Dominic Calvert-Lewin returns to the starting XI after his goalscoring exploits off the bench on Saturday
Everton struggled to break down Watford in a dreadful first half of this Carabao Cup game, but finally broke through thanks to Holgate, with Richarlison sealing it in the last minute.
Silva made five changes but still kept Sigurdsson on the bench with Schneiderlin not part of the squad.
Watford kicked off on a crisp clear night under the Goodison lights and Coleman won a corner inside the first minute. Digne crossed it in after taking it short and Gomes set up a weak and poorly directed header for Calvert-Lewin.
Everton failed to do much with a free-kick after Calvert-Lewin was hauled down. The move ended up with Watford attacking and winning a corner themselves but the ref blew up for a push on an Everton defender.
Moise Kean went on a great run down the right but could not get beyond his man and drove his shot into the Watford defender. Everton were then back defending, somewhat nervously. Everton tried the crossfield diagonal through Delph, spoilt by Richarlison wandering offside.
The pace of the game was moderate at best, with a lot of conservative passing and very little meaningful forward play, neither side really looking that impressive.
Richarlison made a brilliant run from deep in the Everton half, setting up Calvert-Lewin by playing the ball behind rather than in front of his Everton colleague... dreadful.
Watford responded by putting together a pretty threatening move and cross by Pereyra that was screwed wide. Mariappa went in strongly from behind on Iwobi, causing some anger, but no card from the ref.
The pace of the game, if possible, dropped even further, as both sides were effectively cancelling each other out, and a complete absence of any real cup-tie intensity, the play spoilt repeatedly by poor passing and a lack of drive or deire.
Holgate resorted to a long ball that Calvert-Lewin controlled well enough but simply did nothing useful with. Everton at least played a few passes in the Watford half before dropping back yet again, putting the lie to Silva's hollow promise that Everton would show the same desire as in the last two cup games.
Coleman had his pocket picked and it needed Mina to stop Chalobah, Everton continuing to look less than confident at the back and uninspiring going forward. Iwobi dug out a cross but Gomes in the Watford goal was more than equal to it.
Kean tried to dribble past three men and was stopped before he could shoot. Quina went down and was taken off, Everton playing on before Doucouré could get on, while Mina pulled up and started to hobble.
A low ball in was aimed for Calvert-Lewin but it was intercepted for a corner, Mina trying for it and then he finally went to ground and Michael Keane was readied to replace him.
Richarlison was nudged and collapsed in front of the Watford fans, denied any foul, much to the amusement of the 300 Watford fans who had made the effort to attend. Iwobi was quick onto a loose ball but could not curl it past Gomes.
Richarlison did a lot better to work his way past three Watford players but Iwobi lost the ball too easily and a very disappointing half finally came to an end. Poor fayre.
Moise Kean was hauled off at half-time, with Walcott on to presumably provide more end-product? Unlikely. It certainly had no effect on the pedestrian pace of proceedings from the restart. Iwobi tried to play in Walcott but Gomes was alert to the danger. At least it showed a little more of that missing 'desire'.
Doucoure had a good run down the middle but Watford, thankfully, were as ineffective as their illustrious hosts when it comes to threatening goal. At the other end, a ball swung in just bounced off Keane and out for a goal-kick.
Digne got the chance for a long throw that Gomes stepped out to grasp. Richarlison had a chance to cross but overhit it horribly. At the other end, a fantastic strike by Gray pulled a fantastic stop out of Pickford. The corner was defended well enough.
The tempo and atmosphere built up a little but Watford then broke and Pickford stopped them. Suddenly, it was end-to-end full of life. Walcott put in a low cross that deserved conversion but it didn't happen.
Prödl gave away a needless free-kick, pushing Digne over, who delivered a brilliant cross on the noggin of Keane with the goal at his mercy... and he heads it straight at Gomes. Dear god... More end-to-end stuff gave some hope that the intensity was increasing but Digne shot at goal instead of crossing and Gomes again gathered easily.
Much better penetration form Richarlison and a deep pullback saw Gomes's shot blocked behind Gomes by a defender and Watford galloped away. At the other end, the ball fell to Iwobi from Calvert-Lewin and a fantastic snapshot beat Gomes all hands down only to smack the top of the post!
The familiar face of Gerard Deulofeu came on in place of Pereyra. Gomes was fouled by Doucouré, who was carded. A set-piece chance for Digne, clipped off the top of the wall and the top of the crossbar! The corner was short, Walcott getting in a weak header. Richarlison tried to beat two men and failed, letting Watford advance and Gray handballed, halting the threat.
Everton were finally building much-need momentum but the ball seemingly would not go in... until it finally did! Mason Holgate heading in from point-blank range off a beautiful cross from Walcott. It had been coming...
Watford finally came out of their shell and looked to push the Blues back. Sensing more goals, Silva switched Calvert-Lewin for Tosun for the last 10 minutes. Walcott tried to skip through but was caught by Cathcart as Will Hughes went down after trying to foul Delph and needed treatment.
Everton finally took the free-kick, Digne going for the near post but not clever enough by far, his shot weak and off-target. It really became a question of game management as the minutes ticked by without too much of a threat from the Hornets.
But Everton of course put themselves under pressure in the final minutes, until Richarlison broke smartly and would not be denied a fine fish to seal the win in the last minute of added time.
Scorer: Holgate (73'), Richarlison (90+3')
Everton: Pickford, Coleman, Holgate, Mina (41' Keane), Digne, Gomes, Delph, Kean (46' Walcott), Iwobi, Richarlison, Calvert-Lewin (80' Tosun).
Subs: Lössl, Sigurdsson, Sidibe, Davies.
Watford: Gomes, Foulquier, Mariappa [Y:90'], Prödl (65' Kabasele), Cathcart, Femenía, Hughes, Chalobah, Quina (39' Doucouré [Y:68']), Gray, Pereyra (67' Deulofeu).
Subs not Used: Janmaat, Masina, Bachmann, Dalby.
Refereee: Simon Hooper
Reader Comments (363)
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1 Posted 29/10/2019 at 18:22:04
2 Posted 29/10/2019 at 18:44:28
Arena Sport 4
beIN Sport 1
Eleven Sport 5
If you're in the USA, it's live on ESPN+ subscription service.
3 Posted 29/10/2019 at 18:50:27
Coleman Holgate Mina Digné
Gomes Iwobi Delph
Kean Calvert-Lewin Richarlison
Just have to perform now. COYB
4 Posted 29/10/2019 at 18:50:41
Amazing how the Premier League has destroyed VAR. I mean it seems to work fine in MLS so why didnt they use that model and let the game referee have the final say?
Im all for VAR if done correctly. Remember the Sterling cross that was over the line?
5 Posted 29/10/2019 at 18:51:35
7 Posted 29/10/2019 at 18:58:09
Steve, I almost had the line-up, but I definitely would have kept Sidibe over Coleman, and I would not be risking further injury to Mina, as much as I don't rate Keane.
Also praying that Kean playing wide right is actually Kean playing inside striker, because dribbling isn't what he should be doing.
8 Posted 29/10/2019 at 18:59:30
9 Posted 29/10/2019 at 18:59:43
10 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:00:44
Calvert-Lewin with 5 goals in his last 7 games (360 minutes – he has started or finished every game) was a shoo-in at centre-forward.
I'm disappointed Davies has quickly been cut from the team again for the returning Delph.
A win, nothing less, is acceptable. For all of us: the team, the manager and not least the fans.
11 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:01:06
But I'll take it, a pretty solid XI.
12 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:02:02
Iwobi can't play deep. He's not got the game for it. He's an offensive player only. He might get a foot in but he can't play box to box, like you need in a 4-4-2, even from a wide midfield position.
Watford are struggling and, if we come out flying, we could win it in the first 30 minutes.
13 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:02:16
14 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:03:49
15 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:04:44
16 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:05:06
Holgate deserves another game in place of Keane. Best of all, it looks like he has given Iwobi another chance in the middle, to prove he can perform like he did against West Ham. Looking forward to seeing Kean again and Calvert-Lewin deserves to start with his recent run of goals.
17 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:06:45
Good news is that Watford seems to not care because that's not a great lineup they're starting out with.
18 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:07:36
19 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:09:28
20 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:09:53
Coleman Holgate Mina Digné
Kean Iwobi Richarlison
21 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:13:49
22 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:14:19
He says Everton will be “assertive and purposeful” tonight and play with “the speed we showed against West Ham”.
He says a lot of nice things about the fans and the way weve supported the team this season and that Everton will do “all we can on the pitch to win and send you home tonight proud of Everton”.
23 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:14:53
24 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:15:07
If all goes badly tonight then that is further evidence of Silva's inability to coach and to motivate. Let's all cross our fingers and try and be positive.
25 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:25:24
26 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:30:35
27 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:31:35
28 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:31:43
The difference in his performance prior to Bernard's injury and after was night and day.
The only worry for me is I would like to see Kean and DCL in a partnership so if he goes with the predicted shape I'm not sure it will suit Kean who is still trying to find his feet hope I'm wrong though.
29 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:33:18
30 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:33:52
31 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:33:52
Watford arent struggling as much as we think.
They are unbeaten in their last 3 games which is more than you can say for us.
I think they will park the bus and look for breakaways using Delofeus speed against a very sluggish Seamus and Michael Keane.
I dont believe Silva has given this a seconds thought and hope that with Richy Kean and DCL we will have enough firepower to put them down.
Very disappointed Tom Davies didnt continue as he was much better than Gomes last game.
32 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:34:14
Other than that, reasonable selection.
33 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:34:30
34 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:36:31
Anyway. Time to brace the cold and take my seat. Enjoy the game lads.
35 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:37:14
36 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:40:38
37 Posted 29/10/2019 at 19:43:06
38 Posted 29/10/2019 at 20:24:39
40 Posted 29/10/2019 at 20:29:25
41 Posted 29/10/2019 at 20:35:32
42 Posted 29/10/2019 at 20:37:17
43 Posted 29/10/2019 at 20:41:28
44 Posted 29/10/2019 at 20:42:45
46 Posted 29/10/2019 at 20:45:21
47 Posted 29/10/2019 at 20:49:16
48 Posted 29/10/2019 at 20:54:54
Extremely poor fare.
Was it really necessary to play Mina tonight? Let's hope the substitution is a precautionary one, rather than seeing him out for an even longer stretch. He has been our best defender tonight.
Digne doing okay. Seamus slack. Delph just a water carrier. Gomes... once again, just not living up to the hype some give him on here. That was a really nasty foul on Quina, definitely leaving his boot high and catching him on the knee. Gomes is a really nasty sly bugger at times. He is not clever at committing a 'disguised' foul when a player goes past him.
Iwobi and Kean the bright spots. Richarlison and Calvert-Lewin largely anonymous.
It looks a surprisingly large crowd for a Tuesday night game in the League Cup. You can hear that the crowd wanted to get behind the team at the start, but the team has not given them anything to lift them.
You can't fool a Goodison crowd, as shown by the half-time boos.
49 Posted 29/10/2019 at 20:57:00
Play a young striker out of position and then make him the fall guy at half time.
Win, lose or draw, this snake oil salesman needs to go.
50 Posted 29/10/2019 at 20:59:37
51 Posted 29/10/2019 at 21:39:12
Tony Marsh, lets bring back your beloved "fireman Sam". By fuck, you championed him or do you think no one saw your posts. My God that live forum is vile.
52 Posted 29/10/2019 at 21:45:51
53 Posted 29/10/2019 at 21:48:23
54 Posted 29/10/2019 at 21:49:01
Shite game. We looked poor and there was few positives but into the last eight and thats all that matters.
Crowd was very tetchy. It would have gone off if they scored. Davies needs to come in on Sunday.
Moise Keans family has the VIP box today. He must have been gutted. Silva will need to get his head up fast. This is a nightmare move for the highly touted striker who is really struggling and his position was all too deep and he didnt look like he knew what he was doing. Should have been a 433.
55 Posted 29/10/2019 at 21:49:04
Fucking disgrace. Fans from our history must be turning in their graves
56 Posted 29/10/2019 at 21:53:31
57 Posted 29/10/2019 at 21:53:58
Exactly what I thought re Moise Keane.
As for Mina reminds me sooo mutch of Martinez at that derby where suddenly all the good injured players came on and we got slaughtered.
This fucker is Martinez MK2..hasnt anyone got it yet ??
58 Posted 29/10/2019 at 21:55:27
Credit to Silva for the change he made at halftime. It just wasn't working with Kean on the right and Walcott made a difference.
We will need a bit of luck in the draw as we are obviously still a long way off being good enough to beat the top teams. Oxford or Colchester would be great but I think we all know that wont happen
59 Posted 29/10/2019 at 21:56:34
You are quite right Andy. Wanting your own team to lose is not a good thing. It wouldnt happen if we had higher standards though. The board should be looking at that game and telling Silva it still isnt good enough. Weve had a few really shitty wins this year that really shouldnt be banked as credits for Silva.
