotti came into our club, I’ve been a bit more concerned by his form, so hopefully yesterday’s two goals will help with his confidence, and hopefully someone telling him that sometimes in football, you are actually stronger, when you don’t try and win every single ball, especially when it’s not actually there to be won?

This might turn into a bit of a debate because I know how much you rate Mina, Mike, but the reason I think Holgate, is the better footballer, is the way he can effortlessly play in midfield.

Sometimes though we forget how young these players are, because central defenders usually get a lot better with age, and that’s why I was made up with Richarlison yesterday, because his run and the way he took that extra touch, to change the angle, before he passed it inside to Kean, for yesterday’s winner, was brilliant, because it could have been so easy to rush that final ball, and fuck it up, which shows me the kid is learning?

Mike Gaynes
184 Posted 02/02/2020 at 08:21:04
Tony #183, I didn't say Mina is a better footballer than Holgate. I said he is a better passer. And he is. Much better. Yes, Holgate looks effortless and Mina ungainly, but just watch where the passes go.

Darren #180, Holgate simply isn't a very good passer yet, although he is vastly improved over two years ago, when he was one of the worst I've ever seen. Now he's excellent on the ball, great touch, but if you follow his passes, they are not particularly ambitious and, often, not particularly accurate. He no longer misses wide-open targets as often, or drills the ball directly into defenders in front of him the way he did last season, but he does make Siggy and Iwobi and Rich reach for the ball (unlike Mina, who delivers it on a plate). You blame his teammates' "inability to take a pass facing their own goal", but often the pass is a half yard to the left or right and forces the recipient to stretch for it, and there's nothing they can do but shove it back.

And yes, Holgate's dribble and pass to Digne was perfect. It was also pretty much his first pass to the left all day. Guys were laughing about it on the Forum -- he had made about 20 straight passes to his right, either short to Sidibe or long towards Walcott, while Digne was out to the port side waving his arms.

But you don't have to worry about getting me "on board" with Holgate. Remember I was about the only guy on TW insisting that Brands didn't need to buy Kurt or borrow another CB because Mason could do the job, although I doubted Silva would ever give him another chance. And I suggested months ago that Mina and Holgate could be our long-term CB pairing. There was some derision then. I don't hear much now.

Darren Hind
185 Posted 02/02/2020 at 08:31:18
Can somebody please explain the mentality of posts 90 & 118?

I don't know Tony Marsh, but you don't need to be a shrink to know he has suffered one kick to the balls too many. He's a fierce Evertonian who has taught himself to expect the worst in order to avoid more disappointment.

I don't know Dave Abrahams either but, having read his posts for years, I would bet a month's wages that he would happily spend time chatting to Marshy about all things Everton over a few pints.

Tony Marsh would have been celebrating last night. He would have been delighted that his worst fears were not realised. It was a day of celebration for all Evertonians.

I find it quite telling that, after such a result, the resident Midnight Mass would show no regard whatsoever for the game and can only come on to attack another fan... then come back two hours later to have another go.

While the eternally "miserable" Marshy would have been celebrating the comeback, the self-proclaimed positive can only sit and stew for hours after the match, wallowing in spite.

Funny old game.

Allan Board
186 Posted 02/02/2020 at 08:59:58
I would like Mason Holgate to learn his craft from an Italian team of coach's first. He will be a fine player when he becomes more confident on his left side and this will help him to play just that bit quicker so he doesn't get caught in possession.

Southgate would ruin him, he knows nothing. These young players will learn all the football nuances from Ancelloti and his team, they will learn bugger all at England camps.

Ancelloti would have won the last World Cup with England, not blown it down to a lack of football nous shown by Southgate v Croatia.

Steve Shave
187 Posted 02/02/2020 at 09:05:54
I think there are grounds for true optimism here, lads. Something about us is stirring: more resilience, more fight, better defending set-pieces, better taking them, finally learning to win from behind.

This summer is crucial – we will lose Martina, Niasse (thankfully) and probably Baines (sad face) freeing up significant wages; Schneiderlin can be moved on. I hate to say it but so should Coleman (Sidibe and Kenny can scrap for the shirt).

I think yesterday's defence will be our defence next season; I think Keane is an able and competent back-up. The only screw-up in my eyes there was not retaining Robinson who could have really pushed Digne in the future.

I really like the idea of nourishing Kean and Calvert-Lewin to gel together, Richarlison can fill in and keep them on their toes or go wide, the guy's a star.

What must happen this summer is we sort out that midfield, we HAVE to move on Sigurdsson at a price – this to me crucial, Schneiderlin & Sigurdsson need to be replaced with real quality. If we must keep Walcott (please no) then this must be as a back-up sub, for his pace to hurt teams in the closing minutes.

So for me, 2 central midfielders and a right midfielder of quality; then, boys, I think we will really have a side who can push forward. Let's get behind them and pray that Carlo and Brands make shrewd moves this summer.

Dave Abrahams
188 Posted 02/02/2020 at 09:13:58
Darren (185), You would win your bet. That's why I took the Mickey out of Tony Marsh. I don't know him either but I knew he would have understood my remark and laughed it off. I just know he loves Everton as much as you and me, Darren.
Sam Hoare
189 Posted 02/02/2020 at 09:40:17
Good morning all! Awoke this morning expecting yesterday's turnaround to be a dream as it was so un-Everton. But it really happened!

Strange to think this season, which has been so disappointing at so many turns, is still alive and kicking. Still unsure how we have so many sub-standard options in central midfield but up top we have some nice options and Holgate has been a huge positive at the back. Things are looking up!

Steve Shave
190 Posted 02/02/2020 at 10:02:13
Oh and of course tie down both Calvert-Lewin and Holgate to new contracts befitting of their importance to our future.

I posted on the forum yesterday but wish to reiterate - so much (by myself as well) has been written about wasted money at this club but don't forget how our (arguably) 2 best performers this season cost a combined £3.5M — outstanding business.

We are also quick to forget that we turned a good profit on the likes of Lookman (doubled our money, got rid of his presumably shit attitude), Vlasic, Onyekuru and Gana (boy, do we miss him); let's try to keep these positives in focus.

Steve Shave
191 Posted 02/02/2020 at 10:03:50
Re Gana... Does anyone know how he's getting on at PSG, by the way?
John Atkins
192 Posted 02/02/2020 at 10:31:31
I’m sure most have worked it out but since Silva was dismissed we’ve played 10 league games in the Duncan then Carlo era and only lost to Man City away having won 5 and drawn 4 in the other 9 games. There’s got to be something there considering the injury’s we’ve had

We aren’t that bad (some of the live forum lot really need to be a little more supportive and less negative) and with a bit of more luck as well as Gomes to get back soon then we’ve a real good chance of Europa League next season

Agree we need to ship out some of the deadwood

Im sure Carlo will bring in some quality players next season

Laurie Hartley
193 Posted 02/02/2020 at 10:54:54
Very happy for the away fans especially for Sam and his mam

Going by this I reckon Moise has an assist to his name.

Go on!!! Go on!!!!

Bill Watson
194 Posted 02/02/2020 at 11:15:58
Kean was right in front of me and that was an attempted shot! I don't think he was even aware Walcott was there.

Commiserations to the travelling Blues who missed both Mina's goals by leaving for an early piss after they went two up!!!

The big bonus of this shambolic season has been the emergence of Holgate who is starting to look the real deal

Gary Willock
195 Posted 02/02/2020 at 11:18:37
Steve@187 - couldn’t agree more! 2 quality CMs and a quality RW, then watch us absolutely fly. Key is now keeping the nucleus of this young team together, and avoiding wholesale change. Get rid of the deadwood and square pegs, and add quality.
Steve Shave
196 Posted 02/02/2020 at 11:41:50
Gary 195 - yes bud, Zielinski and Everton Soares (Richy can play either side) and maybe a promising young CM like Bellingham at Birmingham would turn this team around into a very strong outfit in my eyes. It's so easy to get caught up in the negativity (yes it really has been a damp squid of a season) but it excites me to think we are 2-3 signings away from a proper team ready to match anyone. well sort of.
Christy Ring
197 Posted 02/02/2020 at 11:57:55
Just thinking after yesterday's game, imagine if we had a midfield, how much better we'd be. We've probably one of the poorest in the Premiership, with Delph, Sigurdsson and Schneiderlin, when he came on, even Iwobi doesn't want to know about it, when it gets physical, Capoue won all the 50/50 challenges yesterday. When Holgate went to midfield, after Delph's red card, look how much stronger we were. I know we're missing our two main midfielders, Gomes and Gbamin, but we definitely haven't replaced Gueye, and with the extent of Gbamin's injury, we need to readdress it in the summer window.
Gary Willock
198 Posted 02/02/2020 at 12:36:00
Steve@196 - I’m really excited too fella. We have a winning manager now who gets results, even when we have off days or off-half’s.

Don’t know much about the lad from Brum tbh, but would certainly take Zielinkski, and Everton Soares! But the latter to compete with Bernie on the left, as I’d leave Richie up top so we can then rotate a bit with DCL and Moise, or even go 4-3-3 sometimes.

Think it would be worth seeing if we could get Malcom away from Zenit. Still only 22 and a more natural right sided player. Get Delph off the wage bill if we can, and bring in Allen for a leader role in the middle alongside Zielinkski and Andre.

Those 4 would be a dream - but I think any two of them would turn us into top 4. The margins are so fine it’s unreal. Other than the top 2 we are already as good as the rest. #UTFT #COYB

Andrew Clare
199 Posted 02/02/2020 at 12:38:51
I agree Christy. We are weak in the most important positions on the pitch which is the midfield. Two top class midfielders would transform our team. Gomes will make a difference when he is back fully fit but we really need two top additions as well. Hopefully in the summer.
Tony Hill
200 Posted 02/02/2020 at 12:55:58
If you look at the winning goal on young Sam's piece linked by Laurie @193, it looks much more like a pass from Kean.
Ray Smith
201 Posted 02/02/2020 at 13:04:03
Those 2 first half goals yesterday reminded me of the last 2 minutes against Newcastle!

I agree that our midfield needs strengthening. However, we have 2 injured midfielders, one tried and tested, the other with huge potential.

Personally I would rather Gomes wasn’t rushed back (not that that’s likely) and see him and Gbamin start afresh next season.

By then Niasse and Martina will be off the books, which goes part way to acquiring a quality addition(s).

I’ve got mixed feelings about the other perceived dead wood.

It’s seems the deadwood changes almost weekly, so are they as bad as we seem to think?

Apart from the above 2, what constitutes deadwood?

Be interesting to see who is definite deadwood and who after being labelled deadwood plays well in spite of the criticism?