60 Posted 29/10/2019 at 21:56:57
61 Posted 29/10/2019 at 21:59:35
62 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:00:43
Good teams are good because they don't concede and when they do they believe it to be a blip. Bad teams are fearful and concede because they don't expect anything else.
We need two or three clean sheets and the confidence we saw towards the end of last season will return. The only problem there is that we don't have Gana and Zouma stopping the opposition.
Who's to blame? Silva, Brands or Moshiri?
Anyone says Bill go and have a nap.
63 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:09:18
64 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:10:09
Talk about spead a little happiness!
65 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:11:11
Glad we won but jeez, we are way off form.
66 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:13:57
Im off for a nap.
67 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:15:36
Keep a clean sheet on Sunday and we are in business
68 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:15:57
69 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:16:44
70 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:17:02
There was no service to the front three at all and so they fed of scraps. Walcott coming on for Kean I found strange but it did speed things up, I just dont know what Kean has to do, particularly with no service.
The ball is still being played side to side, at no pace, so not beating anybody. Finally it makes its way back to Pickford for the boot up field.
Colemans attacking game appears non existent and so not helping on that side, he did make one or two good tackles near the end but I think his time is up. Holgate did really well taking the goal and his play was generally decent.
I do worry though at Silva playing an unfit Mina as there is a good chance he will miss the Spurs game now. That is poor management.
71 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:18:07
You picked a bad day for it. Sometimes the forum is alright, quite funny actually and insightful. Today though Stewart especially was on this "I want us to lose kick" and some others sympathized. Totally blew my mind. But there are some (usually more so than today) more reasonable folks that frequent the ToffeeWeb version of the local.
72 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:22:51
Can anyone explain what the tactics were in this game particularly first half.
It just seems to me that 11 total strangers meet up and go out to play a game.
It was more like musical chairs or pass the parcel than footy.
73 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:23:19
I've been a big critic of Walcott but tonight he was lively and a big improvement on Kean. Kean is still young and finding his feet, we need to be patient with him and hopefully he'll come good. Definitely think he'd be better played up top than on the wing.
Mina was showing all his quality in the first half...such a shame he got injured. The defending across the full back line throughout was really solid with Keane slotting in seamlessly.
Although Gomes and Delph did fairly well in the middle of the park I thought we missed Davies. DCL up top did okay at times but maybe needed to get more involved. And at the other end Pickford did well with the very few shots he had to deal with.
All in all a fairly sound and positive performance. Very important to keep the attitude right for Sunday against a spurs team that are there for the taking.
74 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:23:22
I agree with you in that Tom should come back in on Sunday.
I was made up for Mason with his first goal for the club.
75 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:24:57
Delighted for both our goalscorers. In particular we need Richarlison scoring again.
But you can't gild a pig. The football wasn't great. And that was against the team winless, at the bottom of the league, with 8 changes and most of their better players not appearing.
Keane did well when he came on. Gomes improved, but then again, he had set an extremely low bar with his performance in the first half.
Theo was OK too, but you have to feel for Kean, with how he is being handled and the state of the team he has joined. He must be wondering what the hell he has got himself into.
The pick of our lot today was Iwobi, the one consistent creative spark across the 90 minutes. His retention of the ball on the right and the way he created space to get a cross in which was cleared for Walcott to pick up and return it for Holgate's opener, was excellent by Iwobi.
The team's confidence still looks very fragile, but be it on the road or at home, they cannot say the crowd is not with them.
Booed off at half-time, still not playing well, there was plenty of racous support from the terraces and an eruption of joy at the two goals.
Silva and the team now has a tiny foothold on which to build.
Instead of looking at it as 5 defeats in 6 before today, look at it as 2 wins in 3.
Still a lot, LOT better required from all.
But the last 8 in one of the two cup competitions is at least something to buoy some, if not all.
PS to Andy @ 51. I never ever go near the live forum during the match. I might scan it quickly before KO, searching for http to find any good links to watch the match. But to read and write and post whilst the game is on? Especially with the knee-jerk vitriol that spews forth?
Nah! Not for me. It is not credible to me, unless posters have chameleon-like swivelling eyeballs, that anyone - anyone at all - can genuinely be fully attentive to the live action unfolding in the game whilst reading, writing and posting simultaneously.
76 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:26:00
77 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:26:25
Sometimes it must be depressing having to write about such a game. I live in hope that in the not too distant future an Everton display will be described as, "stupendous, amazing or outstanding". Even better "table topping". We have waited thirty years for that.
However no matter how bad things get I would never want us to lose just to see the manager fired. When wins are as infrequent as they are this season I can only feel relieved when we actually win. Then I can relax for a few days much to the delight of my long suffering wife who has accurately described my illness as "Evertonitis".
The symptoms are flushing of the face, shortness of breath, accute anxiety and an inability to talk to other humans about anything else other than Everton The only known cure is a win and even that only lasts for a few days.It is a seasonal disease but it can be contagious and spread to offspring. They are NEVER grateful for passing down such a malady.
So today is great because we defeated the mighty Watford even though the game was turgid.
78 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:26:45
79 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:28:17
80 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:29:47
Regarding Kean, when I saw him for Juve, his goals either seemed to come from him having an extended run e.g. counter attack or cleaning up lose balls in the box. The way we play, slowly from the back, he doesn't have that kind of space to run into. I remember in Koeman's first year, Pickford would sometimes launch these quick counters with a throw or kick down down the wing to Lukaku who scored some similar goals. I don't know why that has disappeared from our Arsenal. The second type of goals e.g. mopping up, I think are lacking because all too often we lose the first ball from poor corners. If we had better delivery into the box, got the header back across goal or chested it down, I think Kean would find some joy. I think the way we are playing is not helping him any and as time goes on obviously that affects his confidence.
81 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:31:18
Let's face it, if you're under 21 years old, Everton is not where you want to be, and Silva is not who you want to play for.
Or what Kieran @80 wrote. Well said, mate. I watched all his Juve games too at the end of last year.
82 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:38:02
83 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:38:58
I remember '81-'83 under Howard and Colin. The football was terrible, no confidence and we had a youngster called Ratcliffe getting dogs abuse playing at left back. The future looked bleak. How were we ever going to get back to the heady heights of Gordon Lee's teams. Howard stuck by his plan, kept tinkering up front and brought a couple more uninspiring characters into the fold. A certain Andy Gray arrived along with Derek Mountfield and Paul Bracewell. I don't quite recall who came first but all three contributed massively.
We are in a totally different era I know but it only takes one or two to transform the rest of the squad from deadbeats to superstars.
Howard was no Pep or Klopp. He spoke well but didn't give the impression that we were going to see the greatest period of success in our history.
Silva might not be the answer but there is a transfer window soon.
A cheap one, a seasoned one (to play up front) (Get Vardy) and a cultured one (for midfield) please Santa.
84 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:41:49
Kean keeps doing this annoying trick whereby he tries to roll the defender and race onto the ball which he sends 15 yards ahead. But every single time it's easily collected by another defender. Maybe it was because Watford set up with 8 men behind the ball. They kept their shape well and looked better drilled and more solid than last time I watched them. Clearly the new old manager is starting to make an impact.
When he took the handbrake off at the end and there was a grandstand finish, they looked quite dangerous through Deulofeu. I thought we did defend well, with Gomes and Delph helping the full backs and we got numbers back and got forward quickly. We have a real issue against teams who deny us space and block the passing lanes. Especially when we just move the ball so slowly. Walcott came on and started providing an outlet and some pace and getting at the full back and that made a difference.
Delph and Gomes are too similar. Both want to sit deep and spray the ball. Neither are quick. I think Davies should play. I like Gomes so I'd drop Delph. But only if Gomes plays like he did against West Ham, when we were close to being stupendous John Boon!
I thought the new system at corners looked sound. Richarlison was good defensively and headed everything away on the right of that zonal 3. Mina looked to have a nasty knock as he was straight off. I hope he wasn't risked but it looked like he jarred his right knee. I'm not sure which one was injured but I think it was his right leg he was holding last time too.
As for the crowd being good. Most of us have already paid for our tickets, so it's not as if the crowd dips much with the cup matches. Loads simply give the tickets to friends or family if they cannot be arsed. But also don't forget, there's maybe 10 or 15 more games of Goodison under the lights on a week night, unless we get Euro football back soon.
85 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:48:32
If the cash isn't there, I'd flog Pickford, sign someone like Butland and use the rest of the cash to sign the centre-back. No idea how Butland is doing last 18 months, which is why I said someone like him, as he was decent, is in the second flight, and is surely available for a decent fee.
86 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:49:55
I agree with those lamenting the peculiar deployment and withdrawal of Kean and I also share the concern that Mina may have been played when unfit.
If we play like that on Sunday we will lose quite heavily.
87 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:50:52
Did you know his 6 goals for Juve last year came from only 10 shots on target? He's a quintessential striker (except he's not really a header guy), and thus is of no use in Silva's system.
88 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:51:02
The good teams,sorry, the teams with good players, that are relegated,never look like they are doomed. But it sneaks up. Silva can and will do it. He is uninspired and gormless.
89 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:51:34
90 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:53:35
So pleased to get a win regardless of how we played - helped my mood tremendously.
91 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:55:36
He played out wide ONCE for Juve, and it was to the left. One game at 2nd striker, and 11 at striker. He has great passing abilities (in case no one caught that brilliant touch thread to Coleman racing down the side early in the first half), and equally poor dribbling abilities. What's being asked of him is just utterly inane.
92 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:59:02
I agree with you about Tom Davies and feel we should have played him tonight alongside his buddies Holgate and DCL. I think he also gets on well with Iwobi.
Its a toss up between Delph and Gomes as Gomes gets caught on the ball too often and doesnt have the pace to get back or gives silly fouls away.
I knew Watford woud park the bus and its an Achilles heel of ours that we don't seem to know how to deal with it.
We looked like lost souls in the first half and I could work out what our tactics were supposed to be.
I know you rate him but I feel we should be doing a lot better than Silva.
93 Posted 29/10/2019 at 22:59:36
Ive always been a fan of Holgate. Not the finished article but a good player. Hope he continues in this vein
94 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:02:36
Kean and Richarlison did not help matters as they had no real movement, and we seemed to stand still. One of my pet peeves is seeing the football come to a stop when we are in attack (main culprit our woefully inadequate captain), so the opposition can just recover perfect shape. We then see those who did make runs, turn and stop and get back on side and stand still. And with no movement the ball can only go sideways.
Walcott came on and made a difference as he was getting about and making more incisive runs. I got back in my seat for the second half, much earlier than normal. I saw Walcott finish what looked like an intensive warmup and then he stood for a good 2 minutes looking at a tablet (iPad) and discussing matters with Boa Morte. Having seen Kean's brother, I hoped it was not him being hooked, but if your job is on the line, then you have no room for sentiment.
Watford's game plan was obvious. Get 8 men behind the ball and keep a clean sheet. Wait for the crowd to become frustrated and then try to win it late on. The longer the game went on the more frustrated the crowd got. Moans and groans. No boos, despite what someone said above. Especially at half time. Not in the Park End anyway. The only boos was booze, as a few of the main hecklers in the Park End seemed to have been on the lash all day long and they were getting a bit of stick.
So on to Spurs. A different proposition. A team we can sit back and defend against and try to hit on the break, using our pace against them. No Rose as he is suspended. Spurs are not much better than us right now and clearly have their own issues. I'd play Walcott for sure. Davies' energy in the middle is a must. I'd hope Silva can pick Kean up and guarantee him some minutes as an impact sub, if Spurs are chasing the game, he will find lots of space to attack and if Gomes can wake up and play like he did against West Ham, then Kean could have his goal to get him up and running, as that Spurs defence will not like his pace and power.
95 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:03:00
I was one of the few who was not keen on signing Gomes. Hes not a bad player but given how many pedestrian players we already have we really needed a box to box player with some more pace and dynamism. Someone like Doucore (not that hes been good this season).
Iwobi helps. As does Davies to a degree but any two from Gomes, Schneiderlin and Delph just lack the mobility and zip to cover and press quick enough to implement Silvas plan. You can get away with one slow coach but not two (or three when Siggy plays at 10!).
96 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:05:19
97 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:05:22
98 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:09:29
99 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:09:35
Hope youre right about Tottenham, Steve, but I confess Im worried.
100 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:10:16
It was a strange game which, had Everton read the script, could have been done and dusted by halftime. The script being that Watford had no desire to win that game and looked as though they'd gladly settle for a low scoring defeat. We were too stupid to realise that and for some reason didn't want to play how we'd played in our last home game but rather opted for listless, slow, drab football.