Terry Downes
202 Posted 02/02/2020 at 13:19:39
Holgate should be in midfield from now in.
Paul Richardson
203 Posted 02/02/2020 at 13:27:00
Agree with Tony @123...there is a bit of Bobby Moore in Holgate, especially how he shuffles forward with the ball at his feet and almost seems to lose it - pushes it a little too far forward - before clipping a neat pass to a team mate. Still a long way to go, but the promise is there,
Gary Willock
204 Posted 02/02/2020 at 13:40:33
Ray, it’s all opinion, and opinions are there to be changed. For me the ‘genuine’ deadwood is obvious: Niasse, Martina, Sandro, Bolasie and most of the rest out on loan right now.

Whilst the word ‘deadwood’ is a little unfair on some of these, but I also agree with Steve@187 that Sigurddson and Schneiderlin should be moved on too. Add Delph to that too. Stabling influence my arse. Stekelenburg offers no future either.

The legends that are Baines and Coleman also take up big wages. Again I agree with Steve that doesn’t make sense to continue that. We need youth challenging a first choice pair, and someone who could last a season if we got a big injury.

Keane, Iwobi and Walcott could be added too. but think Iwobi has time on his side and we still need backup.

Grant Rorrison
205 Posted 02/02/2020 at 13:55:09
How many players in the current squad would you unquestionable want to keep? Not very many I suspect. The rest are dead, or at least in the process of dying, wood. Obviously, any of them can change that with how they perform from now until the end of the season.
Don Alexander
206 Posted 02/02/2020 at 14:04:13
Haven't read every comment but it was great to see three players sprinting towards their area in the 90th minute, Theo from our area, and score. Long may that habit continue.
David Pearl
207 Posted 02/02/2020 at 14:11:03
Reading most of the posts above most seem to want us to replace around 10 players. We’ve already seen what happens if you try to change players too quickly, they don’t gel. Of all Brands signings maybe only Digne but the ground running while the rest of them took 4 months or more.

The obvious ones to replace first off are Niasse, Tosun and Martina. You can probably add Dowel and few youngsters to that. Looking at the squad, if Gbamin and Gomes come good it gives us option to switch things up. If they don’t... well Schneiderlin could move on, however l think he’s currently the best we have in that position. Playing as a central mid and not sitting between the centre backs.

Regarding Siggy, a change of style hasn’t helped him so rather than hope he goes and the endless criticism perhaps we allow Ancelotti the chance to actually coach the players.

Darren Hind
208 Posted 02/02/2020 at 14:15:58
Its daft to try to compare Mina's passing ability to Holgate's. Holgate operates at a much higher level.

I'll give Mina his due. if a team mate makes himself available for a simple pass. He will find him and that will impress the stattos, but he is very vulnerable to being pressed. Holgate has a side step, he has the lateral movement to get himself out of trouble, to open up passes that don't exist in Minas world. He isn't afraid to go past opponents to open opportunities.
Its years since we had a player like Holgate, Yeah he will make more mistakes, but he plays to win. His passes are ambitious. He always looks for the footballers pass.

Big Yerry was was being dominated to the point of being ridiculed throughout the first half yesterday. He needs to learn to be patient. He needs to stop going for balls he cant win and start attacking balls he can and should win. He is too good a player to be bossed by journeymen like he was yesterday. That said.. What a response. I was delighted for him personally as well as the team.
Mina is not just huge he times his runs well in the opponents box. I cant believe how many times he gets on the end of a cross. His downfall has been poor heading. He tends to connect with his ear rather then the bone above his eyebrows.
Maybe he needs reminding that he can head a ball. He has shown it at the highest level. Hopefully yesterdays 2nd goal will inspire him to work on his timing,
Mina will never be able to consistently make the passes Holgate made to force both corners yesterday, but that doesnt mean he doesnt have an even bigger contribution to make.
If he can start meeting these crosses on the bone consistently he can easily become a modern day Derek Mountfield

Terry McLavey
209 Posted 02/02/2020 at 14:20:32
A great result, showing how far we've come. A while back, we'd have just have rolled over after going behind.

A few Oscar-winning performances by them to get players booked as well.

Slightly off-topic, I thought Watford had changed the Z-Cars theme to their own tune? Unless they just played it just for us to wind us up? Thanks, Watford — it worked a treat!

Tony Abrahams
210 Posted 02/02/2020 at 14:56:00
Good points Darren, and Mina, definitely showed loads of spirit yesterday, which means he his on the right lines.

I always think that the one who is better at passing the ball, is usually the better footballer, but football is also about partnerships, so hopefully this is something that is beginning to develop between our two central defenders, who have both made mistakes, but are also up for the fight.

Also I would hate to play behind our current midfielders, because even when they show for the ball, there is usually very little intent, and this is why we look horribly ponderous at times.

Paul Tran
211 Posted 02/02/2020 at 14:56:36
No point in comparing two different players. Mina will be better when he's more selective in where and when he challenges. Holgate has always been a cracking young player who needed a good run in the team. I'd like to think they could form a good partnership.
Gavin Johnson
212 Posted 02/02/2020 at 15:01:27
Off topic slightly. Past 10 games:
W5 D4 L1. Pts 19. Avg 1.9pts per game
3rd in the form table over these past 10 games level with City in 2nd

Nice turn around from where we were after 15 games. COYB

Mike Benjamin
213 Posted 02/02/2020 at 15:01:40
Darren 208#. Perhaps Holgate and Mina can complement each other. The progress of Holgate has been incredible given that many had labelled him as Championship standard at best. If only Mina could start playing to his height, like you say needs to start attacking the ball. He is actually not as bad on the ball as you make out but must be stronger and braver.
Derek Knox
214 Posted 02/02/2020 at 15:33:10
Slightly off topic here but I have noticed that SC Paderborn v Wolfsburg is on BT1 at 17.00. In case no-one is aware Anthony Evans recently signed for them (Paderborn) but have had no indication yet whether he is actually playing.

Have read that they are over the moon in getting him and have been watching him for U-23's for quite some time so they did rate him highly. Paderborn are struggling a bit apparently at the wrong end of the Table. Personally, always interested in ones we have let leave to other Clubs.

Steve Ferns
215 Posted 02/02/2020 at 15:43:29
Come on Burnley, keep those gunners below us.

Dunno if you can still call it a shambolic season, it was, but our resurgence since Silva was sacked has it as more of a poor season and it won't take much more to be an average season, but yet 3 more points could make it a good season!

Crazy league this year. But still most definitely the best in the world. As proved by the fact that we're the only League with all our clubs still in Europe and had 3/4 CL semi-finalists last season, and both EL finalists.

Kevin O'Regan
216 Posted 02/02/2020 at 15:55:42
Funny how one of our best players this season (Holgate) was not really meant for a first team role this season - but after we failed to grab a new CB in the xfer market he grabbed his chance by the neck. One thing I like about him is his arrogant positivity to glide from defence into midfield and setup an attack. If he continues to improve and cut out some mistakes he will be a fantastic footballer and hard to hold onto. But I'm happy for him to make mistakes as long as he can make up for them and learn continuously.
Derek Knox
217 Posted 02/02/2020 at 15:57:06
Steve F, the Footballing Gods have granted your wishes, yes only a draw, but in all fairness Burnley should have won it, Jay Rodriguez had one hit the bar and down but not over the line.

Arteta, or should I say, he is now their Teta, is not having a very successful baptism in management.

Brian Williams
218 Posted 02/02/2020 at 15:57:15
Yep Steve another good result for us after Utd's goalless draw yesterday.
The league is certainly a weird one and one which is SO annoying because if we'd only not thrown away, or been denied, the nine points I reckon we could and should have gained we'd be sitting comfortably in fourth place.
If only, if only, should be our mantra!
Tony Abrahams
219 Posted 02/02/2020 at 16:01:54
It depends what you mean by best imo Steve?
Darren Hind
220 Posted 02/02/2020 at 16:14:21
Mike B

I don't think Mina is bad on the ball. He can pass alright

He can be a bit deliberate because his first touch isn't fantastic, but its better than most center backs in this league. He doesnt have the feet to get himself out of trouble when he is isolated, but if the get out of jail pass is on, He will invariably complete it.

I think he is an ok center half, who will improve, but he has the potential to be a match winner. A few more goals like the ones he got yesterday will see him doubly marked... That will simply leave space for others to exploit.

Ancelotti getting more out of these players than I expected. We may still be shite and Brands has to come good this summer and give him the tools, but he has these players "finding a way".

Not sure we can ask any more than that

Mike Gaynes
221 Posted 02/02/2020 at 16:24:36
Steve #191, Gana has had a fine season at PSG, although he has missed some games with groin and hamstring injuries. When healthy, he has started at both DM and CM, doing well in a more attacking role than he played for us and showing some excellent passing skills. He has been everything they wanted, and he says the move has changed his life.
Steve Ferns
222 Posted 02/02/2020 at 16:30:17
However, you want to quantify it Tony. Premier League sides beat the sides from the other European Leagues. All 4 qualified from the CL groups and all 3 from EL groups. This is undoubtedly the strongest league in Europe. The fact that the relegation sides take some many points off the top sides (save Liverpool) shows how strong this league is. Just because Everton have disappointed does not mean the League is shite, which is what so many want to peddle.
Simon Smith
223 Posted 02/02/2020 at 16:43:35
It's got to be the most exciting league: who would be able to accurately predict which teams will get relegated (Norwich excluding - although you never know) this year.

I'm going for

Norwich City
Aston Villa

Although I'd much rather West Ham go down than Villa.

Brian Cleveland
224 Posted 02/02/2020 at 16:58:32
Here in Colombia, Mina isn't rated that highly, although he is a hero for those goals in the World Cup, but more out of surprise than recognition.

To me he still seems tremendously clumsy, like he's not in full control of his limbs (strangely similar to Funes-Mori in this respect). His timing on attacking headers is frustratingly bad and he has missed a few sitters, which kind of confirms the general opinion of him here.

We became big news yesterday because of his 2 goals, so long may it continue...

ps: Holgate is the business.

Paul Tran
225 Posted 02/02/2020 at 17:01:46
The league is certainly as even-matched as I've seen it. I'd say that it's pretty inevitable, given the focus on fitness these days and the riches throughout the PL, that at some point it would become more level.

Fortunately we were sufficiently poor to sack Silva and Moshiri was sufficiently bold to appoint Ancelotti. Suddenly the chance for progression is back on again, despite the professional doom-mongers on here.

John P McFarlane
226 Posted 02/02/2020 at 17:16:47
Steve #222 As one of those who believes the Premier League is not what it could or should be, I can't accept your premise that because English clubs have progressed in the various European competitions it makes the Premier League the strongest league in Europe.

Only taking into account Everton as they're the team we all follow, how many good performances have we put in this season? Five maybe six? and I think that's being kind to them, yet we find ourselves with a chance of ending up in Europe.