Few plus points but one was Holgate who looks like he's learned a lot and toughened up after his spell in the Championship. Lad deserved a goal after a good performance. Mina was playing really well too until he had to go off.
Through to the quartes though and who knows what'll happen.
101 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:12:01
He could perform the role at least as well as Schneiderlin who has been given infinite opportunities.
Most people agree we dont need two deep midfielders anyway so why not get another goal threat on the pitch in an area which will mitigate the low block??
102 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:12:17
103 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:12:31
As I posted earlier. We had a young goalie back in the early 80's (Neville) a lad from Barrow and young Rats.
Three of our greatest players as it turned out.
Too many on here would see Pickford on his way. I see a young man who will become a fantastic servant to the club. He needs time, coaching and a solid back four to do it.
How many shots do Allisson or Ederson face? Pickford deals with more shots in a match than they do combined in a month.
What we lack right now is a method, a style, a way of getting the job done no matter who we play. We have immensely talented players who will only shine when as a team/squad we find that way.
It is Marco Silva's and Marcel Brand's responsibility to find it.
I do not as many on here do think sacking the manager (again) is the answer. Koeman needed to go. Martinez needed to go.
Moyes is the past. Mourinho would be trouble and the waiter (fat spanish) will not come.
We are in a better place (squad) than we were under Martinez or Koeman.
We will not go down. We will probably not win or come close to winning a trophy this season. What we will do is get stronger and wiser as a group as the season progresses. We still need more to come in and more to go.
104 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:13:48
However, the aim of the evening was achieved, a place in the quarter finals.
We will need to improve dramatically at the weekend, Spurs were very dangerous on the break against the rs.
105 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:14:45
Like watching paint dry at times but two goals, two shots off the woodwork, a shot off the line and Keanes poor header from five yards out, all in the space of 45 minutes, must surely contradict my thoughts?
Im also bemused that scoring goals doesnt galvanise us, because I couldnt believe how flat we went once wed scored, when surely it should be the opposite what happens?
Moaning bastards some of us, but listening to some of the crowd talking, if your not moaning, then you must at least be pessimistic, in a game were confidence is key!
106 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:17:50
We get 15 minutes of decent football every two games. Its atrocious.
Get rid of this clown before he does some real damage and don't let Moshiri appoint anyone else.
107 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:20:10
108 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:20:54
109 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:22:27
I hope we loan him out in January to a contending team on the continent where he'll be used properly. Maybe he can come back when we have a manager with a clue, but it's clear right now he's being wasted. And worse, having his confidence crushed along the way.
110 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:28:24
What a contrast from the awful first half.
Incidentally, I was watching a far Eastern feed on hesgoal but of very good quality and the effects mikes definately picked-up a bit of booing at halftime. The Talkshite reporter also confirmed this.
The second half was much better and we deserved the win. Mason Holgate was the best player on the park(imo).
I popped onto the live forum and was disgusted at Stuart Lowe's hopes for a defeat. Tony Marsh was towing a similar line but the comments were almost Kopite in their crassness.
I'm not a Silva fan but if he can get some results and avoid a crisis then good luck to him. I would never want us to lose.
111 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:31:27
112 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:31:45
Alisson of course was injured from Aug 17 through Oct 5, so he definitely did not have as many saves in a month. Ederson on the other hand, has 27 saves this year, to go with 5 clean sheets and 9 goals allowed.
Our boy has 24 saves through the same 10 matchdays, with 3 clean sheets and 16 goals allowed. May want to rethink your stance as it seems very homer-ish. Pickford can make a brilliant stop at any given time, but he's not a very good keeper for 90 minutes. IMO of course.
113 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:36:29
On a semi-related note, Coleman was absolutely wretched tonight.
114 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:36:37
Talk about paralysis by analysis.
115 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:38:03
Delph is not the answer. I would like to see Gomes and Sigurdsson in midfield to aid the forwards making runs.
116 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:38:26
I tuned into a live stream with NO match commentary, just the effect mics picking up the crowd. It was so clear I could pick up individual comments reacting to in-game plays.
Judging by the comments I heard (supporters on other sides of the ground wouldn't have had such a close up look to the plays commented on) I'm guessing that primarily the most prominent effect mics were on the Bullens Road side.
In the first half it was easy to also hear the negative reaction from the Watford fans when Richarlison got on the ball; the inevitable mocking chant towards Silva of 'You're getting sacked in the morning' and...the very, VERY clear booing of Everton at half-time and one or two choice expletives in thick Scouse accents.
I would be delighted if I could watch every match thus, with just the crowd effects and no commentary.
117 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:40:13
118 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:40:25
Main thing, get those two strikers who played as wingers further forwards and much narrower, and allow them to come deep for the ball. As get them running from outside to in, and inside to out, so as to pull the defence apart and create spaces for diagonal passes and allow them to use their pace to get through. Our forward line was too static, too easily makred and we need the fluidity and flexibility of a 433, and with those three forwards, we have the personnel to play it. Sure, they aren't as good as the top 2's forward lines, but there's a lot of potential there and Calvert_Lewin and Richarlison have proven themselves to an extent over the last 18 months, so why not give them a chance to show that they can do it. Especially when Sigurdsson does not play and they can be so narrow without worrying about taking up his positions.
119 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:42:40
Mark, if Kean was loaned out to a Championship club, he'd be requesting a transfer. You must think the lad is special if you saw him last season. I think the Premier League does not suit him as a central 9. But if he plays off Calvert-Lewin as an inside forward, then I think he will find his feet and show us why he is special.
120 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:45:35
We were far better than Watford.
Game management was significantly
better than weve seen this season to date. We shut it down as a contest after Masons goal.
Despite the “Marco Out” tone on here of late, there was no sense of that from the crowd at Goodison. This pleases me.
121 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:53:29
You're right, I really do think he's special, I watched all of Juve's matches with him last year, and then what I could of Italy (I am a paesano after all).
My opinion could completely change depending on our next manager, but given our current state, he shouldn't be playing here. Completely guts me because I love the kid.
122 Posted 29/10/2019 at 23:54:34
123 Posted 29/10/2019 at 00:00:24
However, Silva Out.
124 Posted 29/10/2019 at 00:01:26
125 Posted 30/10/2019 at 00:04:52
126 Posted 30/10/2019 at 00:10:25
127 Posted 30/10/2019 at 00:13:57
128 Posted 30/10/2019 at 00:30:55
129 Posted 30/10/2019 at 00:36:41
130 Posted 30/10/2019 at 00:36:45
My God that live forum is vile.
It can be. But I do love it. There's a lot of knee jerk, emotional comments. Don't judge anyone by what they say on the Live Forum. It's all done in the heat of the moment.
The Live Forum is easily my favorite feature of TW. By a country mile.
131 Posted 30/10/2019 at 00:39:53
I would of played him in the DM role personally he has a certain bite and swagger to his game and can also cover. Hes a far far better player than most give him credit for.
132 Posted 30/10/2019 at 00:44:52
Moise Kean. A 19 year old kid. Nineteen. Stew on that for just a second.. . 19
He made his Everton career start in lively fashion, snapping off two good attempts on goal that I remember. He looked damn good, full of energy, and ready to take on the world and put Everton on his back and carry them forward.
Then he was benched. And he's primarily made appearances off the bench, only when trailing, and usually when we're playing absolute shit. Not the best way to bring a kid into Premier League life.
And today, he was started not up top, but out wide. Inside of a flailing team by all accounts. I couldn't watch as I was on the road for business. But I listened to the second half, and the announcers could only rip the living shit out of our performance in the first half. They said it was dire, and nothing I've read would contradict that.
So here's Moise, played out of position (ish), inside another abject effort and performance by his teammates, and Silva yanks him.
How in the holy hell is this kid ever supposed to succeed? Silva is doing a terrible, terrible job with this kid. Whether he's good enough or not isn't the question (I think he will be, time will tell). How do you help a 19 year old succeed doing the above?
It's completely counter-intuitive, and it's ruining our young prospect.
We won. I'm thrilled with that. But Marco has to - has to - change his approach with our young, talented prospect and player.
It's gawd-awful the way he's handling him.
133 Posted 30/10/2019 at 00:55:14
I agree 100%, I said pretty much the same in Live Forum noting it is HE not Zaha who should be firing his agent, I was told by a certain regular on ToffeeWeb that he is not good enough for PL and Juve done us over ( same poster admitted to knowing nothing of his Juve days) and then preceeded to tell ME that I wouldnt know a decent player if he ran throw my living room or some other clownish analogy, I noted he was talkin out of his beHIND !!
Point is if we can afford all this goodwill and time to DCL surely this lad who drove Juves tittle charge last year deserves better (not like were scoring for fun)
Silva is out of his debt is in my opinion damaged goods and although I would love for him to miraculously turn into a success judging by what I have seen ( almost every game of his tenure) the chances of him stumbling upon a winning formula is lookin less likely each game
We were stinking again 1st half tonight
134 Posted 30/10/2019 at 00:58:08
135 Posted 30/10/2019 at 01:00:53
I saw those comments, while driving. Don't text and drive kids! Never mind for 140 mile trip! Dangerous stuff!
The guy you were having it out with, is one of my TW favorites. Full stop, great dude in my opinion.
You're both right. There's a place in this squad for both young, talented players. I wouldn't know how to fit them both in, but there's a way. I'm not paid millions to make those decisions, but both DCL and Kean are young players who need to be playing, stepping up, taking responsibility, and enhancing our play and future.
In short, and in between the hand grenades you both were throwing, you're both right about your main point - DCL and Kean are the future and should be playing more, and in the correct situations to their strengths. In my opinion.
136 Posted 30/10/2019 at 01:08:42
I am not gona start back stabbin your mate but if he is making a call like that SOLELY on Keanes Everton career that is complete insanity for me
I don't think it is fair on a player who has had no opportunity to prove himself
Silva is a manager out of his depth and clinging to the liferaft for survival. If Lampard was in our dugout Kean would be bangin them in I am convinced of it
Anyways i am off to bed to dream about football in the 80s :) all the best man
137 Posted 30/10/2019 at 01:10:04
Is he already so specialised that he cant contribute anything from outside the no.9 role?
138 Posted 30/10/2019 at 01:10:41
Dream of silverware and a League Cup winning team in 2020. ;0)
139 Posted 30/10/2019 at 01:14:21
Thought Iwobi was the unsung hero of that first goal - he really outfought the Watford defense to keep that attack alive after they repelled the initial corner. And while Richarlison's clincher was a classic case of exploiting a stretched defense in the final moments, it really was a cracking finish. Would love to see more of that on Sunday.
If we'd lost, I'm guessing there'd be well over 300 comments by now. Just saying.
140 Posted 30/10/2019 at 01:17:01
I don't think it plays to his strengths. He's a striker, not a wide man. For me.
Also... and this may seem a reach, but I believe it has some merit. your mileage may vary.
Moise Kean was brought into Everton to be the striker that changed our fortunes. Someone who would awaken the goal scoring slumber. The young Jesus riding his horse into town while we laid palms at his feet. A bit hyperbole, but stay with me.
When that's the expectation, and you then choose to play him out wide, all the while playing someone up top that can and does play out wide well, the subliminal message to young Moise is a negative one.
I don't trust you up top. If I did, I'd play you there.
Surely there's a wee bit of a let-down when you realize you've been "demoted" out of the position you were brought in to play at?
Moise Kean isn't Thierry Henry. He should be up top, in games and situations he can show his worth. Not out wide. And not subbed in while down 0-1 and the team is playing crap. That's no way to handle a 19 year old.
I define that, John, as Gawd-awful management. You can disagree. We'll just agree to do so.
141 Posted 30/10/2019 at 01:23:39
One more thing. I'm not Marco, and I'd probably be fired and never win a single game as manager. But!
I'd pull a "Fat Frank", a la Mason Mount, and have three young players completely taking center stage and playing a ton, and building around them. Taking the lumps and mistakes as they come, letting them learn and develop, gain experience, the whole 9 yards.
DCL, Moise Kean, and Tom Davies.
I believe in all three players. Their talent, their skill, their technical ability, and their effort.
We've won 3 of 10 games. Why not build for the future and make these kids the centerpiece of our team?
I see no downside to doing so. I'd go all-in on all three of them.
142 Posted 30/10/2019 at 01:42:53
143 Posted 30/10/2019 at 01:45:55
As for tonight. First half was the most boring game of football I have ever seen in my life. No urgency, no flare and no plan other than pass side ways and backwards and lumping it up field to no mans land. Like watching Allardyce football. Second half we were the better side and judging by the second half we deserved the win. I give Walcott a lot of shit, however he done well when he came on. Iwobi, Richarlison and Holgate also did well too.