Man U according to their own fans and many pundits are half-cooked and going backwards, Arsenal although unbeaten in seven matches since Arteta took over have had a very poor season, similar signs at Spurs. Chelsea and Leicester aren't as good as they would like to be although both are better than most of the rest of the league. Sheffield United are Everton circa 2004, whilst Wolves are good but nowhere near being a consistent force who are expected to win in any given fixture.

What Everton and Evertonians mustn't do is believe they are becoming a force because like all the teams I mentioned above there is huge scope for improvement and a lot of hard work to be done before we can say that.

The poor standard of the Premier League isn't something I wish to peddle, I'd much prefer to praise it if I had seen the evidence with my own eyes rather than rely on the progress of English sides in Europe. But in your defence there must be some pretty appalling teams and leagues in the rest of europe, if the Premier League is the best.

Conor McCourt
227 Posted 02/02/2020 at 17:26:21
Derek 217- He's doing ok, he's been a bit unlucky because he lost Aubemayang for three games which was a big loss as Lacazette has lost his scoring boots this season. He's won three out of his nine games and only lost one but two of those were in the FA cup.

Arsenal are like us in that they have a lot of problems and weaknesses in the squad but he's already made them tougher to play against and their fans have really taken to him. They are much better than they were under Llunberg and Emery.

Simon Smith
228 Posted 02/02/2020 at 17:29:38

I think you may have answered your own query with your last paragraph. I'm sure there are a lot of bang average teams on the continent. We probably look at foreign-sounding teams the same way as we look at foreign-sounding players and managers. they must be good because they sound like they should be.

Look at Lukaku and Chris Smalling in particular. Rave reviews about both of them in Italy, both struggled in the Premier League last season. We would never have accepted Chris Smalling as a transfer.

I also can't imagine Haaland would have scored 7 goals in his first 3 appearances in the Premier League. We might be the best league by default, because the rest of Europe is shit! Last season's European exploits surely prove this.

Steve Shave
229 Posted 02/02/2020 at 17:49:22
Gary 204 all great shouts! My preference for the RM position would be Buendia from Norwich, imagine him and Richy on the wings (I know you prefer him up top) we would have the hardest working wingers in the PL with those two. Buendia's stats this season are insane, he tracks back, tackles and creates lots of chances, a proper player. It would be amazing to have the clear out you suggested but probably unlikely, Walcott to MLS maybe? I don't know where else he would get paid £100k a week. Let's hope Sporting decide to take up the option to purchase Bolasie. I agree we will likely persevere with Iwobi. In my opinion we would be wise to keep Delph, he could save us from buying a back up LB for Digne he maybe has a role for us as a utility man, like what he did at City.
Steve Shave
230 Posted 02/02/2020 at 17:55:18
Thanks for the info, Mike Gaynes (221) — we should never have sold him. Crazy, we needed to build around him. Still, I'm happy for him, a top lad and pro.
Martin Mason
231 Posted 02/02/2020 at 18:00:52
Please be fair to Alex Iwobe and Moise Kean, the positions they play in and the defence dominated modern game mean that they are always going to look bad but their role is very important as they will make or score goals out of the blue. They can still look bad but if they improve their assists or goals by a small amount then it could be worth key points for us.
Martin Mason
232 Posted 02/02/2020 at 18:03:13
Simon, I would have loved Everton to buy Chris Smalling and Johnny Evans, both are superb and only EPL "fans" would see different.
Ray Smith
233 Posted 02/02/2020 at 18:05:19
Who is going to start against Palace in place of Delph?

A n other?

Simon Smith
234 Posted 02/02/2020 at 18:07:53
I would have loved Jonny Evans, but I wouldn’t have wanted Chris Smalling. I guess I’m only an “EPL Fan” then! Not quite sure what you mean by that to be honest.
Steve Ferns
235 Posted 02/02/2020 at 18:10:59
Hopefully Tom Davies, Ray, but, as Sigurdsson plays no matter what, it'll be Schneiderlin as Carlo will want balance.
Martin Mason
236 Posted 02/02/2020 at 18:28:46
Simon, my point was that in the EPL, fans tend to not recognise quality but be obsessed with mistakes and how these impact the irrational demand for success that we tend to have. Smalling is class and he is now being recognised for that after being put down by the least knowledgeable fan base in the world.
Mike Benjamin
237 Posted 02/02/2020 at 18:37:49
Palace more of a direct team so play Kean at CH and Holgate in MF.
Simon Smith
238 Posted 02/02/2020 at 18:48:53
So you know the knowledge of fans from every other country do you? What a statement to make. Are you including yourself in that?

I can think of some very knowledgeable fans on this site, I don’t include myself in that, but some of the articles and pieces written on here definitely show knowledge!

Mike Gaynes
239 Posted 02/02/2020 at 18:57:06
Steve #230, in modern football you can't keep a player who doesn't want to be there. He desperately wanted to play CL footy while he still could, and he'd been promised he could leave after one more season. He kept his word -- played superbly last season -- and we kept ours. I have no problem with that.
Paul Tran
240 Posted 02/02/2020 at 18:57:16
Simon, I'd say Martin has a point. Most of my match-going experiences these days are away games in the home end. I've heard moaning everywhere. I also look at other team's fanzines and it's pretty much the same.

When you get a league where 95% of the teams beat each other regularly, you'll notice plenty of fans thinking their team 'should' be doing better.

Tony Abrahams
241 Posted 02/02/2020 at 18:59:13
I’d say the EPL, is definitely the strongest physically, and it’s probably the reason why not that many people make the grade until their twenties, whilst playing in England.

Liverpool have murdered everyone, but I’d bet you Marco Silva, will be sitting somewhere now, saying his team could have been sitting right up the table like Leicester, if only Everton would have recruited better last summer?

Mike Gaynes
242 Posted 02/02/2020 at 19:13:01
Martin, I'm 100% with Simon on Smalling. His blunders under pressure had become legendary in the Prem, and Serie A is a much less intense environment. Sassuolo, Brescia, Genoa and Lecce are not exactly high-pressure opponents.

And, by the way, even in the midst of a good season Smalling is still doing some pretty bizarre stuff:


I'd rather have Holgate a thousand times over.

Joe McMahon
243 Posted 02/02/2020 at 19:29:15
Looking at the Watford 2nd goal yesterday, does anyone else think we need to purchase some proper competition for Pickford in the summer?
Kieran Kinsella
244 Posted 02/02/2020 at 19:37:51

I don’t think it’s necessarily lack of knowledge I think it’s perspective. Any time there’s a goal, fans and pundits acknowledge it then immediately identify someone to blame. There’s never a goal without someone being identified as a culprit. Here in the USA on the scorer being great in every sport. I seldom here “Le Bron scores cause that defender is shit.” Obviously you can argue either analysis has its merits but we English tend to the negative.

Don Alexander
245 Posted 02/02/2020 at 19:50:45
John P MacFarlane's post at 226 is bang on the money to me. To me way too many players are in the game just for money, and passion is disappearing at an alarming rate from players at all clubs.

Yesterday Wolves' Traore dislocated his shoulder, again, in the match and had it immediately re-set, again, without leaving the pitch. That's one example of the sort of passion I'm talking about. It's a rare beast.

Steve Ferns
246 Posted 02/02/2020 at 19:55:55
Mike, you’re bang on the money. There’s more mistakes in the premier league because it’s more intense. So people think that makes it inferior. The reality is that the premier league is stronger than any other league.

If you disagree which league is stronger?

Terry White
247 Posted 02/02/2020 at 19:57:26
Mike (#237), why would you want one of our forwards to play in defence?
Neil Copeland
248 Posted 02/02/2020 at 20:00:02
Joe #243, with you 100%. I still Jordan is a good keeper but he needs serious competition to raise his game. He is young though and like CHs keepers tend to get better with age.

Regarding Palace, I think CA may try starting with Tom Davies and Siggy as he continues with the midfield prove exercise I think he is on. He seems to have his mind settled regarding defence and attack. Personally I would like to see Mason H start in midfield but that really depends where CA considers MHs best position to be.

Peter Neilson
249 Posted 02/02/2020 at 20:02:00
After an initial couple of goals in his first few games Iwobi’s been terrible. 17 or so league games one goal and not a single assist in the league sums him up. It wouldn’t take much to be an improvement, at the moment it’s a low bar.
Mike Gaynes
250 Posted 02/02/2020 at 20:02:35
Joe #243, if you believe that a player in alone shooting from 15 yards is Pickford's fault...

Sorry, no. I don't believe we should lay out one cent on a keeper until we address our far more urgent problems in midfield and our lack of scoring depth. When you've put up 31 goals in 25 games and you're one of the slowest teams in the league, you don't spend your limited cash resources in the 6-yard box.

Time enough to address the keeper position, if necessary, after we get to the point where we can put a full side on the pitch that won't make us cringe at the sight.

Eric Paul
251 Posted 02/02/2020 at 20:03:27
Surely you can only judge how strong a league is by how their best sides compete against each other. By having the best sides in Europe in the prem means we have to improve to complete which makes all teams in the prem better
Nicholas Ryan
252 Posted 02/02/2020 at 20:04:30
Joe [243]. look at my post on the other match thread!
Danny O'Neill
253 Posted 02/02/2020 at 20:19:27
Martin Mason @ 236; good call out.

In my opinion, we have grown a generation of fans who look for the negative every time; where was the mistake? That could have been avoided. Every shot can be stopped if the keeper would have stood 2.57mm closer to his left and worn bigger gloves etc; that type of mentality.

We seem to have lost the ability to sometimes accept that it was a great attacking move or piece of play. Dare I say, maybe why Liverpool have progressed so much under Klopp. For the past few seasons many have questioned their midfield creativity and pre-Van Dijk / Allison defence. Did that bother them? No, they just kept attacking & scoring!!

I maintain my view that the Premier League is the best self-proclaimed league in the world, but in honesty outside of Liverpool & Man City, it is not competitive at all. I'm a lifelong city of Liverpool born Evertonian but these days, I follow the Bundesliga as much as I do the Premier League. I like to follow Schalke. ironically, so many similarities to Everton so I'm glutton for punishment!!!

Simon Smith
254 Posted 02/02/2020 at 20:52:26
I do love the difference of opinions and I respect everyone on here willing to share their opinion.

Going back to Steve’s post regarding the fact both European cup finals were played between English teams. Surely the whole point of European cups is to see who is the best that year and English teams won both of them!
This year may be completely different, but last year the premier league was proven to be the best in Europe!