One disappointment tonight again was Seamus Coleman. I love seamus, been a great servant to the club once a superb player. But right now wether in January or more likely summer, I'd get rid. Don't want Coleman to end up like Osman, Distin and Howard were all players had very good years with Everton for than being overused towards the end, where the fans were using them as scapegoats. Best thing we do to both Coleman and Baines is to do what we did with Jags last summer and say thank you but time to go.
Must win game on Sunday now.
144 Posted 30/10/2019 at 01:51:27
But I am curious if you could expand upon the 'whispers from Finch Farm?' I know some here are maybe privy to info the rest of us at large are not, so I'd genuinely like to know. Thanks.
145 Posted 30/10/2019 at 02:07:26
I completely blacked out with Iwobe. He's been great, and I'd include him in my "build around" group.
You say about Kean, "He hasn't showed enough to get the no. 9 yet."
How can you show enough when you're relegated to playing off the bench for 10 to 15 minutes, in a losing cause, while everyone around you plays like shit? Also, I think more than a few appearances were with the Mighty Morgan behind him, playing those cutting balls only he can, for Moise to get on the end of! COUGH COUGH!
And tonight, put out wide, not where he should be. In the single appearance he made while we were playing decent, and with enough time to make a mark on the game and not placed into said game while the team was losing (that's ONE time mind you from my memory) he looked damn good.
It's about playing the players in their natural, most effective positions. Heck, I'd argue now having seen Iwobe at the 10, he's shined recently because he's in his best position. Out wide I always noticed he drifted in. Now placed inside, he's been so, so much better.
Moise needs to be given a real, proper run up top. Otherwise we're simply not putting the kid in the best environment to succeed.
You don't prove yourself at the 9 by playing well out wide. The gateway to the 9 shouldn't be through the door to the left or the right.
146 Posted 30/10/2019 at 02:25:03
One might say Kean hasn't had the chance to play because he's actually a dud. He's not as good as made out to be. The "whispers" from Finch Farm indicate he's not "all that".
Here's my issue with that.
Our manager, and the way he's handled our young talent.
Moise Kean - read above comments. Diabolical the way he's handled.
Tom Davies - has had sideways Morgan and Delph played in front of him continually. And I like Delph, but the more I watch him play, he's clearly a "better Schneiderlin" and passes it off sideways. He was in a system at Man City where he could do just that. Pass it east-west to supremely talented players safely, and let them do the heavy lifting. We need someone like Tom, not Morgan or Delph, who will actually play the ball forward. But nope, Tom keeps getting benched by our genius manager.
JonJoe Kenny - somewhere in Germany
Mason Holgate - Behind an ineffective Michael Keane (whom I like, but out of form players need to be dropped).
Iwobe - mysteriously played behind the season-long out of form Sigurdsson
DCL - the platoon kid. In and out more than an adult film star.
That's six young players getting shafted and not being played (or transferred), while the players in front of them completely fuck the pooch and still start. Playing a brand of football that isn't fun to watch and creates little to no chances on goal.
And our manager keeps hitting the rinse and repeat cycle.
I don't buy the whispers at Finch Farm narrative. I see a manager who's not giving the kids a real shot at success.
But Jamie, you say, he sees them every day in training! Maybe they're not ready?!
Ya, ok. They're not ready, but the usual suspects who have seen us win 3 of our first 10 League games are? Sure. Sure. They're not ready, and the guys playing in front of them and completely underachieving are. Sure.
147 Posted 30/10/2019 at 02:27:22
149 Posted 30/10/2019 at 03:02:08
I have had enough of Silva the fraud, while I'm happy Everton are in the next round, I watched the 'highlights' of which there were few, but it doesn't augur well for the next game against Spuds. The sooner that idiot is jettisoned the better.
150 Posted 30/10/2019 at 03:03:29
All joking aside the first half I am of the opinion was the worst 45+ mins of football from Everton for a long,long time and it did not take much to improve it the second half.
I don't now if there are any top managers out there who can come in sort out the mess we are in but it certainly doesn't look if Silva will be capable of getting us up to to the top 10 never mind the top 6.
151 Posted 30/10/2019 at 03:36:18
I was pretty surprised to see Mina in the line up and it was a poor call, the crowd pleasing inclusion of nearly every attacking player we had made us top heavy and unbalanced.
We looked very disjointed and only Iwobi continues to please the eye. Trying every time to find a player with some craft. Sadly too often the statues he has for team mates looked on in bemusement.
Silvas deployment of Kean is a gross mismanagement, fighting for his own job, hes taking the lad down with him.
The service and mode of play just ignores every skill the lad has. Didnt Brands tell his mum wed look after him?
Holgates contributions are noted, but those baby steps will be tested against Kane and Son come Sunday. Encouraging though.
The positive is we are through and might get a favorable draw. This win gets Silva almost no credit, against a poor side he made his usual selection errors, cost himself a sub and only guilding the Lilly in the waning seconds.
The fact I could hear the conversations, burps and bad shouts in every stand until the 50th or so minute was testament to how poor it was.
Roll on Spurs.
152 Posted 30/10/2019 at 03:41:54
You say (144) - about Moise Kean - "I've likely seen him play more than anyone here, though if anyone else watched his 13 games with Juve, or his Italian national team matches, I stand corrected and apologize."
Kean only started 5 of those 13 games. He played about 500 minutes in Serie A last season. He went on a hot streak of goal-scoring (6 in 6 games) when surrounded by a team of world-class players, and in his best moments can finish like Romario or Jermain Defoe. In his worst moments looks like he is very much still learning the game - which he is!
When he played at Hellas Verona as a 17-year-old he played twice as many Serie A minutes (well over 1000), and only scored 4 goals. So... which sample do we want to use - the 6 in 6 for Juventus, his promising but hardly incandescent season at Hellas Verona, his consistently decent International record, or his tame 400-odd minutes in an Everton shirt? If we use all of them then I think the jury is well and truly out.
I wonder how much we all really knew about Kean before he was linked with us - beyond YouTube highlights and newspaper write-ups - but I am genuinely bemused by the faith that a lot of fans seem to have in Kean. I wonder if it is hope more than anything - hope that we've somehow got our hands on one of the hottest young properties in world football. From what I can tell, it seems that will score goals when playing in a talented team that allows him to play centrally as a classic centre-forward. Beyond that I don't know. My fear is that his all-round game is very raw and limited, and Silva will not risk giving him too many minutes in a misfiring Everton team.
It's not all bad news though... I actually do think we have one of the hottest young properties in world football - but his name is Anthony Gordon. With a fair wind that lad is going to go a long long way. Also check out Bobby Carroll's last-minute winner for the Under 18s against Fulham... and the subsequent pile-on; highlights on the club app.
153 Posted 30/10/2019 at 04:14:47
Pleased for Holgate getting his first goal - it was a classic centre-half goal with excellent work from Iwobi and then Walott to set it up. Walcott is still one of our better runners in the team, but he seems to delay his shot more in his advanced years which isn't overly fantastic.
Coleman is done. He hasn't got the pace anymore, lets very average players past him on the wing, and doesn't even have a very good first touch anymore. Watch how many balls go out for throws on his side of the field next time he plays.
Was surprisingly happy with Tosun off the bench too. He runs at loose balls and 1%ers which puts defenders in two minds, and his final pass for Richarlison's goal showed intelligence as it was played at the perfect time with perfect weight. Not many of our players are pulling those passes off lately when given the rare chance.
Against Spurs, Davies has to play. They are a shambles at the moment. Worst they've been in over a decade, with problems in the spine and very weak defensive wings. Davies, given approval, will run them ragged. Anything other than a win against them is totally unacceptable.
154 Posted 30/10/2019 at 04:25:32
Re: Kean though, your observation about him playing with world-class players is both astute and revealing. We don't have world class players. So to me, in order to "up his game," he should be playing where he's accustomed to playing: at CF.
Yes he only started 6 games of his 13 appearances; he scored 4 goals in those 6 games (I know that, I watched them)! All 13 games were at CF. Whether Ronaldo was next to him or not is irrelevant when all we're talking about is playing him in the right position and asking for a wing or midfielder to get him the ball. Those 6 goals came from only 10 shots on target. Pretty much indicates that he should be in the area, getting the ball, not being asked to create by himself. I do find it odd that you seem to casually dismiss his form with any number of reasons behind it, but ignoring that for a moment, aren't strikers expected to go on hot streaks and score goals? I bet we'd all love someone who could score goals at that rate!
He also played 3 times for Italy, though one was only a friendly. The other 2 were UEFA qualifying round matches, both of which he started, and he scored. Interestingly, Italy did use him as a wing in those 2 matches. Left wing.
He did get into 3 CL matches, all as a sub, but failed to score. All 3 games he played CF. No one (here) cares about the Coppa Italia, but the 1 game he played, he scored, as a CF (anyone noticing a trend here?).
So if all appearances matter, he played in 17 club matches, all at CF, and scored 7 times. All as an 18-year-old. Well, not counting his U21/U20 appearances (9 games, 5 goals).
We definitely could go back to when he was 17 at Verona but I quite honestly never saw him play aside from a video compilation or 2. Heck why don't we go back to his 36 U17 matches when he scored 29 goals (never saw those either to be fair). I just think last year was most relevant. Useless to judge him at Everton because he may as well have played 0 minutes the way Silva is choosing to use him.
If it isn't clear he has all the talent in the world, well, not sure what to say. I can tell you that at least for last year, he didn't play 1 single minute as a right wing in a 4-2-3-1 (or any formation for that matter). Anyway, I'll stop posting about Kean. I think I've said all that needs to be said. I and a few others are biased because we've seen what he can do. Others are biased because they're of the "prove it" school of thought. Neither are wrong! The only ones who are wrong are those shitting on him when really they haven't seen him play.
If you made it this far, thanks for reading my short novella.
Have a great evening, day, night, cheers.
(p.s. I'd love to see Gordon get some looks too; good luck with that with Silva as manager though)
155 Posted 30/10/2019 at 04:27:48
Result and Holgate
Do we have to stick with Silva until our trip in the LC lasts?
156 Posted 30/10/2019 at 04:53:00
Yeah, I know, I'm an uncultured Colonial clod, but if I want to watch something aesthetically pleasing I'll turn on the National Geographic Channel or open the Sports Illustrated swimsuit edition.
This club is never gonna produce art. But if it produces wins, I don't give a damn. Today was a win and that's all that matters.
Except for the idiocy of Silva playing an injured Mina. That matters too.
157 Posted 30/10/2019 at 05:13:08
And I agree with Mike - it may not have been the most scintillating performance, but if you score goals and keep clean sheets, good things will inevitably happen.
158 Posted 30/10/2019 at 05:21:24
They say fans have little to no influence over a club, but from what I witnessed in the second half I saw a team fighting for their manager.
Long my it continue.
159 Posted 30/10/2019 at 05:36:53
A couple of things. Firstly I did not say I hand not seen any of Kean at Juve.
And secondly. Let me point something out; Anybody who has taken any notice to stuff I post on these boards will tell you I defend young players to the hilt. I hate to see youngsters getting hammered. Hate it and I wont be doing it to Kean.
I played well into my forties. I coached and managed for around 15 years too. Unfortunately like everyone else I ever met In the game, failed in my attempt to make my judgement infallible... but I did learn a few things. . To look out for certain qualities.
Footballers are worth their weight in gold today and when Arsenal and Juve agreed so readily to let us have Iwobi and Kean. I was highly suspicious. . So I watched a lot of both of them any matches they had played and any footage I could find of them. My suspicion grew.
People may not want to accept that we have paid through the nose for these players, just like they didnt want to face facts about all those pups we have bought and are currently making up our squad, but I call it as I see it.
I know Kean has had a tough baptism, I know he is a young kid playing out of position for a less than convincing manager, in a foreign country, However (and this is where I base my judgement) He has not shown me anything at all to quell my suspicion that Juventus had us over. Yes he barges around a lot, but what else have you seen since he got here ? You must surely have learned by now, that what a player does in another country counts for nothing once they arrive in England. The ALL have to prove themselves all over again.
Nothing in this game gives me greater pleasure than seeing young player strutting his stuff for Everton and I would dearly love Kean and Iwobi to prove me totally wrong. But I've seen all of their games for Everton and a lot more than a few you tube clips for Juve and Arsenal. I don't believe I am wrong.
I get it Jer. I have seen your constant criticsm of DCL and like most people, you want to be proved right. but if you are offended by my comments about these two, I suggest you give the article I am putting together about our transfer policy a very wide berth.
I will always give an opinion about a young player, but I have never seen the mileage in coming back week after week to batter the same player. Kean will not even be mentioned in the article. What I do know, is that we've bought more Pups than a Yorkshire dog breeder.