Danny O'Neill
255 Posted 02/02/2020 at 21:07:50
Can't deny that Steve. But then they're cup competitions right? I mean Chelsea & Arsenal amongst the best in Europe? Even Tottenham? Sometimes the luck of the draw favours or a good performance in a round gets you through. I'm not dismissing the Premier League, I just don't buy it as being superior to the other leagues. And, it's been bad for English football. I haven't looked, but I'd been interested to see the percentage of English (or even British for that matter) players who started in both those finals. So it's not really an English league like the German one is for example, where there is much more home grown talent. And genuine home grown, not claimed because they came to the UK when 15 and have been in the country for 4 years.
Dave Williams
256 Posted 02/02/2020 at 21:23:56
Having watched it all again what struck me was the incredible raw pace of Kean for the winner. He outstripped Richi who had a head start on him and kept up with Theo. The sight of the three of them tearing up the pitch in the last minute like that was wonderful. I can see Moise really starting to “ get it” in the games since Carlo arrived. Marvellous stuff.
Eric Paul
257 Posted 02/02/2020 at 21:31:39
So the English Premier League is not English?
Conor McCourt
258 Posted 02/02/2020 at 21:33:53
Tony 241-I guarantee you are right about Silva and he only had to look at that game yesterday to see the man he wanted to replace Gueye running all over us in midfield. Brands will be under pressure to deliver this summer.

Steve 246- always people will come out with the same nonsense but no-one will be able to answer your question.

Jamie Crowley
259 Posted 02/02/2020 at 21:49:52
Someone above asked who the relegation teams will be?

West Ham

That's where I'd put my money.

And the Premier League is by far the most talented and most competitive in the world. I've watched a few Italian League games and they are so much softer, they don't press near as much, and the play seems to be more focused on unlocking teams rather than your high-octane EPL. There's a ton of technical talent on display in the other leagues, but it's not near as exciting for me. In fact, I can get bored sometimes watching.

Ray Smith
260 Posted 02/02/2020 at 21:55:26
Steve 235

Have to agree with you.

I don’t want Gomes rushed back for the lack of a quality midfielder.

Davies is regrettably work in progress, but media don’t give him a break!

We need one, two at the most quality signings in the summer to move to the next level.

Rome wasn’t built in a day.

However, we have never, never had an Ancelotti at the helm before!


Danny O'Neill
261 Posted 02/02/2020 at 22:13:59
Played in England Eric & participated by English (occasionally Welsh) teams and owned by the English FA. Quota of English players and dare I say fans it's a global brand. Don't get me wrong, that was and is the business model, I get it. But when we say English teams in terms of players on the pitch. they're not really are they?
Derek Knox
262 Posted 02/02/2020 at 22:15:43
Conor @ 258, I have to refute your defence of Silva not having the right recruitment in the Summer, being a reason for not being up there with Leicester and the like.

Okay he/we, have been more than unfortunate with injuries to players, but since his sacking it's strange that we have gained more points with the same group of remaining fit players coached by both Duncan Ferguson and Carlo Ancelotti.

Silva was his own worst enemy, he probably was a decent coach but a useless manager, he wouldn't deviate from what he believed was right (arrogance) he had zero leadership from the sidelines in a Match.

He continually deployed a system that clearly wasn't working, with the same combination of players, who seemed bewildered at times as to what system they were working in.

Besides, how do you know that Silva had little or no say in who was bought/brought in the Summer Transfer Window?

Paul Birmingham
263 Posted 02/02/2020 at 22:28:40
Yesterday’s win, and the manner of the win, history and time will prove, the significance.

It was going back, to long, by gone times. But since Carlos, arrived, the team has lifted and looked up.

Miles off the top teams, but very good signs, and with hard work and some fortune in the transfer market, this summer, I sense the second coming, based on the great days of the mid 1980s.

If EFC, is to move and be consistent, now is the time and it has got to happen.

The RS, are where they are, some of them, of late, have said, we’ve got a good manager.

I believe, and yesterday’s win was similar to the 1983/84 season.

The club is turning, and like an oil tanker, in the English Channel, it does take time.

See the body language of the players yesterday, and it showed.

Delph, for me is keen,but his game nous, is not good enough.

Over time he’ll be a squad player, but yesterday, he was foolish to fly in and invite trouble plus vpp passing for Watford’s first goal.Wreckless, and jeopardised a good recovery, in context of the game.

The start of the long haul back, but weekends are getting better.

EFC, will have to be clever, with FFP, etc, but we can make strides this last 4 months of this season,

In Carlo, we trust.

Christy Ring
264 Posted 02/02/2020 at 22:37:28
Derek @262 Agree, the problem with Silva, he didnt have a system, he chopped and changed in every game, players playing out of position, against Sheffield Utd, we ended up with 6 attacking players, Schneiderlin and Coleman were two of the players subbed, which left only Keane, Mina and Digne in defence, crazy.
Conor McCourt
265 Posted 02/02/2020 at 22:47:57
Derek I agree with you, I was merely pointing out that he was let down this summer and he will feel that not me. In fairness to Marco when he got the players he wanted the previous summer he had us in eighth.

With regards to the players he stated that Iwobi wasn't his choice and it was common knowledge that he wanted Doucoure and was clearly unhappy with this summers business.

Silva had lost the faith of the group but just because we have had a bounce under both Dunc and Carlo doesn't mean that we don't need to see decent work by Brands this summer.

Jay Harris
266 Posted 02/02/2020 at 22:57:06
Why is Silva still in the conversation.