160 Posted 30/10/2019 at 05:44:09
I agree with your bottom line thinking, to a point.
It's easy to say that after a victory. But presently, over a sampling of 10 games this season, and a majority of last season, you're going to have pretty shit odds rolling out the "I don't care about form as long as we win."
Form begets victory. Our form, in the main, is shit. Victories are few, and will continue to be few, with our present form.
I want to win in the end. Bottom line. But ignoring poor and turgid performances 7 out of 10 games in the league is a recipe for disaster in the long term.
If we were winning the majority of the time, losing a few, and we win the odd game ugly, then go ahead and say, "who cares how we played, we won."
But that's not our current landscape. We are playing and losing, the majority of the time. That's not good. And saying turgid and insipid performances don't matter, if your landscape is as crappy as ours currently is? You're ignoring the issues and papering over the cracks.
We need a consistent run of "West Ham games." We're getting a consistent serving of diarrheal soft-serve ice cream instead.
We're playing awfully. That doesn't bode well for the future, even if we do pull a rabbit out of a shit cap every now and again.
161 Posted 30/10/2019 at 05:58:08
162 Posted 30/10/2019 at 06:55:06
163 Posted 30/10/2019 at 06:56:43
Almost spot on!
I agree, the end result is all that counts. But I would rather it was achieved it an attractive manner!!
But base line, if we do, by some chance, end up in the final, a goal ahead against city in the 89th minute, who is going to care whether the Watford game was a classic or a convincing win?
It was a win. Two more goals, one more clean sheet. Hopefully the turning point. If not, then shit. But still, next game we go again.
Far too much hand writing and analysis for me!
164 Posted 30/10/2019 at 07:19:05
Was interesting to see Lampards comments regards to how young players need to be trusted and not dropped after one bad game. Here at Everton the opposite approach is adopted.
Glad Holgate has stepped up. He and Mina should remain as first choice for the time being.
Kean also needs more starts, he needs a goal, an de he needs to feel that the manager believes in him. Taking him off at half time is just woeful man management.
Davies getting dropped so hastily also. Gomes is hardly lighting the place up, but who gets dropped is the young lad.
165 Posted 30/10/2019 at 07:21:43
Silva is just not giving the lad a chance to shine in his preferred position.
I'm not going to add any more as I think you've said it all.
Also agree with you at #160. 7 defeats in 10 games is inarguably relegation form, so, why is Silva still here?
166 Posted 30/10/2019 at 07:24:22
167 Posted 30/10/2019 at 07:33:42
168 Posted 30/10/2019 at 07:46:23
Given our current circumstances, I am happy to take the win and move on to the next round. But “this club is never gonna produce art”? Im sorry, that is exactly what we aspire to, thats why we keep going, because we (and that includes you, its why you started supporting Everton) have seen footballing grand masters in that blue shirt.
For good measure, while we watch that art show, we dont really want to be chatting too much with the people around us, good company though that it is in my case. We want to be howling the team forwards, encouraging them to defend like demons, intimidating the referee and making the opposition wish they were safely back in the dressing room.
Despite the talk from the manager, players and officials at the club, there is very little evidence that they understand those aspirations.
169 Posted 30/10/2019 at 07:51:26
"We beat Sheffield Wednesday of course in the 1966 FA Cup final and lo and behold tonight we have the next team we beat in the FA Cup Final in 1984 coming to town.
Is there something in the air for the League Cup this term. Hope so. I'm going for 2-0. (smiley)"
"Lenny @46, events in 1966 or even Oxford 1984 have no bearing whatsoever to the football world in 2019."
Looks like history counts for something after all eh Joe!
170 Posted 30/10/2019 at 07:51:41
In the opening hour I saw no fire at all, zilch.
What I saw after that was the crowd becoming MOTM and the players actually responding for a change.
Let not kid ourselves, we were still pretty awful.
Midfield is a huge problem area. Watford, and West Ham in our previous win, seemed to be able to run through at will.
Gomes is just not very good at all, is he?
Davies, as shown at Brighton, is also not very good and has never produced consistently.
Anyway, on our way to Wembley!
171 Posted 30/10/2019 at 07:53:46
However, the best we could expect would be in the summer.
Meanwhile Holgate exuded class. Composed on the ball read the game and distributed it well and capped it with a goal and a stirring celebration.
And may I echo Mike Gaynes in asking why Mina was risked? He tweaked that knee early on and was hobbling before eventually succumbing to it. Surely this sort of selection will simply deprive us of his services for a longer period. Dumb.
Steve @118, Iwobi started a little nervously but really had a good game. He is so lively and must be a pain to mark. It was noticable that simply swapping wings Walcott and Richarlison confused the Hornet's defence and Walcott's cross lead to the winner.
172 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:03:15
A complete detachment from reality on both counts.
Sometimes I really think we get the club we deserve.
173 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:06:10
174 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:09:42
Why was he risked, didnt train last week, not fit to play on Saturday. Why not start Keane and Holgate and give Yerry a thorough rehab ? It doesn't make any sense.
175 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:26:45
Another time perhaps, hope you enjoyed the trip.
176 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:37:46
Had most of the possession and almost twice as many shots on goal, most shots on target, hitting the woodwork twice, more corners and less fouls.
All in all a good nights work.
hopefully will give the players a boost in confidence ready for Spurs on Saturday.
177 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:48:42
The truth is, the first half was rubbish. The turning point in the game appears to be what was said in the dressing room at half time, and the subbing of Kean for Walcott. We must give credit where its due. Silva got criticism - rightly so in my book - for replacing Bernard with Sigurdsson at Brighton. He must be given credit for getting it right this time. He gave Kean a run out, and although he tried, he wasnt at the races.
The second half was like a different team. Iwobi took control of the game and was looking to play Walcott through at every opportunity. Those 2 seem to link up well together. Digne also stepped up and we could have won by 3 or 4 goals. We hit the bar twice, Keane directed a free header inside the 6 yard box straight at the keeper. Walcott flashed a cross across the goal that only needed a tap in. It was much better. The crowd responded to the players pressing - although our failure to get a 2nd goal until late always meant that Watford were never out of the game.
If the second half had been as bad as the first, the manager and players would have deserved some stick. In all honesty, we played well second half and Pickford didnt have a save to make. We also looked far more solid - I think it helps having Delph and Gomes in front of the centre halves, Delph seems to cover more ground than Davies and Gomes was back on form. The centre halves played well also, as did Lucas Digne.
We need to see more of the second half performance than the first half performance...
178 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:49:26
Let's just be realistic shall we. The Oxford games was in 1984, City were a nothing club and had The Kippax. As you can see a lot has changed since then.
179 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:52:38
Too many players are out of form for us to anticipate fluid football and plenty of goals in addition to the above. But there's every reason to anticipate those things when said players return to consistent form, when we might expect more displays like the West Ham one.
Keep calm and carry on, as they say.
180 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:52:39
It's really hard watching and being an evertonian at times especially when there is no light at the end of the tunnel
181 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:53:30
Pleased that Holgate got on the scoresheet, he can play but needs a little more beef on those shoulders.
182 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:56:39
183 Posted 30/10/2019 at 08:58:36
The man can't do right for doing wrong, he's plain unlucky - but hey, we're in the next round, so it'll go down in the 'job done' column.
That aside, He's done nothing to change my mind on the two fronts that worry me.
1) He's not up to the job.
2) Only the lack of a decent candidate is keeping him here.
Marcelo Bielsa - Come on down.
184 Posted 30/10/2019 at 09:10:16
If he plays Kean it should be from the bench and up top, though he is far from ready, I hate to say it but l would loan him to a Championship team in January to get some proper game time and confidence.
Silva is still a way from knowing his best 11. Much better in the second half, l thought we were excellent once we got going. DCL should play more on the shoulder if Iwobi has the ball at his feet, he runs with it. I dont know, missing a bit of guile in midfield. Missing a few bits actually. Stray passes all over the pitch never helps.
Silva has to go for us to progress up the table, hes holding us back. Its time for a change.
185 Posted 30/10/2019 at 09:12:24
Wishful thinking on my part regarding Zouma. I see our current first-choice centre-backs as a weak spot.
Keane repeatedly gets caught out of position, is prone to mistakes, and appears to need someone to hold his hand. Mina is injury-prone, poor at defending on the turn, and prone to lapses of concentration. For both, their height advantage is nullified by poor positioning and they are carthorses getting forward. Holgate's stats on distribution makes them both look ordinary, one being an ex-Barcelona player.
I agree with you regarding Davies, he is potentially far better than Gomes. Davies is a great link man and mobile at speed, held back by a ponderously slow midfield. It is noticable that Calvert-Lewin gets into better scoring positions when he plays. Sidibe also releases the ball a lot earlier, enabling Calvert-Lewin to run on to the ball.
Schniederlin (on management instructions), Gomes and Sigurdsson, can amount to one big roadblock going forward and a sieve when the opposition is pressing.
Kean is being badly managed; luckily he hasn't got Lookman or Vlasic to talk too. Again, he is suffering from a slow coach right up the spine of the side, which is both tactical and technical. He could be a great player and the one good thing about Bernard's injury is he may get more playing time. Bernard will be missed. Iowbi is mobile and at least trying.
The solutions are there except for Zouma, but will Silva finally see the light? I would put Schnerderlin, Gomes and Sigurdsson under more competitive pressure in selecting the team. Let them stews in the comfortable rot of Finch Farm.
186 Posted 30/10/2019 at 09:15:45
187 Posted 30/10/2019 at 09:15:58
Sadly, like Peter, I see little at pitch or boardroom level currently to offer me any realistic possibility of a return to playing attractive football and gaining some prestige as a club again.
188 Posted 30/10/2019 at 09:22:18
Silva's body language spoke volumes: he looked a tragic figure on the touchline. He lacks inspiration – anyone can see that – it's an awful handicap for any team to carry into a match. I almost felt sorry for him, but he's being paid a fortune for something he's not very good at.
189 Posted 30/10/2019 at 09:32:58
191 Posted 30/10/2019 at 09:53:11
I really hope your faith in Moise is justified. We'd all love to have a world-class young striker on our hands. In terms of how he's doing at Finch Farm, I have no personal insight whatsoever.
Just referencing a recent remark by Dave Prentice on the Royal Blue Podcast that he was hearing Kean was a long way from where he needed to be. (It may have been Greg O'Keeffe on The Blue Room. The point being that it was a reputable, established Evertonian journalist with good access who said it in an unsensational matter-of-fact way that made me sit up and take notice at the time.)
For what it's worth, I don't accept the general idea that players can only operate effectively in one specialist position. From all my years of playing and watching the game, a good footballer is a good footballer.
192 Posted 30/10/2019 at 09:56:05
After a bright start, Cannock's Best had us in the doldrums of the League and playing shite. The Moores controlled Board professed faith in their man and gave him another season (1980-81) to get it right. He didn't and crowds dropped to 15k before they acted to improve things.
Nothing much changes, does it?
193 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:00:52
(1) Steve F - as others (Brian W?) have said, there most certainly was some (a smattering) of booing on the half-time whistle. Maybe you couldn't hear it in the Park End but it was audible in Gladwys St Upper where I sit.
(2) What was with all those renditions of old songs (including "When the Blues Go Marching In" ffs!) from the motley gathering in the old Boys Pen area? I had visions of Kenwright sitting on Uncle Cyril's crossbar (sounds rude!) conducting the choir!
194 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:01:14
I don't think he has a choice. Walcott is in form, and we've not said that for a... well ever! Holgate deserves to keep his place also. Sidibe should come back in.
I think Silva has two major decisions to make: One is Delph v Davies to partner Gomes. And the other Calvert-Lewin or Richarlison up front. They will either both play or else Richarlison up front allowing Sigurdsson to come back into the team. Nothing else will change of course.
I hope we beat Spurs, we need the points. But, in the long run, it's prolonging the inevitable.
195 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:05:22
196 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:10:24
If Gomes can play as an 8 then I don't think its beyond Iwobi's capabilities.
He is just as good defensively (not a high bar) and is better at both dribbling and passing forward. He already makes more tackles and interceptions than Gomes and is dribbled around far less.
Clearly some of his best work comes in the final third and I'd be keen to keep that aspect but I don't think its impossible that he could play as the most forward-thinking of the midfield 3 in a 4-3-3.
He's certainly a more natural No 10 but if I was Silva I'd be willing to try anything to get some more pace and dynamism into the middle of the park. I wonder if we will see Iwobi, Davies and Gbamin as a central 3 by the end of the season. I feel like that could have a good balance of energy, athleticism, positivity and creativity.
197 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:14:33
Alex Iwobi, his close footwork to keep the ball in the second phase following our corner from the right and deliver a dangerous cross into the box, was fabulous. It did not count as an assist but it led to the assist for Holgate to bury in the third phase. Good work all round.
The final act of the night, a Watford attack is stopped the ball is played to the waiting Cenk Tosun who plays a superb ball for Richarlison to run on to. The weight of the pass is perfect as is the angle to cut through the Watford defence and make the outcome a certainty.
There were other moments but those two were outstanding and resulted in goals, so worthy of comment.
198 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:15:33
Great shame that Rudiger got injured and Luiz left but I think Zouma is establishing himself now at Chelsea. We need to find another pacy centre-back.
199 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:18:00
He's 19, playing in a foreign land, he's probably played about 30 or 40 games of senior football, and is slowly getting introduced into the most physically demanding league in the world.
I'd love to see him play upfront with Calvert-Lewin, I'd have loved Richarlison to pass it across the goal last night to give the kid an easy chance, but I don't think Everton are treating him badly, and I'm sure once he adapts to England, he will be fine.
He might actually be suited to playing against the better teams, teams that attack and leave a little bit of space in behind. But it's going to be hard for him to get game time upfront at the minute though, because he doesn't look suited to playing as a lone striker, so let's just send the kid out on loan!
200 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:22:48
201 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:30:46
If you just admit the realities in the first place and use the kind of perspective Stan uses, it's a lot easier to see what is coming.
202 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:32:43
203 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:38:09
It all depends on how Silva wants to approach this. Do we press high up the pitch and go for the jugular? Do we sit a bit deeper and try to be a bit more compact and look to frustrate Spurs?
If we were firing on all cylinders, then I would advocate the former approach. Spurs are looking vulnerable at the moment and their game has been built on energy and pressing and at the moment that looks to have gone. They played a lot better against Liverpool, and their tactics were no doubt down to their very early goal, but they sat deep at Anfield and invited Liverpool onto them.
I don't watch every minute of every Spurs game, but it seems to me that they are lacking the energy they showed as they smashed us 6-2 at Goodison 12 months ago. If we win, we go above them. But, we are also in a mess right now and trying to go toe to toe with Spurs might be playing into their hands and if you give Harry Kane sight of goal then he scores.
Personally, I absolutely hate Harry Kane. Well the sight of him, not the guy himself. He's scored 9 goals in 9 games against us. 5 of the 9 goals have come in 5 games at Goodison.
So, let's say it's safe to say we should be very worried about him, and going toe to toe against Spurs, and letting Kane have space to attack us could be a recipe for disaster. Remember that goal he scored in the 4-0 smashing of Koeman's Everton? The lad just needs to shoot and the ball finds it way into our net.
So, perhaps we should look to sit deep and play the same tactics we played against Man City. The City game had the midfield trio of Schneiderlin, Delph and Sigurdsson. I think we need Davies in there for his pace and energy. Iwobi deserves to retain the number 10 jersey, and Walcott should start in place of Kean. I would also like to see Sidibe in for Coleman. Danny Rose is suspended and so we can get at Ben Davies and Sidibe would be a better bet than Coleman.
Seamus Coleman is a fantastic servant of the club, but we have to accept that he is no longer the player he was. His pace has gone. He's not a yard slower, he's 2 or 3 yards slower. His confidence is affected. He takes too many touches, he stops the ball completely and just basically stops our attacks dead in their tracks.
A vintage Coleman got on the ball and hit the afterburners or gave and went (ie, laid it off and set off down the touchline for the return ball). Instead, he cuts inside and looks for the pass. He is trying his very best to make something happen. He is trying to be the captain and to be a leader, but he was never the best passer of the ball. So when he gets the ball he should be laying it off quickly to better passers.
Coleman is quite solid defensively, speed issues aside. But that was always the weaker side of his game. Remember, Moyes played him as a right winger as he was so worried about his defensive acumen.
I think we need to face the fact that whilst Coleman is only 31, and so not particularly old, he has just lost too much of what made him special, and with the side struggling so badly, there can be no room for sentimentality. We have a France international desperate to play in his place. Time for him to have an extended run in the side.
204 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:40:48
Gomes is still far too deep for me. But maybe I base too much on the young Gomes who was always in around the opposition box for Benfica, making things happen and scoring a wonder goal or two.
205 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:43:16
I'm not going to revise my opinion of him based on one pass, but he's shown that he can be very effective as an impact sub late in a game when the opposition are chasing the game as it is not the first time he has scored or created a game-killing goal in this manner.
206 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:45:09
Yes, we know youre not one to change youre mind based on evidence, Steve.
208 Posted 30/10/2019 at 10:57:44
Our first-half performance was very poor. Our midfield is too static, you can give out about Gomes, but he's the one player with vision and can unlock a defence with his passing ability... I don't know why Silva didn't leave Davies beside him.
A few comments here saying Coleman was poor and finished, I totally disagree. Kean was ahead of him in the first half, he's not a winger, he should be playing off Calvert-Lewin, and left Seamus with no outlet, and didn't track back.
Walcott made a huge difference in the 2nd half. One or two comments said he was poor in defence; the Watford attack on his side was non-existent in the 2nd half.
209 Posted 30/10/2019 at 11:01:00
Don't get me wrong – there are moments of skill and strength – but, my word, he's planted to the floor in possession.
210 Posted 30/10/2019 at 11:01:36
Steve, you said Gomes was too deep. Well, perhaps it was due to him having no midfield partner. Delph was playing in the hole behind Gomes and in keeping with the role (role, hole, goal... back of the net), that Schneiderlin plays.
211 Posted 30/10/2019 at 11:05:26
He should have hit a quick and easy pass and kept the ball moving quickly. He was one of the main (but not the only) culprits for slowing us down by taking too many touches and being too ponderous and indecisive in possession.
You are right about the lack of link up with Kean being a factor though. And he was better in the second half with Walcott. But that did not stop the issues I raised in the opening paragraph, because it continued.
He also has an instinct to turn the winger (when in possession) so he can use his pace to blast past them like he always did. However, the pace is not there and so he does not do so, or he hesitates and does not do so.
Sorry, Christy, he is struggling right now; I cannot see him getting any better. He is certainly offering much less going forwards than Sidibe.
I also think his captaincy skills are lacking. He is not vocal enough. He is struggling with his own game too much to take on the mantle of captain and sort the team out. You cannot be a leader if you have your own personal crisis of confidence.
212 Posted 30/10/2019 at 11:10:54
214 Posted 30/10/2019 at 11:26:05
There was no reason for that first-half performance and Kean wasn't the right fit to play in front of Coleman that's for sure. Walcott and Sidibe all the way. It's the left side I'm worried about. Oh and the centre midfield and attack... and goalkeeper.
But apart from that... Come on, Arsenal!
215 Posted 30/10/2019 at 11:38:35
If we keep it right on Sunday, I can see us making mistakes and losing, so why not go on the front foot against a vulnerable team?
Regarding Kean, he's a 19-year-old, in a new country, new language, different league. He needs time to settle. He'll get that by time on the pitch in his correct position. I've got a sneaking feeling that Silva didn't and doesn't want him and he'll be gone in January, unless Silva goes first.
216 Posted 30/10/2019 at 11:44:43
Walcott was the difference last night, he looked lively from the off.
If Iwobi is to make the Number 10 spot his own, he has to add goals. My preference is still Sigurdsson in the No 10 role, he offers more. For the Spurs game, I would play Davies instead of Iwobi and have a 5-man midfield.
A win is a win, we have played better and got nothing out of games this season.
217 Posted 30/10/2019 at 11:50:46
I've no belief or particular concern about winning this cup and so IMO it's worth experimenting with a player or two like Kean, I would have started him left wing.
But starting both Mina and Delph (Silva's key defensive players) was risky given both have very questionable injury records over the last few seasons.
I think the most noticeable difference to the team's tempo and attacking threat was the lack of Davies who gets the ball forward far quicker. People criticise his passing but if, like Schneiderlin, the majority of passes are 5 yards sideways, or 10 yards back, his stats would improve so I'm bloody glad he doesn't and happy Schneiderlin has been dropped. Long may it continue.
Both Delph and Gomes are too similar in that they avoid the risky pass, happy to keep possession and pass it backwards to a porous defence, putting them under needless pressure and stopping our attacks.
No surprise Iwobi and Walcott can link up. They both came from Wenger's Arsenal who played some fantastic flowing forward football. Walcott makes runs knowing Iwobi plays the ball forward. Simple stuff. I'm happy to give credit for Walcott's cross and it was a good bit of play. Too often, his delivery and final ball is dreadful. Over the last 2 games, how often has he found a teammate? 3 or 4 times maybe.
Simply not good enough but Richarlison (who I think is fantastic) is also guilty of this, misplacing an easy 10-yard pass more often than not.
Not the only players, Coleman, Keane, Gomes, Sigurdsson, Delph all give the ball away too often, too cheaply and in dangerous areas... it's so frustrating!
218 Posted 30/10/2019 at 11:59:23
You're probably right about Seamus going forward. He's not a patch on what he was, but his legs are not what they used be. Defensively he's still strong, I agree he shouldn't be Captain, I would prefer a centre back or midfielder.
As for Gomes, he's the only one who looks up and passes the ball 30/40 yards; in my opinion, Delph passes short and sideways.
219 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:04:14
220 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:04:33
I totally agree. If correct, as you say, that Silva never wanted and doesn't want Moise Kean, that would in part explain the limited time he's had on the pitch and the position he's being played. What a waste of potential.
221 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:05:24
Schneiderlin plays the same way Delph did last night. If there is a pass on or a chance to switch play he will take it. I wish people could watch a game without preconceptions of a player. Watch the games back. Our shape is wrong and Silva has one way of going forward.
Gomes is still taking too long to get into things. It's always a few misplaced passes for the first 20 minutes.
222 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:13:23
I know and understand what you're saying when you take the "end justifies the means" attitude were these cup ties are concerned.
The problem for me about that match last night is that the team we had out was our best team or thereabouts. This wasn't a squad game were he gave game time to those without any game time while playing the bottom-of-the league no-hopers. We are struggling to overwhelm these teams and last night was more about late-game fatigue and concentration that won it for us, than our ability to break them down (credit thought to Richarlison for taking his chance so well).
We still look like a disaster waiting to happen and need to be able to put teams like this under pressure and keep them there. If we can't do it to these types of teams, where do we find the confidence to take on the better teams?
223 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:14:40
Coleman is receiving much criticism of late. Admittedly he is not the force of old. To be fair, he has never really recovered from his horrific leg break. Last night in the first half, I felt his passing options were limited by the players in front of him.
Things improved in the second period with Walcott's introduction. Which begs the simple question, is Moise Kean good enough? The questions posed by Souness on television, regarding Juventus selling him, may sadly carry weight.
I made a point of studying his movement off the ball for considerable periods last night and his positional sense, was woefully lacking, resulting in him being easily marked and impossible to pass to. On one occasion Gomes put a lovely ball through to him, creating a great opportunity, but his first touch was awful, a golden chance for him to signal his arrival squandered.
I don't buy any of this stuff about his age and new environment. If you are good enough, you are old enough. And these players live in the lap of luxury, not like the flea-bitten digs great players of yesteryear had to put up with. I certainly hope the lad makes me eat my words, but I fear we may have bought another Niasse.
224 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:16:17
225 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:16:45
226 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:26:17
Can Everton raise their game like they did somewhat against the Hammers? Could be bottom three after this one unless they play well.
227 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:31:34
For the £30m approx we paid for Kean, we paid a similar fee for Lukaku and at a similar age, did we take the attitude with Lukaku you're only a kid make a contribution later on when you feel you're ready?
He's looking to me like an U23 player trying things that worked in the U23s but don't work in the big league, there's also a touch of rabbit in the headlights about him to.
If we paid £8-12m to Barnsley for him I'd be a bit more forgiving, but you have to remember this kid's earning a fair bit more than that kid from Barnsley.
The club made a lot of noise about him when he came and I think they expected more from than he's given.
228 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:39:51
229 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:48:03
We've bought potential with Kean.
Lukaku was ready to go after his spell at West Brom. I don't think Kean has got to grips with English football yet. He may succeed or he may yet fail - he shouldn't be written off just yet as a 19-year-old lad adjusting to a country where he doesn't yet have a great command of the language (again, unlike Lukaku, whose English was perfect when he arrived at Chelsea).
230 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:51:14
I can't see Man City losing to Southampton, we'll be where we are now and deserve to be come Monday, that's hanging on by our fingernails just above the brown stuff.
231 Posted 30/10/2019 at 12:58:09
I haven't written him off, but based on what we seen of him so far, I think Juve got the better of the deal and if he was such a potential Drogba in the making, why did they sell him?
For what's it's worth, I see talent in him, just not £30m worth.
Maybe a loan spell as Lukaku had might help him come on a bit and find his confidence?
I'll happily eat my words if this kid comes good.