CA has only been in for a few games and already has a better than 50% win rate (Silva about 34% I believe) and his team have achieved something Silva never could i.e. coming back from a losing position. IMO the man was a train wreck waiting to happen/

Mark Brennnan
267 Posted 03/02/2020 at 00:04:03
Unbelievable assist by Mosie Keane. What a player...…………..
Andrew Keatley
268 Posted 03/02/2020 at 00:38:44
Kean might have scuffed his shot and been fortunate with how it fell to Walcott to score, but the way he hunted down the ball from Masina and prodded the ball to Richarlison, then sprinted up the pitch in order to be in a position to be fortunate to scuff his shot means Moise Kean very much deserves the assist.

Delph was unlucky with both yellows, but the way he tackles is probably too agricultural for modern-day Premier League refs, encouraging poor decisions from the poorer refs, and Craig Pawson is such a ref.

Pickford continues to be too easily beaten, but the back four are getting stronger. Walcott slightly culpable for not noticing the advancing Masina for Watford’s first goal, but his 90th minute winner gets him off the hook.

John Pickles
269 Posted 03/02/2020 at 00:44:49
League statistics, gotta love 'em.

Everton are rubbish, just 10pts above second bottom.

Everton are great, 2 pts above Arsenal.

Everton are rubbish, 40 pts behind The Dark Side.

Everton are great, only 2 pts behind Man Ure and 4 behind Spurs.

Laurie Hartley
270 Posted 03/02/2020 at 03:35:26
Andrew & Mark 267 & 268 - regardless of your point of view whether it was a scuffed shot or a pass it’s was indeed great to see the three of them tearing up the pitch.

The other thing I have to say is that Walcott deserves great credit for the goal because it was no simple tap in. He had to change direction to get to the ball (once it had been passed or scuffed) and when he got to it he had to bury it because the goalie had got back well to make the target smaller.

Jerome Shields
271 Posted 03/02/2020 at 04:47:36
Mina concentration has improved, which has made a difference. Keane when he comes on is alot tighter in his play. I think they both know Anncelotti mind on concentration and tight play. .

The midfield except for Bernard and Davies/Iowbi who are trying , have not got Ancelottis message yet. . When Ancelotti sees a misplaced or poorly executed pass , which seems to happen too often in midfield, he has a way of looking away as if he is looking for a solution that is not there.

Denis Richardson
272 Posted 03/02/2020 at 07:34:41
Sorry, off topic but anyone notice that them across the park could be crowned champions on 14th March?

I know we’ve got a few games till then and we’re moving up slowly in the league but that’s just reared it’s head as a possibility after City’s loss to spurs yesterday.

Brent Stephens
273 Posted 03/02/2020 at 10:21:22
Dennis, I might misunderstand you, but the 14th March derby game has been switched to Monday 16th. Wouldn't want you to miss the "crowning"! But point taken. I'm not sure I could turn up to that game. I'm just hoping that by then we can continue to laud a turnaround under Carlo, and win over any doubters. All this talk of the amazing points difference - City only two seasons ago had a points difference of 19 from the runners-up??
Bill Gienapp
274 Posted 03/02/2020 at 10:21:30
I feel like a lot of the conclusions about this summer's transfer window are being revised.

We all agree we should have brought in another centreback - for purposes of depth, if nothing else - but the real issue was Silva not rating/trusting Holgate, to his ultimate detriment.

Likewise, we talked about the need for a more established striker, but our struggles to score seem to have had a lot more to do with Silva's rigid 4-2-3-1 system. Calvert-Lewin and Richarlison have produced 18 goals between them and we look a far different side with the two of them up top.

Silva might have felt hard-done by the summer recruitment, but he could have and should have done better with what he had.

Ian Jones
275 Posted 03/02/2020 at 10:46:39
Brent, all the talk of the points difference is likely down to it being a record 22 points with 13 games to go but they haven't won it yet..it's not over til it's over..plenty of time to cock it up..
Man Utd also won by 18 points late 2008/2009
John P McFarlane
276 Posted 03/02/2020 at 11:04:10
It's no use worrying about the other lot clinching the title at Goodison, they're going to become champions regardless, obviously the longer they wait for confirmation the better and if we can beat them to delay that moment then all the better.

A sobering thought but presently their current away points tally (34) alone would put them ahead of us in today's table. Everton currently have 33 points the same total as we had this time last season, and sat in ninth position the same as last year We have so much to improve upon and hopefully we are at the beginning of that process.

Denis Richardson
277 Posted 03/02/2020 at 20:06:26
Brent @273, thanks for that – so the derby's on the Monday? I didn't know it had been moved and was going to sort out travel next week!

Arse - the Monday may be a bugger for me to get there...

John @276 – they won the league weeks ago. However, don't think a few here could stomach having to give them a guard of honour and watch them lift the trophy at GP. I'd really feel sorry for Liverpool based Blues as that would be rubbed in for many many years!

Brent Stephens
278 Posted 03/02/2020 at 20:11:11
Denis. No problems. Hope you can sort it.
Brent Stephens
279 Posted 03/02/2020 at 20:23:22
Denis. Have a look at pl.ecal.com.

ECAL puts the fixture dates in your calendar and auto updates if there are any changes.

John Pierce
280 Posted 03/02/2020 at 21:25:47
Just checked in with a Blue room stats pack pod. Re Mina.

Lost 7/12 aerial duels, 0/3 in his own box. 🤯 Deffo cannot judge the flight of ball. Lad needs to tie a ball up in the rafters like Tommy Lawton and practice quick smart.

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