232 Posted 30/10/2019 at 13:06:22
You might be right about the need for Mosie Kean to find his feet in a different footballing culture. But the ball is still round??!!
233 Posted 30/10/2019 at 13:17:47
Lukaku, was mainly used as a sub at West Brom though, and had also been at Chelsea, so when he came to Everton, he had at least two years experience of English football under his belt. ( its at times like this that I cant believe they got rid of the old central league?)
Give the kid a bit of time, hes been at Everton for three months of the season, and I wouldnt expect anything more than a gradual introduction, and when hes good enough Im sure he will get a lot more game time, just like what happened with Lukaku eventually?
234 Posted 30/10/2019 at 13:35:21
I'd say the money is immaterial in this market given Newcastle wanted 50 million for Longstaff who is even greener. From what I read in the Italian press, Juve were criticized for selling him as it was perceived as selling their future in order to raise money for instant success. Nobody seemed to view it as Juve offloading someone who wasn't going to make it.
As far as loans go, I wouldn't loan him out right bow because he'd probably find himself in a similar boat adjusting to the English game elsewhere plus it would further dent his confidence. I agree with Tony about working him in gradually, with the caveat we need to play him in a way where he can use his strengths e.g. running with the ball, and as a fox in the box.
I remember 20 years ago fans scratching their heads as to why we signed Materazzi as he floundered. He went on to win the world cup and every other trophy. It's a big adjustment off the field and on it. Most 19 year olds struggle to settle in when they move 100 miles to Uni. Moving to another country, being under a public microscope makes it harder. So I think we need to give him time.
235 Posted 30/10/2019 at 13:36:57
That match last night was the worst I have seen Everton play in a long long time. Richarlison was awful bar the goal, Coleman did nothing. Holgate got beat in every jump for the ball. I hate picking on certain players but nobody impressed me last night, again apart for Digne who actually looked bothered.
Silva's inability to change anything for the better is becoming a worry. Yes, he took Kean off, who isn't a winger, and actually looked good, Calvert-Lewin yet again fails to convince. From the stands, the whole thing just looked horrible.
I worry that when we start playing the big boys soon we are going to get stuffed. Worryingly Spurs on Monday is going to be a tough one. Nail-biting stuff for us.
236 Posted 30/10/2019 at 13:54:13
Spurs is on Sunday, not Monday. 4:30pm kick-off.
237 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:03:11
If we lose or lose terribly like last year to Spurs and get drawn away to Man City or Liverpool in the cup, then I think Silva will be out. I know Klopp plays the juniors in the cup but remember when Fergie "threw" the cup semi-final versus Everton with his B team and we still needed penalties to beat them.
I imagine if Klopp named a team featuring Mickey Mouse, that somehow we'd conspire to lose at Anfield.
238 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:03:59
Last night, I saw our forwards making runs, only for the ball to be passed square, then onto the wings. I would like to see Gomes and Sigurdsson pair up in midfield.
239 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:05:53
I see late goals as a positive for any team.
240 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:11:15
Too true. If late goals weren't "a thing" we'd have no concept of "Fergie time" and United would have an empty trophy cabinet.
241 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:22:13
The crowd were up for it, great response to the flags and everything around the ground, by roaring the team onto the pitch, carried on with the applause for the first ten minutes, then it dawned on them, certainly dawned on me, we were watching pancake football, dead flat, and it stayed like that for the rest of the half.
The second half was a bit better and the two unlikely looking goals, I didn't think they were ever going to come, put a much better face on the night.
All-in-all, I agreed totally with Peter's (168) last two paragraphs, they summed up the night's football and were Everton are at the moment.
242 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:25:56
Interesting prophecy. So next up we should get Man Utd as we beat them in 1995, but that still leaves us short of opponents for the Semi and Final unless we get the MLS All stars and the Kariobangi Sharks as late entrants.
243 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:26:06
On the Kean selection, it seems to me that Silva was trying to shoe-horn him into the side and give everyone a game, if you see what I mean. He wanted to start DCL and Kean and with Bernard out, he went with the 2 of them. One would imagine he'd discussed and worked on this with the players in the lead-up to the game.
Kean is still a child in footballing terms, and you have to remember, at Juve he was playing with some of the best players in European football - at Everton he's playing with Cenk Tosun and Morgan Sidetosiderlin.
244 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:32:44
Mention should be given to the fact that Watford came to spoil. If a team wants to stop you playing, then it can be quite easy to do that. The difference in the second half was Walcott came on and started running at people. I expected Kean to do just that but he seemed to just try to knock it past his man to run on to rather than try to actually take him on. Gomes's passing was awful in the first half and that did not help matters.
Sunday is a big game, hopefully it can be 3 points and jumpstart the season into life.
245 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:40:40
Pete #168, you are blessed, or burdened, with memories of an elegant Everton that I don't have. I became an Everton fan in the mid-1980s but rarely actually saw them play. The FA-cup-winning '95 side and the Moyes sides a decade later won games on grit, not artistry. Like any other fan, I enjoy and appreciate attractive football -- but I enjoy winning more, and I will sacrifice the former for the latter without a second thought. Unfortunately, under the current manager I think there is little of either. So I celebrate results like yesterday unreservedly, without regard to the quality of the performance. Sorta like sex at 63, just getting it done is cause for celebration.
Regarding Moise Kean, I would simply remind everyone that at this early point in their careers Eden Hazard, Roberto Firmino, Leroy Sane and -- as Tony #233 points out -- Romelu Lukaku had made zero impact as well (Firmino was considered a bust!), and all were considerably older than Kean. I see no lack of confidence in him and I certainly wouldn't loan him out -- just give him minutes and watch him grow.
246 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:42:41
It's a cup tie – the result is all that matters.
247 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:44:31
Now now, dont argue in the internet it doesnt make you cool.
The reality is we were poor, again.
248 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:45:33
Like yourself, I'm struggling to have seen any "grandmasters". Sure, I saw Sheedy, Sharp, Steven and co, but I didn't really see them as I was only a nipper. So the best I've seen is Kanchelskis, Limpar, Gravesen, Arteta and Lukaku. I wouldn't call any of them "greats", "legends", "iconic", or anything of a superlative nature, and certainly not grandmasters.
249 Posted 30/10/2019 at 14:47:55
250 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:00:33
251 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:08:07
I went the game last night (god, it was an awful game) and the only midfielder on the pitch last night who looked anything close to a box-to-box midfielder was Iwobi.
Also, Silva is not a good manager. He will destroy Moise Kean trying to play him as a wide bloody winger. The kid is a central striker where he made his name.
Why is another of our managers trying to be smart and change the lad? It happened with Andy Johnson to accommodate James Beattie. He needs to stop being a stubborn bastard.
252 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:08:58
The other thing is that none of us has a clue which Everton will turn up from game to game, or even half to half.
Answers on a postcard re Sunday.
253 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:09:58
The point is he still cannot get a tune out of any variety of team he puts out when a team sits in, low blocks. The absence of dribblers is really the key, only Iwobi consistently looks to beat a man. He has looked our best bet.
These are the games I judge him on because this is were the bulk of our points come from. It gives you a platform to play well against better sides. Sadly I think the board judges him on long term goals not the short term. Without short term management there is no long term, you just get drift and interminable transition.
254 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:18:10
Even in Lukaku's first year with EFC he played more than 2,500 minutes in the Prem; by contrast Kean is extrapolating out to about 1,100 minutes in the Prem.
But to me the most telling contrast is that Lukaku played 136 of his 138 career Everton games at striker, nowhere else. Sorry I broke my own promise to not comment re: Kean again. Back to my hole I go.
255 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:18:42
Yes, there was booing at half-time.
256 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:21:59
Also, if you had any memory or ‘eye for anything but the negative youd remember that home games against the big six are where Silvas Everton have actually managed to look the part.
By all means we should point out problems with the team or suggestions for improvements, but cant we skip the pointless doom-mongering?
257 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:22:28
Kean needs time, he's only 19 but because we paid £30m we expect him to click straight away. If Silva played him upfront beside Calvert-Lewin his proper position, he's not a winger.
I know Watford were very defensive last night – don't forget they made 8 changes – but our performance in the 1st half was shocking, we should have been able to break them down. Gomes with Delph doesn't do anything going forward.
258 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:24:44
259 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:29:51
After the game Silva said there was nothing wrong with Mina and that he thought he was injured as he felt pain but in fact is fine. Makes him sound like a bit of a hypochondriac.
260 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:51:03
261 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:53:12
But re: Kenwright, how much sway could he possibly have? He's but one voice and easily voted down, no? I've been under the impression this will be a Brands choice/Moshiri rubber stamp scenario.
262 Posted 30/10/2019 at 15:58:33
I thought the same. I heard Kenwright wanted rid of Walsh long before he went, and that he wanted Unsie as new boss. Since he didn't get his way, I wonder if he has any clout... unless Moshiri has thrown the towel in with his own ideas.
263 Posted 30/10/2019 at 16:01:23
Damn sky bet have Mark Hughes now as odds on next boss. I pulled up odds from Oct 9th and he wasn't even listed as a contender. Now I am starting to get worried.
264 Posted 30/10/2019 at 16:08:37
Whatever you do, don't have a bet on it.
265 Posted 30/10/2019 at 16:09:29
They knew we had no one who could take the ball through the middle which ended up in slow build up and time enough for Watford to regroup.
When Walcott came on, the pace of the game picked up, we got the ball forward quicker and this stopped Watford from getting organised, hence the chances we got before the first goal.
To me getting the ball forward quicker created at least 4 good chances, two taken and two striking the woodwork.
Our slow build up play is our Achilles heel, teams know they can deal with crosses coming in so are ensuring they push us out wide.
Until we get an out and out goal scorer and a midfielder that can take it down the middle, take players on, we will keep on struggling.
Watford came to settle for penalties, we got the job done and Holgate for me had a great game.
266 Posted 30/10/2019 at 16:11:13
I'm on Team Arteta meself.
I just remembered I had a question to the long-time TWers: has TW ever had a proper forum setup, or has it always been comments on articles?
267 Posted 30/10/2019 at 16:13:03
268 Posted 30/10/2019 at 16:39:53
Of course, Hughes is one of those who should be in the nursing home taking the "knock out drops"... too many headers I think.
269 Posted 30/10/2019 at 16:40:42
I was really only highlighting that we have a dreadful record against Spurs. I actually agree with you that we play better against the better sides.
To be fair I'm not usually one of the 'woe is me' brigade as you put it, but thanks for lumping in with them – I've certainly been called worse on here!
270 Posted 30/10/2019 at 16:42:08
As for Mark Hughes, that has to be a wind-up – even Kenwright isn't that desperate???
271 Posted 30/10/2019 at 16:48:46
Unless after flack about Moyes never getting Preston promoted before he came here, Blue Bill is thinking "Wait a minute, Mark Hughes has a great record for moving teams between divisions, QPR, Stoke, almost Soton. He'd be perfect."
272 Posted 30/10/2019 at 16:50:26
A question for all.
Formation; 4-3-3 (Silva's choice)
4-4-2 (two strikers, two wingers)
5-3-2 (three central, two wing backs)
4-1-4-1 (the Moyes way)
3-5-2 (pack the middle of the park)
Should we play our best 11 to a format that suits their talent Or pick a formation and shoehorn the players available.
Before you start I know most of you think Silva plays 4-2-3-1. My take is he plays 4-3-3 in his mind and the players play 2-7-1.
My preference for those of you that want to know. 4 at the back. 2 up front and adapt the midfield to outwit the opponent. E.g. more attacking against the weaker teams. More combative against teams who are more possession based.
I don't believe in one way fits all against every opponent.
273 Posted 30/10/2019 at 16:58:07
MARK FUCKING HUGHES??
Hahahahahahah Hahahahahahah Hahahahahahah Hahahahahahah.
Fuck off will yer!!
274 Posted 30/10/2019 at 17:01:11
We have no-one who can take it through the middle, so it always ends up going out wide, which is fine if we have a centre-forward who can attack the ball in the box, but we don't.
275 Posted 30/10/2019 at 17:02:48
276 Posted 30/10/2019 at 17:05:10
277 Posted 30/10/2019 at 17:07:40
278 Posted 30/10/2019 at 17:13:00
279 Posted 30/10/2019 at 17:13:55
I'd prefer to have 4-3-3 be our "baseline" and adjust as necessary. The one certainty IMO is to have at minimum 2 forwards who are tasked with doing nothing else than creating havoc in the area, and getting into space to receive the ball & put it on goal.
Brian @274, we have a centre-forward who can do that, he's just not being played there.
280 Posted 30/10/2019 at 17:15:12
281 Posted 30/10/2019 at 17:24:48
I think Calvert-Lewin does two things well for Silva. He runs the hard yards (away games) and he can have an impact as sub late on in games.
Tosun needs a strike partner and Kean needs the play to be quicker for him to find space in behind.
On another note: MARK HUGHES!!!!
No, no and no.
282 Posted 30/10/2019 at 17:27:37
Putting this run of form on his shoulders has to be the most stupid shout from an Evertonian I have ever heard.
Calvert-Lewin struggles when he starts games. Kean is off at the moment and let's see him learn the physical and mental side of playing against international defenders most weeks.
However well he did at Juve, they sold him. The kid needs a lot of time and if that wasn't obvious there is serious need for a reality check.
283 Posted 30/10/2019 at 17:31:53
284 Posted 30/10/2019 at 17:49:59
 Regarding performance, how would you react if the headline was, "Scintillating Everton lose 2-0 to struggling Watford in the Carabao Cup?
 How would you react if Yerri Mina had been rested and Michael Keane had conceded an own goal? Would you be castigating the manager over his team selection?
 How would you react if Marco Silva posted, "Some clowns have the nerve to question my team selections, formations and tactics?" As they say."Hindsight is a wonderful thing".
285 Posted 30/10/2019 at 18:05:41
286 Posted 30/10/2019 at 18:06:24
Dont worry Bill and Denise will sort Franny out, pay his fine off and give him a raise.
287 Posted 30/10/2019 at 18:10:02
I found what I did quite refreshing and certainly opened my eyes to realize that there are many loyal Blues who have many very different perspectives on how a game is perceived. There were also many solid useful comments on what is right or wrong with the club, the players, the management, tactics, strategies etc etc.
I felt that responses to posts were enlightening, sometimes erratic but always from the heart. We all see things from a different perspective. Whatever any supporter states is always worth considering. It may incur your disagreement,but we always need to remember that they only made their statement or analysis because they really believe what they had to say was valid.
Nobody should be beyond getting a critical response.It does mean that at least one person considered your opinion worthy of debate,and between fellow Evertonians we should expect honest criticism.I don't think personal insults and negative suggestions, such as getting a brain transplant or consider having your eyes examined, should ever be acceptable unless directed toward the latest bad Ref or the RS. Insults to the RS don't have any limits.
I am of the older generation, but young or old should not make too much difference. I have been around long enough to have seen us win trophies and for that I am lucky. While the basic game has not really changed that much,tactics,strategies and fitness have and young supporters probably have much fresher ideas than I do. I last played in the old CYMS league. The high point of my game was to be able to get off at half time for a smoke. Roy Vernon set that example in the early 60's.
Whatever you think and from wherever you are your point is always valid. It doesn't matter whether you are boy or girl, young or old, you must be an Evertonian to post on TW. If,for some reason, you are not of "Blue" persuasion then just vanish into the darkness.
288 Posted 30/10/2019 at 18:15:10
You are right to point out the negativity after a decent win but there was a lot to criticise.
Team selection and tactics in the first half were confusing, to say the least.
I thought when he put Kean, Calvert-Lewin and Richarlison out, we were going gung-ho with a 4-3-3 but we played an out-of-sorts 4-2-3-1 in a first half that effectively took Richarlison and Kean out of the game. One shot on goal sums that up and for me that is not the Everton I have grown up with.
Granted, he sorted it out for the second half... but again, bear in mind, we were largely playing Watford reserves whose remit appeared to be "Don't win the game but try and hold out for penalties."
289 Posted 30/10/2019 at 18:31:55
290 Posted 30/10/2019 at 18:40:24
Lets pray for a home draw v Oxford or Colchester, or at least a home draw.
But as Ive said before we have a collection of players and I dont see the spirit, the gelling, fight and consistency that creates a team.
Spurs will take heart, but at this time they have their own challenges, but so do Everton.
291 Posted 30/10/2019 at 18:44:39
After all we are all Evertonians…………….
Aren't we ?
292 Posted 30/10/2019 at 18:47:54
293 Posted 30/10/2019 at 18:51:59
I too was puzzled when Kean was operating at outside right. I expected him and Calvert-Lewin to form a double-pronged strike partnership. I wasn't referring to last night's game in particular, I was referring to the general attitude of some ToffeeWeb posters, whether Everton win lose or draw.
 Maybe I'm 'old school' in thinking that the one game you can't afford to lose is a Cup tie. League points can be enhanced, Cup defeats are terminal.
 I truly believe that, if as I described in my hypothetical incident of a Michael Keane own goal, the outcry, in my opinion, would have been "Why wasn't Yerry Mina selected?"
 Again, I may be old-school, but I consider describing Marco Silva as "a f**king clown" and the players as "f**king shit" is totally unnecessary.
294 Posted 30/10/2019 at 18:52:09
295 Posted 30/10/2019 at 18:59:28
296 Posted 30/10/2019 at 19:02:02
297 Posted 30/10/2019 at 19:08:37
Youve let the negativity of ToffeeWeb posters get to you then. Get back to being a ‘happy clapper ASAP. 😀
298 Posted 30/10/2019 at 19:16:38
Stoke got relegated because they stuck with Hughes for far too long. Then he "saved" Southampton because they were marginally less terrible than the three teams that went down, but they couldn't sack him fast enough after a predictably wretched start the following season.
Hughes. Lord have mercy.
299 Posted 30/10/2019 at 19:27:12
Or would he ?
300 Posted 30/10/2019 at 19:37:56
Derek, I saw Hughes was as high as 5:1! Not being a bettor, is this a reputable site? Link
301 Posted 30/10/2019 at 19:38:51
302 Posted 30/10/2019 at 19:38:55
303 Posted 30/10/2019 at 19:46:13
I would be flabbergasted if Brands swapped Silva for Hughes.
I'm also surprised at the amount of negatitivity on here after a win. The performance may not have been great but I'll take an Everton win where I can this season.
As awful as it has been this season we are in the quarter-finals of a cup and only 3 points off 7th.
I'm hoping that we actually find it easier against some of the 'better' teams as we seem to be at our best when teams come at us and there is space to play in behind them. Teams that sit back, like Watford last night, seem to cause total meltdown in our ranks!
304 Posted 30/10/2019 at 19:52:11
305 Posted 30/10/2019 at 19:54:45
Us species should know our place!
306 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:01:21
307 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:03:15
Sunderland haven't asked Moyes back and they are worse than when he was there and told them they were relegation fodder. But Everton, well we should be happy with these guys.
In a famous (to Evertonians anyway) interview in the '60s Sir John Moores wasn't happy with 5th place (please correct me if I'm out on the place) and said ‘Something should be done - and something WILL be done.' Wasn't it just!
This club had great standing in those days, well earned over the years. It's so hard to accept what we are today, but it's a tribute to fellow Blues who show up in numbers week in and week out, especially those who give such great away support.
Our club may no longer be what it was but our support in these times is absolutely incredible and that is something Evertonians can rightly be proud of. Wouldn't it be great if the club showed the ambition of the fans? Ah well...
308 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:16:05
309 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:18:21
310 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:28:24
311 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:29:22
Al least another three Premier League sides will go tonight, so we should really be taking this seriously. I know we the fans do, but I mean the Everton We!
312 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:33:04
313 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:33:41
314 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:33:41
At 8:45 a.m. tomorrow on Radio Two's Zoe Ball Show.
315 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:36:23
316 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:42:45
-former player will surely galvanize the supporters
-has been the right-hand man & understudy to the best manager in the world
-would almost certainly play a similar style to City or at least one that complements the direction our roster is heading
-has never managed at any level
-can't think of too many asst. coaches that successfully became the top dogs
I may, or may not have asked this already, sorry if I did. My memory isn't all that good anymore lol
317 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:46:15
318 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:51:52
319 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:53:07
320 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:54:16
Ultimately it is the quality of the players which determines the style a manager can successfully adopt. With our current squad, Arteta would not be able turn us into another version of Man City.
Parachuting a coach with no previous management experience into the club in the middle of the season is a recipe for failure. A few defeats would soon see the fans calling for his head. If we were to go down that road the time to do it would be in the summer when new blood can be more easily recruited.
321 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:55:04
322 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:55:57
Come on, Pat, where did you hear that!
323 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:57:07
I kid, I kid.
Do either of you have a top choice? Have you looked into Marcelino or maybe even Simeone at all?
324 Posted 30/10/2019 at 20:59:49
A proven loser, unpopular with fans. Sounds perfect.
325 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:02:40
326 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:03:08
327 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:06:10
328 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:10:58
329 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:12:48
Simeone is the highest paid in Europe, over £20m a season with Champions League footy laid on, he's not coming here.
I was told today that Alan Pardew and Iain Dowie were seen in Starbucks in discussion with Moshiri. Start the rumour!!
330 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:13:10
331 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:14:32
332 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:15:28
333 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:15:47
That would seriously warn Europe's elite that Everton are back!
334 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:18:32
Meanwhile, anyone see Big Sam's comments the other day on talkSPORT?
When asked: "Who do you get if Silva goes!?”
“When I got the job I thought I'd keep it for a long period of time. If you don't get stability it will be very difficult to bring success to Everton no matter how much you spend.”
Rather surprised at that if I'm honest.
335 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:21:46
336 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:22:15
337 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:22:24
338 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:24:41
339 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:26:37
340 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:28:36
341 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:37:34
342 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:41:00
343 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:42:59
344 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:44:43
The Anfield game was a joke and Arsenal's defence has been a joke for a long time, even before today's weakened team selections.
Everton's is pretty much the same, sad to say.
345 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:46:07
I dont see the fight, the desire to fight, even in this dire slump, from this team.
Its scary, considering the fixtures coming up.
346 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:51:39
347 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:52:05
348 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:55:33
349 Posted 30/10/2019 at 21:57:47
We have a chance against any team left. With the exception of Leicester, the rest of them are playing weakened teams.
350 Posted 30/10/2019 at 22:05:49
Carabao Cup rules 2019-20 section 3.41 Scheduling Conflicts.
"In the event of a scheduling conflict involving a knockout game and a FIFA sanctioned tournament, the team involved must field the best available squad comprised of Under-23 players. If the team in question is one of two Premier League clubs based in the same North-Western coastal city, their opponent will be expelled from the competition unless they have previously won at least ten league titles and or participated in the UEFA club competitions during the 1985-86 season. The affected team will also be deducted 25 league points and will have to replace their current manager with Mark Hughes."
351 Posted 30/10/2019 at 22:10:00
352 Posted 30/10/2019 at 22:11:43
353 Posted 30/10/2019 at 22:16:05
354 Posted 30/10/2019 at 22:26:12
Think about last few games last season when we took on the big boys. Win or lose, at least we attacked them with a plan to win vs a plan to not lose more than 2 goals and think mission accomplished.
Also, think of the players Silva can attract like Richarlison and Bernard. Effective or not, at least it's good to watch.
Not Big Sam please...
355 Posted 30/10/2019 at 22:43:10
356 Posted 30/10/2019 at 22:59:41
357 Posted 30/10/2019 at 23:00:57
358 Posted 30/10/2019 at 23:12:51
359 Posted 31/10/2019 at 00:28:21
The so-called lesser teams wouldn't have got this far, if they were useless – a bit like our manager, sorry couldn't resist!
360 Posted 31/10/2019 at 00:42:07
I'll see myself out.
361 Posted 31/10/2019 at 00:44:23
While I appreciate that Chelsea (currently) have a Transfer Ban, although they have a massive squad of talented players, so not exactly on the bare bones, as it were, he is not averse to blooding youngsters, who I must add have never let him down.
Why can't this clown we have in charge, at least 'risk' one or two, of our talented youngsters? They couldn't perform any worse than some of the so-called senior players.
363 Posted 31/10/2019 at 09:28:51
364 Posted 31/10/2019 at 09:38:55
365 Posted 31/10/2019 at 10:07:14
Wouldn't it be brilliant to beat Liverpool in a double header in the semi? "Nurse..."
368 Posted 31/10/2019 at 10:49:35
Where Leicester finished last season is of little consequence. This season, our respective form is poles apart and – unless we pull our socks up, or Leicester do not take it seriously – we will be toast.
369 Posted 31/10/2019 at 12:03:07
By contrast, we have:
away Man Utd
I mean...come on! 🤬
370 Posted 31/10/2019 at 12:35:09
They may have finished below us last season but they're a different prospect now with Rogers as opposed to Puel.
371 Posted 31/10/2019 at 13:03:05
372 Posted 31/10/2019 at 13:09:02
373 Posted 31/10/2019 at 13:53:04
Our main issue for several years has been appalling away results. That is a clear pattern that hasn't changed. The only way it can change is the right mental approach to away games.
The Leicester game in the Carabao Cup is at home, so this issue doesn't really exist. Our home form has generally been very good over the last few years. So good that if our away form were similar we'd finish regularly in the top-4.
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